The Most Incredible Electric Guitar Sound That I have Ever Heard!

[JJunkie]

dude, it sounds as though you don't have an axe-fx atm, so its hard to explain the effects in detail, especially if you're a guitarist that has only had access to a few knobs on their amp, they just don't sometimes comprehend what possibilities there are. Learning sound engineering stuff and the inticacies of effects without the tools at your disposal is a big challenge. It sounds like you are passionate about achieving good tones with effects, (for which the axe is great) but it also sounds like if you had an axe-fx, your head would simply explode, and you might start working against yourself, with all those possibilities at your fingertips.

The delay effect that you are referring to is really cool, but it isn't exactly something thats cutting-edge or rocket science. It doesn't come naturally to guitarists (when I first got an axe I considered stuf like eq and hi-cut and low-cut were in the realm of sound engineering), but i think after some experience with with the axe, taking out the high frequency content in the delay line just sounds better and makes soloing more clear/legible, as you can hear the difference between the dry notes and delayed notes.

Lucky for us there are plenty of good petrucci preset examples that have been posted in this forum. You should check out the "The best of Times" post by jazzdarkside - awesome and 100% axe-fx

 

[Righteoussound]

Actually, it is beginning to make you look 13 years of age ....... why? why? why?

Only A fool despises knowledge!

 

[Righteoussound]

dude, it sounds as though you don't have an axe-fx atm, so its hard to explain the effects in detail, especially if you're a guitarist that has only had access to a few knobs on their amp, they just don't sometimes comprehend what possibilities there are. Learning sound engineering stuff and the inticacies of effects without the tools at your disposal is a big challenge. It sounds like you are passionate about achieving good tones with effects, (for which the axe is great) but it also sounds like if you had an axe-fx, your head would simply explode, and you might start working against yourself, with all those possibilities at your fingertips.

The delay effect that you are referring to is really cool, but it isn't exactly something thats cutting-edge or rocket science. It doesn't come naturally to guitarists (when I first got an axe I considered stuf like eq and hi-cut and low-cut were in the realm of sound engineering), but i think after some experience with with the axe, taking out the high frequency content in the delay line just sounds better and makes soloing more clear/legible, as you can hear the difference between the dry notes and delayed notes.

Lucky for us there are plenty of good petrucci preset examples that have been posted in this forum. You should check out the "The best of Times" post by jazzdarkside - awesome and 100% axe-fx

Hey JJunkie,

Thank you for your response. I am very passionate about achieving good tone with effects, you are very correct in that observation! I have probably said this half a dozen times and either people just don't comprehend it or believe it, I'll let you be the judge! I think for me Im after the big picture and how it all works together. That's what inspires and motivates me. It's like I said, right now Im not interested in how to program the Axe-Fx, Im interested in the general understanding of everything. Don't get me wrong, i would be all ears if someone wanted to share with me how to program that effect and explain what it's properties are made up of but no one here can even definitively say where the effect even originated.

What I am trying to get to the bottom of with this thread is if that sound effect was created using the Axe-FX or something else. Bakerman said he believes it was probably a plugin another guy said he thought it was all the Axe-Fx. I have tried to get a consensus from everyone as to what the truth is about this but no one seems to want to verify/vouch on it either way. So I guess the conclusion that I can arrive at is none of you really know, is that right?

Is high-cut and low-cut proprietary specific to the Axe-Fx or is that universal terminology and editing practice for all delays across the board?

How does taking out the high frequency content in the delay line make things sound better and make soloing more clear/legible?

 

[Bakerman]

Adjustable high/low cut is common. Almost any stereo delay could be used for this. Set L/R to the times mentioned earlier or similar, adjust level & high cut until the level/tone sounds about right.

 

[JJunkie]

What I am trying to get to the bottom of with this thread is if that sound effect was created using the Axe-FX or something else. Bakerman said he believes it was probably a plugin another guy said he thought it was all the Axe-Fx. I have tried to get a consensus from everyone as to what the truth is about this but no one seems to want to verify/vouch on it either way. So I guess the conclusion that I can arrive at is none of you really know, is that right?

