Atomic CLR = Sonic bliss !!! In depth review

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Let's say high fidelity is desired, but gig-volume isn't really needed. Are the CLRs still the most cost-efficient-choice under those circumstances?

For a reference quality monitor yes no doubt - and even for home use I'd prefer them.
But you can get good studiomonitors like flyingfadr says cheaper on the used market.
 
If there's a particular color that pleases you, you might want to paint your pictures on a canvas that already has a hint of that color. Then quasi-FRFR is right for you.

If you trust your paints and your color-mixing ability, you'll want to paint on a canvas that's as white and neutral as possible. Then you're a FRFR guy.

Rex, that's a pretty good way of looking at things.

To build on what you've said, I suggest that the other requirement for quasi-FRFR to be effective is that it be your only source of sound. That is to say, it's effective when used as a backline (i.e. no Axe-FX direct feed to FOH) or in a home studio where it provides all your guitar sound.

This brings up an important concept, and perhaps another new term we can adopt. . . "patch portability". A significant advantage to using FRFR is portability of tone. To build on your colour analogy, there are tools and standards used in printing and photography that are designed to ensure consistency of colour. Monitors are calibrated so that my green and your green are the same. Printers are profiled so that the yellow sun on my screen prints with the same shade of yellow. Pantone has an extensive catalog of colors that are named and specifically defined. This is all about portability. When a company selects a colour for their logo they can be confident that it will look, for all intents and purposes, the same in an annual report as on a billboard.

Patch portability is all about ensuring, within reason, that the sound I spend hours crafting in my studio is the same sound the crowd hears through the FOH at Friday night's venue. The way to do it is to develop that sound on a calibrated system. A good studio monitor in a properly treated room is one (common) calibrated system. If my Friday night gig is played in a decent room with good speakers, EQ'd to accommodate anomalies, then my tone should translate reasonably well. If I monitor my playing on-stage using a CLR, or another high quality FRFR system, then my tones will be essentially the same. Maybe I decide to switch to in-ears along the way. If I pick up reference quality in-ears, I'll be good-to-go. The key to this working, and to patch portability, is starting with tones crafted on a reference system.

But real life is not like that, you say! No, a lot of venues and their FOH installations are less than ideal. Or, one set of in-ears may sound different than the next. One key to success in an imperfect world is to limit the number of variables. If I develop my tones on a truly neutral, reference system, then the only equalization required is what's necessary to account for the difference in that venue. However, if I've developed my tone on a quasi-FRFR system I have TWO sets of equalization's to do. One to account for the imperfections in the venue and a second to dial in whatever "colour" my quasi-FRFR system has imparted. The chances are good that dialing in that quasi-FRFR "colour" will be complex. Just think about how complex a speaker IR has to be to capture the colour of your favourite monitor. Have you ever tried using EQ to simulate a speaker IR?

So. . . I can see situations where quasi-FRFR can be desirable. The key IMHO, is understanding the limitations of that approach, and using quasi-FRFR wisely (i.e. within these limitations). FRFR solutions on the other hand IMHO, do not suffer from these limitations and as such, produce better results across multiple venues and output devices, with less effort.

Terry.
 
Hi James, I have done some research as I am looking to pole mount a pair of CLRs at 45LBS each. A D.J. named Mike Ryan, invented these Gas powered-neutral buoyancy stands and previously sold them through Ultimate as the Ultimate-Support-TS-100B. The Ultimate Co. was sold and they cheapened the Prod so he started his own company
No more pinching your hands or hurting your back before you play. As of 2013, there are 3 different weight versions, F-1, F-2, and F-3 to achieve neutral buoyancy with different weight speakers, improved mechanics so they don't open in the bag or accidentally, new steel alum alloy for lighter weight / strength and bigger brake pads than the Ultimate stand ! HERE IS VIDEO Frankenstand Web Video - YouTube .
He reminds me of Cliff, as he invented it, he constantly upgrades it (UPGRADE VID NEW Frankenstand Overtightening Fix - YouTube ), and you can actually contact him. I just did, he was on his way to a gig, cool guy. Call Mike and speak with him and tell him I sent you, but remember he works on weekends... 1-619-223-7587... if he doesn't answer use the email info@frankenstand.com
Sorry, I gotta ask — four identically-worded posts in four different threads over the last two months — are you connected to this company?
 
