The Deadly Dual Amp Thread

[Dr. Faustus]

I have an opinion on this that I wish to share just for thought:

In my experience you do get absolutely amazing stereo separation by introducing a delay between L/R. If you are sitting right between the speakers or wearing headphones so the two sides are balanced, it sounds glorious.
Where I ran into problems with the technique is any time the soundstage changes due to being outside of the sweet zone. In that case it presents as a doubler, or worse, as a comb-filter.
Although that delay sounds great when it reaches each ear separately, it can turn your tight sound into mush when heard in mono. I achieve those spatial goals by panning actual preamp signals and cabinets hard L/R, using two different amps/preamps, or EQ changes, or gain changes. Things that introduce character differences to spread out the image without introducing any time delays.

YMMV

 

[Bman]

I have an opinion on this that I wish to share just for thought:

In my experience you do get absolutely amazing stereo separation by introducing a delay between L/R. If you are sitting right between the speakers or wearing headphones so the two sides are balanced, it sounds glorious.
Where I ran into problems with the technique is any time the soundstage changes due to being outside of the sweet zone. In that case it presents as a doubler, or worse, as a comb-filter.
Although that delay sounds great when it reaches each ear separately, it can turn your tight sound into mush when heard in mono. I achieve those spatial goals by panning actual preamp signals and cabinets hard L/R, using two different amps/preamps, or EQ changes, or gain changes. Things that introduce character differences to spread out the image without introducing any time delays.

YMMV

This makes total sense to me. Rick Beato said that he often has the guitarist track their 2nd track with the addition of a distortion or boost pedal so the 2nd track has a different EQ. I plan to give this a try. At home, I like playing mono because I only have one Xitone cab. I've experimented with delaying the 2nd signal and/or modulating it slightly but it always ends up sounding like a tin can. I've got two DXR-10's and I guess I could get really elaborate if I wanted, but I typically use a 2nd delay to send to those and it really fills the room.
I'm trying to get a wet/dry/wet out of the single Xitone knowing that it just doesn't work that way. But then I'll send a song or isolated tract (I'm chasing the 5150 album to complete my Eddie Preset) to the Xitone and to me it sounds separated. The wet/dry/wet or his Eventide's signal separation comes thru in mono. Of course this is subjective to my ears.

Man, I love this Fractal box. Inflation is hitting hard and I'm selling my Les Paul to cope. No way I'm selling the Fractal box though. I told my wife the other day that if there was a fire in the office/studio above the garage 'that box' is the one thing she has to grab.

 

[Nik73]

I do have a Tyler Grund SRV preset that I created (by watching his videos on how to) that gets me close to SRV. It's a dual amp preset. Wonder that that guy is up to nowadays?

Hey man, yeah good call thats what i do to dual amps aswell settings wise.
Yeah the Tyler Grund SRV video was awesome got me looking into the AxeFX at that time he posted it.
I made some more SRV presets afterwards, Dumbles with Super Reverb/Vibroverbs is phenomenal^^

Thanks very much both for reminding me about that video. I watched it a few years ago, but never got round to trying anything. Had some fun today dialling a preset in with some YA Princeton IRs.
Don't get me wrong, I think his preset sounds great with the AFX2, but good lord you can hear the difference dialling it in on the III. Oooof.

 

[Bman]

Thanks very much both for reminding me about that video. I watched it a few years ago, but never got round to trying anything. Had some fun today dialling a preset in with some YA Princeton IRs.
Don't get me wrong, I think his preset sounds great with the AFX2, but good lord you can hear the difference dialling it in on the III. Oooof.

I’m looking for an IR for that preset. The JBL works but it sounds ‘narrow’. I’ve tinkered trying to make the sound ‘wider or fuller’ but it usually introduces more distortion or fuzz. You say the Princeton IR from YA? Any suggestions on some factory IRs ?