Is high-cut and low-cut proprietary specific to the Axe-Fx or is that universal terminology and editing practice for all delays across the board?

How does taking out the high frequency content in the delay line make things sound better and make soloing more clear/legible?

I reckon its a software plugin. Recording the dry guitar is normal, and it wouldn't make sense to record the dry track, then pass it back through the axe-fx and re-record it again with fx~~ it takes more time to do that because tweaking/auditioning different effect settings would require you to re-record over and over agian. nobody would do that willingly.

high and low cut parameters are used in many DAW plugin effects. low cut is handy when your dry guitar signal has a lot of bass. Reduce the bass in the delay line, so that the delay is not too overpowering. Similar for high cut. If the dry signal high end is harsh, take some of it out in the delay. for lead tones, I often set high cut frequency at around 2.5kHz (whereas a guitar cabinet's frequency range usually drops down at around 6kHz).

Again, its blaringly obvious that you need to start using the tools to learn. There are no excuses, e.g. programming versus big picture... you need to get your hands dirty! I suggest that you should try downloading some DAWs and plugins and actually get into the practical side of things. I dont know what type of setup you have but if you are not able to record your guitar direct to the computer for whatever reason, there is no end to good guitar/vocal/whatever samples on the net or in you cd collection that you can put into a DAW and hit it with a delay plugin and start experimenting~~ I gaurantee you will learn a lot more very quickly.

Adobe Audition has a 30 day trial, and it has a lot of built-in plugins.

Audacity is a free DAW that you can download and keep forever

And there are lots of free effects plugins available on the net too. I typed "free delay vst" into google and my first result was:
http://freevstplugins.blogspot.com/2008/11/free-vst-delay-plugins.html

good luck!

 

[Righteoussound]

I reckon its a software plugin. Recording the dry guitar is normal, and it wouldn't make sense to record the dry track, then pass it back through the axe-fx and re-record it again with fx~~ it takes more time to do that because tweaking/auditioning different effect settings would require you to re-record over and over agian. nobody would do that willingly.

Ok, assuming that your right that this is a plugin, like I had asked earlier, is it possible to take the sound and tone of one sound effect like this one here in this clip:[video]http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/virgildonatidream.html[/video] from 34-1:12, assuming this was created as a plugin and completely recreate/duplicate that same sound through another device or form of technology like the Axe-Fx as the same sound???

My other question would be can you not use the Axe-FX as a plugin?

high and low cut parameters are used in many DAW plugin effects. low cut is handy when your dry guitar signal has a lot of bass. Reduce the bass in the delay line, so that the delay is not too overpowering. Similar for high cut. If the dry signal high end is harsh, take some of it out in the delay. for lead tones, I often set high cut frequency at around 2.5kHz (whereas a guitar cabinet's frequency range usually drops down at around 6kHz).

Wow, thank you! You did a terrific job of explaining this, I totally get it and understand, thank you!

Adobe Audition has a 30 day trial, and it has a lot of built-in plugins.

Audacity is a free DAW that you can download and keep forever

And there are lots of free effects plugins available on the net too. I typed "free delay vst" into google and my first result was:
http://freevstplugins.blogspot.com/2008/11/free-vst-delay-plugins.html

good luck!

Thank you for your suggestion, I will definitely take a look into all this, thank you!

 

[Righteoussound]

Adjustable high/low cut is common. Almost any stereo delay could be used for this. Set L/R to the times mentioned earlier or similar, adjust level & high cut until the level/tone sounds about right.

Thank you very much Bakerman! I greatly appreciate your technical input on this!!!

 

[JJunkie]

"Ok, assuming that your right that this is a plugin, like I had asked earlier, is it possible to take the sound and tone of one sound effect like this one here in this clip:http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/v...natidream.html from 34-1:12, assuming this was created as a plugin and completely recreate/duplicate that same sound through another device or form of technology like the Axe-Fx as the same sound???"