Hi James, I have done some research as I am looking to pole mount a pair of CLRs at 45LBS each. A D.J. named Mike Ryan, invented these Gas powered-neutral buoyancy stands and previously sold them through Ultimate as the Ultimate-Support-TS-100B. The Ultimate Co. was sold and they cheapened the Prod so he started his own company
No more pinching your hands or hurting your back before you play. As of 2013, there are 3 different weight versions, F-1, F-2, and F-3 to achieve neutral buoyancy with different weight speakers, improved mechanics so they don't open in the bag or accidentally, new steel alum alloy for lighter weight / strength and bigger brake pads than the Ultimate stand ! HERE IS VIDEO Frankenstand Web Video - YouTube .
He reminds me of Cliff, as he invented it, he constantly upgrades it (UPGRADE VID NEW Frankenstand Overtightening Fix - YouTube ), and you can actually contact him. I just did, he was on his way to a gig, cool guy. Call Mike and speak with him and tell him I sent you, but remember he works on weekends... 1-619-223-7587... if he doesn't answer use the email info@frankenstand.com
Thanks for the advice. As I live in UK or will be easier to pick up a cheaper and simpler option for me. Thanks though
J
 
... I suggest that the other requirement for quasi-FRFR to be effective is that it be your only source of sound. That is to say, it's effective when used as a backline (i.e. no Axe-FX direct feed to FOH) or in a home studio where it provides all your guitar sound.
I get where you're going with this, and I agree with it to a large extent. But not completely.

If the sound of a quasi-FRFR sytem inspires you, that can come out in your playing in a way that can translate well even direct to FOH, whether the tone matches your monitor or not. But it does throw an added curve at you when you're dialing things in. As for me, I prefer to live my life without that added curve, and I'll go as FRFR as I can find.


...a lot of venues and their FOH installations are less than ideal. Or, one set of in-ears may sound different than the next. One key to success in an imperfect world is to limit the number of variables. If I develop my tones on a truly neutral, reference system, then the only equalization required is what's necessary to account for the difference in that venue. However, if I've developed my tone on a quasi-FRFR system I have TWO sets of equalization's to do. One to account for the imperfections in the venue and a second to dial in whatever "colour" my quasi-FRFR system has imparted. The chances are good that dialing in that quasi-FRFR "colour" will be complex. Just think about how complex a speaker IR has to be to capture the colour of your favourite monitor. Have you ever tried using EQ to simulate a speaker IR?
+1.
 
Sorry, I gotta ask — four identically-worded posts in four different threads over the last two months — are you connected to this company?
Nah, I hate to type. LOL. so I copy/paste if the situation question requires the same answer.
 
Hi James, I have done some research as I am looking to pole mount a pair of CLRs at 45LBS each. A D.J. named Mike Ryan, invented these Gas powered-neutral buoyancy stands and previously sold them through Ultimate as the Ultimate-Support-TS-100B. The Ultimate Co. was sold and they cheapened the Prod so he started his own company
No more pinching your hands or hurting your back before you play. As of 2013, there are 3 different weight versions, F-1, F-2, and F-3 to achieve neutral buoyancy with different weight speakers, improved mechanics so they don't open in the bag or accidentally, new steel alum alloy for lighter weight / strength and bigger brake pads than the Ultimate stand ! HERE IS VIDEO Frankenstand Web Video - YouTube .
He reminds me of Cliff, as he invented it, he constantly upgrades it (UPGRADE VID NEW Frankenstand Overtightening Fix - YouTube ), and you can actually contact him. I just did, he was on his way to a gig, cool guy. Call Mike and speak with him and tell him I sent you, but remember he works on weekends... 1-619-223-7587... if he doesn't answer use the email info@frankenstand.com

Thanks due to you Klaushouz for this. I'm ordered a set of these for less money even with the postage from the USofA than for a less impressive looking equivilant from the mighty Thomann. (Hint: special deal for YouRowPeons.)

Please Note: to save further off-topic correspondence on this subject, I have no connections with this company apart from having emailed the good Doctor last night.
 
Pwnd! Also most forumites without an agenda wouldn't bother looking up and posting the telephone number and email adress.
Hi Ned,
on the rare chance, that I come across a superior product made by small business entrepreneurs like Tom (of Atomic), Cliff (among others) and now Mike of Frankenstands , I get excited to share the news of small USA based companys succeeding. Not to feed the stereotype , but as a musician, I have come to terms with the fact that.. I am lazy. If it is not right in front of me OR at best one google away, I probably won't bother. Plus keeping up with 3 to 5 forums can be tedious.
So to make it easy for others like me, I include all contact info and video info. Then it is back to being a sloth until the sun goes down at least! LOL
 
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