 

[jrayjr]

I’m looking for an IR for that preset. The JBL works but it sounds ‘narrow’. I’ve tinkered trying to make the sound ‘wider or fuller’ but it usually introduces more distortion or fuzz. You say the Princeton IR from YA? Any suggestions on some factory IRs ?

i really dig the evml/rumble 12l/s with it, my definition of full in these clean / srv settings

 

[FarleyUK]

I have an opinion on this that I wish to share just for thought:

In my experience you do get absolutely amazing stereo separation by introducing a delay between L/R. If you are sitting right between the speakers or wearing headphones so the two sides are balanced, it sounds glorious.
Where I ran into problems with the technique is any time the soundstage changes due to being outside of the sweet zone. In that case it presents as a doubler, or worse, as a comb-filter.
Although that delay sounds great when it reaches each ear separately, it can turn your tight sound into mush when heard in mono. I achieve those spatial goals by panning actual preamp signals and cabinets hard L/R, using two different amps/preamps, or EQ changes, or gain changes. Things that introduce character differences to spread out the image without introducing any time delays.

YMMV

That's a great point - I think I might remove the delay and set each side to be +80 and -80 with the balance instead. I also have the concern that everyone else in the band uses mono monitoring, so at least this way I'm hoping it'll also be better for them.

 

[Harm]

Thanks very much both for reminding me about that video. I watched it a few years ago, but never got round to trying anything. Had some fun today dialling a preset in with some YA Princeton IRs.
Don't get me wrong, I think his preset sounds great with the AFX2, but good lord you can hear the difference dialling it in on the III. Oooof.

If you would like to share that preset Id be grateful. I have been chasing his tone for quite some time now. I am very close but missing some body in the sound. Can’t figure it out. I have 2 vibroverbs in the preset now. Maybe your dumble will do the trick.

 

[Nik73]

If you would like to share that preset Id be grateful. I have been chasing his tone for quite some time now. I am very close but missing some body in the sound. Can’t figure it out. I have 2 vibroverbs in the preset now. Maybe your dumble will do the trick.

I just followed the video and used two vibroverbs in mine tuning for my guitar, but didn’t bother with the more in depth tweaks or cab settings.
I’ve said it numerous times, but the YA audio IRs take presets to the next level for me without any tweaking.

 

[Rock Chalk]

If you would like to share that preset Id be grateful. I have been chasing his tone for quite some time now. I am very close but missing some body in the sound. Can’t figure it out. I have 2 vibroverbs in the preset now. Maybe your dumble will do the trick.

Here’s a thread that @ruso started about that a while back…might help you.
Thread 'SRV Inspired Preset'
https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/srv-inspired-preset.161764/

 

[FusionFanatic]

I made a preset the other day using the AC 30 treble with York 2/12 Alnico Blue and the 50w Plexi with York MRSH M25 mix 1. Sounds very cool. Mix to taste.

 

[WKSmith]

I have a pairing of the dc30 with the dc30 ef 86 that I am completely in love with.

 

[Dave Merrill]

I made a preset the other day using the AC 30 treble with York 2/12 Alnico Blue and the 50w Plexi with York MRSH M25 mix 1. Sounds very cool. Mix to taste.

Sounds right up my alley.

Care to share it? What guitar(s) are you using?

 

[Bman]

If you would like to share that preset Id be grateful. I have been chasing his tone for quite some time now. I am very close but missing some body in the sound. Can’t figure it out. I have 2 vibroverbs in the preset now. Maybe your dumble will do the trick.

Here's my take on Tyler's preset. I downloaded @ruso 's preset and really like the cab combo he used and added it the JBL (user cab). It opened the sound up for me. I exported a bundle (attached) to include the JBL. I believe CAB channel D has the two factory cabs that I used from ruso's preset but without the JBL. Those two by themselves sound really good to my ears. The JBL feels like it adds a touch of headroom but it may just roll off the highs to give me that impression.

I may try mixing in a dumble but right now this gets me close enough to just play.

 

[FusionFanatic]

Sounds right up my alley.

Care to share it? What guitar(s) are you using?

It’s literally a new preset I quickly put together. No scenes or anything but a dash of reverb. I’m gonna check it out again first and make sure I still like it. Again.. I’m using the York Audio IR’s, so you’d have to check it and adjust accordingly.
I think I was using one of my PRS guitars or my heavily modified Tele (with a Duncan hot rails in the bridge) when I made it. You can obviously blend to taste in the amp block.