No.... In that video he is using using an axe-fx (not a plugin) in the effects loop of his MK V amp ~~ its basically his live playing setup. He would only use plugins for recording on albums. This has been explained a few times already. There are several other pedals/rack units that could do this for you.

Hopefully, all your questions have been answered now

 

[Righteoussound]

No.... In that video he is using using an axe-fx (not a plugin) in the effects loop of his MK V amp ~~ its basically his live playing setup. He would only use plugins for recording on albums. This has been explained a few times already. There are several other pedals/rack units that could do this for you.

No, you can't take the properties of a sound effect like this one: from 0-36seconds from a source such as a plugin and recreate/duplicate that same sound through another device or form of technology like the Axe-Fx and/or no you can not use the Axe-Fx as a plugin??? Which is it?

There are several other pedals/rack units that could do this for you.

Really, You think there are several other pedals/rack units that could create that same sound effect with the same quality as the one heard in this video:[video]http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/virgildonatidream.html[/video] from 34-1:12 ??? Could you throw some suggestions out here?

 

[Bakerman]

These are all pretty basic stereo delays. Yes, the delays in every clip you've posted could be obtained with a wide variety of plugins/gear. TC Electronic G-Major & G-Major 2 are a couple lower-priced rack units. As JJunkie mentioned you could try some free DAW software/plugins first to get an idea of how different effects parameters change the sound. Reaper is another DAW program w/ fully-functional demo and dozens of effects included.

 

[Righteoussound]

These are all pretty basic stereo delays. Yes, the delays in every clip you've posted could be obtained with a wide variety of plugins/gear. TC Electronic G-Major & G-Major 2 are a couple lower-priced rack units. As JJunkie mentioned you could try some free DAW software/plugins first to get an idea of how different effects parameters change the sound. Reaper is another DAW program w/ fully-functional demo and dozens of effects included.

Hey Bakerman,

Thanks for the reply. You say these are all pretty basic stereo delays but could you be a little more specific in what you mean by basic? One poster on here told me that there was someone that posted a recording with an Ultra a few weeks back of the Breaking All Illusions part that I keep reverting back to in all my posts. In fact here is the video:
Aside from the playing being off quite a bit, although not bad, the sound is way off. Im sorry but if this is what anyone considers to be the same sound they should never consider going into sound engineering because they don't have the ears for it! Now, I commend the person who made this cover attempt but for seriousness sake, I hope this is not the basic stereo delay that you're referring to! Theres a huge gap between that sound and the ones in the two clips. In fact that's the problem Im seeing all over youtube. People doing covers of other peoples songs and usually never getting the sound right! Several people on here have given me advice after advice about how I should stop asking so many questions and just get an amp, an effects unit and a speaker cabinet and just start turning knobs but where has that gotten any of you? Im sorry but I don't here very many of you out here getting sounds like John Petrucci, In fact I can't find but maybe one person on the whole web who has! Your tried and true method to sound is not getting very many of you accurate results and although you may be content with those results there are actually some of us out here in the world who don't want to settle for that! That's why John Petrucci is where he is and you are where you are! Because you fail to ask questions and do your research and therefore remain in the amateur league! For everyone out here who ever wants to argue that it is impossible to sound like someone else and you can never duplicate someone else's sound because you don't have their finger tone please watch: VRA! Split Screen Dream Theater Cover Collaboration - Metropolis Pt. 1 - Korg Oasys - Kurzweil PC3x - YouTube



Sorry for that rabbit trail Bakerman! Now getting back to what I was saying...Oh yeah, nobody seems to want to answer this question but I will ask it again. Is it possible to take the properties of a sound effect like this one here: from 0-36seconds and here:[video]http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/virgildonatidream.html[/video] from 34-1:12 from a source such as a plugin or Axe-FX and recreate/duplicate that same sound through another device or form of technology like the Axe-Fx or a plugin? Can the Axe-Fx be used as a plugin?

