No Smoothing???

steadystate said:
I'd want to audition it first. Maybe I'm misunderstanding the scratchpad. I've never used it. A direct save certainly works.
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The scratchpad is just a set of user IRs that won’t survive a reboot. They give you a place to experiment without eating up your user IR slots.
 
Rex said:
The scratchpad is just a set of user IRs that won’t survive a reboot. They give you a place to experiment without eating up your user IR slots.
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That's what I thought. I've always just used the user slots, then overwritten them when I come up with something better.
 
Is CabLab3 still purchaseable? It had a Smoothing function IIRC. Could make smoothed copies of the needed IRs. Probly some other sofware out there that can do it as well....
 
Patzag said:
It's true that there are many IRs I find useless as they are, but they take on a very usable character when smoothed.
I also smooth a lot of my own captures. It eliminates weird phasing artifacts and more closely approximates the sound being captured.
+1 for smoothing!
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I agree 100%; the "Smoothing" parameter indeed made almost every "conventional" IR I used to use palatable and useful. So many are just a "phasey mess" to my ears and I cannot use them. "Smoothing" whipped many into shape, definitely.

The lack of a "Smoothing" parameter on the FM3/FM9 is what sent me down the road to explore "unconventional" methods; procedurally generated IR's (IRWorkshop: which had smoothing and I leaned on that a lot) and I'm now using Filter/GEQ/PEQ blocks for a "cab" ala:

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/amp-in-the-room.141579/

I've gotten things dialed in with that method over the last several months and absolutely love how much control I have over the "cab" and that there is no phasing of any kind.

When I go back to older presets and/or explore conventional IR's I find my EQ-cab so much more satisfying.

But yea, if you could "bake" smoothing into an IR (via Cab Lab 4) if the unit cannot process that in real time that would be incredibly useful for sure.
 
Stratoblaster said:
I agree 100%; the "Smoothing" parameter indeed made almost every "conventional" IR I used to use palatable and useful. So many are just a "phasey mess" to my ears and I cannot use them. "Smoothing" whipped many into shape, definitely.

The lack of a "Smoothing" parameter on the FM3/FM9 is what sent me down the road to explore "unconventional" methods; procedurally generated IR's (IRWorkshop: which had smoothing and I leaned on that a lot) and I'm now using Filter/GEQ/PEQ blocks for a "cab" ala:

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/amp-in-the-room.141579/

I've gotten things dialed in with that method over the last several months and absolutely love how much control I have over the "cab" and that there is no phasing of any kind.

When I go back to older presets and/or explore conventional IR's I find my EQ-cab so much more satisfying.

But yea, if you could "bake" smoothing into an IR (via Cab Lab 4) if the unit cannot process that in real time that would be incredibly useful for sure.
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I used high-order lowpass filters with graphic eq (hardware) with my gear before I found Fractal. IR gear wasn't available yet. I find the technique very flat and bland sounding. Then, with the II before De-Phase was available, I blended plain filter/eq blocks or a Palmer IR in with an IR that had the "character" I was looking for, but was too colored. De-Phase (now Smoothing) is the PERFECT solution. So much so that I can't go back to not having it.
 
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steadystate said:
I used high-order lowpass filters with graphic eq (hardware) with my gear before I found Fractal. IR gear wasn't available yet. I find the technique very flat and bland sounding. Then, with the II before De-Phase was available, I blended plain filter/eq blocks or a Palmer IR in with an IR that had the "character" I was looking for, but was too colored. De-Phase (now Smoothing) is the PERFECT solution. So much so that I can't go back to not having it.
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Yea, I hear you there, using EQ's, etc. can definitely be bland and sterile sounding but with the fine tuning and the various EQ options in the FM9 I'm able to get a result that's really working for me. I find the tones punchy and lively, moreso after the latest firmware upgrade.

I also started revisting the concept of "cab sim EQ's" (Capt. Obvious: which have been around for decades..lol) after I watched a live Rush BluRay. Alex's guitar tone was very detailed, forward, and had a unique overall character to it that I pondered throughout the concert. I was really loving his guitar sound...and it just didn't sound like a "miced cab"...hmmmmm....

When I investigated his rig setup for that tour he was using amps into the Palmer load boxes then to FOH...ahhhhh interesting indeed.

What's also very interesting is that, in the FM3/9/III, you can shape a "speaker" with granular EQ options but the icing on the cake here that all of the critical speaker/power amp interactions are modeled separately so there is a rich playground here.

You get the best of all worlds, with the frequency shaping and the electrical interactions separated into component "modules".

But yea, I do get why you cannot live without that control...smoothing really does make so many IR's sound more natural, no doubt.
 
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steadystate said:
The Palmer does sound good for that type of device. Better than the Red Box. But it's hard to match guitar tones on various recordings using it.
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I loved my Red Box Mk II. Sound guy at the AZ State Fair 30 years ago killed it. I specifically told him not to send Phantom Power to it, because it was powered from my rack rig.

You get three guesses as to what he did....
 
Joe Bfstplk said:
Is CabLab3 still purchaseable? It had a Smoothing function IIRC. Could make smoothed copies of the needed IRs. Probly some other sofware out there that can do it as well....
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I bought CabLab 3 a while back. I gave up on it because of constant iLok problems. But I'm going to give it another go. I'm going to try everything I possibly can to see which process is the least painful. I want the FM9 to work for me. Badly. But nothing beats turning a knob. You could turn the Smoothing knob 1,000 times in the time it takes to do it any other way.

And I really need to sell my III to justify buying the FM9. But without the III, I have no way of dialing in smoothing in real time when creating new presets. That's a problem. It becomes an economics issue.
 
Hmm.... Neither the FM3, FM9, nor CabLab 4 have it. CabLab 3 no longer available. C&D letters received regarding the III. Cliff silent. It may not be a technical hurdle. Can't jump to conclusions one way or the other.
 
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Yeah. Since it's still there, I'm pretty sure Cliff was not too worried about that C&D.

I'd love to have smoothing in the FM9. But I still love the FM9 even without!
 
So far, the least painful method I've found for Smoothed IRs on the FM9:

Use my Axe III's Synth block (white noise) as input to the desired cab (with Smoothing) and subsequent Tone Match block. Capture the Tone Match and export it. Import into the FM9. PITA compared to turning a knob, especially if you have to do it hundreds of times.

Anyone have a better suggestion? I'm trying to find solutions with what I do have rather than focus on what I don't have.
 
Smoothing was essential to me when I had an FX3, the "phasey" or "airey" sound most IRs have to my ears makes it difficult to create tones that are enjoyable for me to play, regardless of how good they sound in my mixes. I'll admit I use my FM3 a bit less these days without it, and I wish I had double-checked, but I genuinely didn't expect the FX3 to be the only model to have that parameter, since I wouldn't have guessed it to be something that's too CPU heavy to include.

I hope it's added to the FM3/FM9 sometime soon, it seems it's a very important feature to many people.
 
steadystate said:
So far, the least painful method I've found for Smoothed IRs on the FM9:

Use my Axe III's Synth block (white noise) as input to the desired cab (with Smoothing) and subsequent Tone Match block. Capture the Tone Match and export it. Import into the FM9. PITA compared to turning a knob, especially if you have to do it hundreds of times.

Anyone have a better suggestion? I'm trying to find solutions with what I do have rather than focus on what I don't have.
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That's what I do
 
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