Yes, I can share it, but not sure if I can/should include the 3rd party IR’s I use. Give me till tomorrow.

 

[Dave Merrill]

It’s literally a new preset I quickly put together. No scenes or anything but a dash of reverb. I’m gonna check it out again first and make sure I still like it. Again.. I’m using the York Audio IR’s, so you’d have to check it and adjust accordingly.
I think I was using one of my PRS guitars or my heavily modified Tele (with a Duncan hot rails in the bridge) when I made it. You can obviously blend to taste in the amp block.

Yes, I can share it, but not sure if I can/should include the 3rd party IR’s I use. Give me till tomorrow.

Don't post commercial IRs, you're right. I have lots from York Audio though, like many people here, so just say exactly which ones you mean.

Of course if you have good factory alternatives, you might as well list them out for folks not so York-endowed.

 

[FusionFanatic]

Sounds right up my alley.

Care to share it? What guitar(s) are you using?

I just realized (besides the 3rd party IR’s I use) that there’s also one other BIG thing I forgot to mention... I stopped firmware updates at 19.02. I’m happy with my tone there. I don’t really need anything else, and I rather not tweak all my presets after all the updates. Those two things (besides your amp and monitor... cab or FRFR) will greatly affect the tone.
Again, the preset with the AC30 mixed with the 50w Marshall was done fast, and I did very little amp block adjustments on the authentic page. It could be a cool mix to try if anyone is into that type of idea.

 

[jrayjr]

I just realized (besides the 3rd party IR’s I use) that there’s also one other BIG thing I forgot to mention... I stopped firmware updates at 19.02. I’m happy with my tone there. I don’t really need anything else, and I rather not tweak all my presets after all the updates. Those two things (besides your amp and monitor... cab or FRFR) will greatly affect the tone.
Again, the preset with the AC30 mixed with the 50w Marshall was done fast, and I did very little amp block adjustments on the authentic page. It could be a cool mix to try if anyone is into that type of idea.

Mate, the new speaker drive and dynamic distortion block are freaking amazing with 20.00, try it some day

 

[FusionFanatic]

Mate, the new speaker drive and dynamic distortion block are freaking amazing with 20.00, try it some day

Yes, I’ve seen the rave on the forum. I’m kinda curious how much ‘better’ everything is... or how much might be the ‘placebo effect’. My guess is a bit of both.

I’ll probably check it out if / when I ever decide to do another a firmware update. I know I can always revert back. Like I said... I’m happy with my tones now, and an update WILL change that, maybe for the better... maybe not. I’ve made 50 presets, most all sound great with most any guitar I play them thru.
I tried 19.03 when it came out. My sound just wasn’t ‘right’ anymore... the next day I reverted back and everything was great again.

That’s the trade off with updates... we want the latest, but most likely we’ll be making adjustments. And when you have a lot of sounds you’re really happy with you need to make a choice. Thanks!

 

[Thomas Obester]

Yes, I’ve seen the rave on the forum. I’m kinda curious how much ‘better’ everything is... or how much might be the ‘placebo effect’. My guess is a bit of both.

I’ll probably check it out if / when I ever decide to do another a firmware update. I know I can always revert back. Like I said... I’m happy with my tones now, and an update WILL change that, maybe for the better... maybe not. I’ve made 50 presets, most all sound great with most any guitar I play them thru.
I tried 19.03 when it came out. My sound just wasn’t ‘right’ anymore... the next day I reverted back and everything was great again.

That’s the trade off with updates... we want the latest, but most likely we’ll be making adjustments. And when you have a lot of sounds you’re really happy with you need to make a choice. Thanks!

exactly my thoughts...I am always behind with updates and until significant change in amp block is being implemented, I stay away, see what the response is and once the bugs are fixed, then I may be more open to update

 

[FarleyUK]

Quick question when using hard panned dual amps....

The rest of my band are only using mono for their IEMs / monitors. If I'm feeding the mixer a stereo signal, they will only hear the left channel in their aux outs.... correct?