 

[JJunkie]

I answered your question already!! I told you that in the drummer world video JP was using an axe-fx, and we already know that for the album, he uses a plugin ... are the blocks falling into place yet? keep thinking..

I think that the work done on those you-tube videos were fantastic, but I am not judging them on how closely they replicated JP's tone, and in most cases, those guys weren't necessarily looking to replicate the same tone, but capture the flavour.

Good luck with your rock star dreams, you certainly have the rock star attitude. I don't mind playing the gopher when someone needs help, but looking at your last post (or pep talk??) (a) you have no respect for us gophers and (b) it sounds like you didn't take up our suggestions anyway.

I'm done with following this thread now. Nobody here can help you any further. There is a massive gap in your understanding where something called FUNDAMENTALS should reside.

 

[Cooper Carter]

Am I the only one tired of seeing this particular thread continually at the top of the Discussion section...?

(Answer: no)

 

[DonPetersen]

Hey Bakerman,

Thanks for the reply. You say these are all pretty basic stereo delays but could you be a little more specific in what you mean by basic? One poster on here told me that there was someone that posted a recording with an Ultra a few weeks back of the Breaking All Illusions part that I keep reverting back to in all my posts. In fact here is the video:
Aside from the playing being off quite a bit, although not bad, the sound is way off. Im sorry but if this is what anyone considers to be the same sound they should never consider going into sound engineering because they don't have the ears for it! Now, I commend the person who made this cover attempt but for seriousness sake, I hope this is not the basic stereo delay that you're referring to! Theres a huge gap between that sound and the ones in the two clips. In fact that's the problem Im seeing all over youtube. People doing covers of other peoples songs and usually never getting the sound right! Several people on here have given me advice after advice about how I should stop asking so many questions and just get an amp, an effects unit and a speaker cabinet and just start turning knobs but where has that gotten any of you? Im sorry but I don't here very many of you out here getting sounds like John Petrucci, In fact I can't find but maybe one person on the whole web who has! Your tried and true method to sound is not getting very many of you accurate results and although you may be content with those results there are actually some of us out here in the world who don't want to settle for that! That's why John Petrucci is where he is and you are where you are! Because you fail to ask questions and do your research and therefore remain in the amateur league! For everyone out here who ever wants to argue that it is impossible to sound like someone else and you can never duplicate someone else's sound because you don't have their finger tone please watch:

nice attitude.

btw. this happens to be the most effective way to keep people in this forum from sharing any information or insights they may have with you.
which is a great loss, you'd be surprised how many professionals are in this forum.
Something, judging by your demeanour, you are obviously quite far from.

Is it possible to take the properties of a sound effect like this one here: from 34-1:12 from a source such as a plugin or Axe-FX and recreate/duplicate that same sound through another device or form of technology like the Axe-Fx or a plugin?

with the AxeFx, yes.

Can the Axe-Fx be used as a plugin?

no.

 

[cobbler]

Hey!!!! You guys all SUCK... with that said can you help me out here?
:roll

 

[Joe Jaeger]

Hey Bakerman,

Thanks for the reply. You say these are all pretty basic stereo delays but could you be a little more specific in what you mean by basic? One poster on here told me that there was someone that posted a recording with an Ultra a few weeks back of the Breaking All Illusions part that I keep reverting back to in all my posts. In fact here is the video:
Aside from the playing being off quite a bit, although not bad, the sound is way off. Im sorry but if this is what anyone considers to be the same sound they should never consider going into sound engineering because they don't have the ears for it! Now, I commend the person who made this cover attempt but for seriousness sake, I hope this is not the basic stereo delay that you're referring to! Theres a huge gap between that sound and the ones in the two clips. In fact that's the problem Im seeing all over youtube. People doing covers of other peoples songs and usually never getting the sound right! Several people on here have given me advice after advice about how I should stop asking so many questions and just get an amp, an effects unit and a speaker cabinet and just start turning knobs but where has that gotten any of you? Im sorry but I don't here very many of you out here getting sounds like John Petrucci, In fact I can't find but maybe one person on the whole web who has! Your tried and true method to sound is not getting very many of you accurate results and although you may be content with those results there are actually some of us out here in the world who don't want to settle for that! That's why John Petrucci is where he is and you are where you are! Because you fail to ask questions and do your research and therefore remain in the amateur league! For everyone out here who ever wants to argue that it is impossible to sound like someone else and you can never duplicate someone else's sound because you don't have their finger tone please watch: VRA! Split Screen Dream Theater Cover Collaboration - Metropolis Pt. 1 - Korg Oasys - Kurzweil PC3x - YouTube



Sorry for that rabbit trail Bakerman! Now getting back to what I was saying...Oh yeah, nobody seems to want to answer this question but I will ask it again. Is it possible to take the properties of a sound effect like this one here: from 0-36seconds and here:[video]http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/virgildonatidream.html[/video] from 34-1:12 from a source such as a plugin or Axe-FX and recreate/duplicate that same sound through another device or form of technology like the Axe-Fx or a plugin? Can the Axe-Fx be used as a plugin?

Wow man, you have to win the award for the biggest douche bag of the year. Seriously You contribute absolutely nothing as of yet to this forum community, yet you attack other guitarist tone and performances, isn't that like a huge no no for musicians? Are you that ignorant? never attack someone else's works, and on top of that you have shared none of your "so called greatness. Look man take your tone "hunting back to your grandma's basement" where it belongs "this is why your tone is crap" who would want to help you?

Btw I read just today Cliff complaining about the same thing, people feeling an entitlement that they can ask for so much but give nothing.

Let's hope this threat get's locked, this guy deserves nothing, other than a beat down.

 

[immortal_soloist]

Initially when I was on this thread,I genuinely posted here for the sake of helping out. But seriously coming back to this thread and seeing your recent posts man is quiet shameful.
You want to know a couple of things about tone right,well right off the bat the Axe Fx responds to tone not as a typical modeller. It actually reacts like a real amp,that means the Axe Fx would sound different with different guitars. To be more precise the wood of the guitar,pick up configurations on the guitar all affect the tone of the guitar. The fellow you are criticizing on the "Breaking All Illusions" solo has replicated the tone correctly there actually. Every guitar gives a different sound when connected to the Axe Fx Ultra or II,just like a real amp. Secondly you come out here and start insulting the guitar players on this forum. For the record most of us are full time musicians and quiet serious about what we do. We come to this forum,to share and actually contribute something. We come here to have a positive dialogue,which seems to be missing from your recent posts. This sort of behavior is childish and absolutely unacceptable,you have no right to be making such judgements and statements about anyone out here.

Anyhow to answer your questions:
Is it possible to take the properties of a sound effect like this one here: from 34-1:12 from a source such as a plugin or Axe-FX and recreate/duplicate that same sound through another device or form of technology like the Axe-Fx or a plugin? Absolutely,it's possible with the Axe Fx,it's been done countless of times by many people. As for plug ins try something like a Revalver MKIII,which is a software and connect your guitar via an audio interface and start experimenting with the choruses,reverbs,and delays.Try to just see how a dry clean tone sounds and then add something like a tape delay and experiment with different different frequencies. Try to increase the wetness bit by bit until you get close to what you want to hear. It's easy to achieve this sound actually,but you won't know until you don't try.

Can the Axe-Fx be used as a plugin? No it can't.

Seriously I am done posting on this topic. It's a shame man,that there are so many people trying to help you out here and you have no sense of gratitude. Rather you decide to insult every person on this forum. The VRA link you posted,that's not cause of the effects only,Thiago has really worked and practiced a lot of stuff from Petrucci. His approach and style is very similar to his. If you aren't convinced with this answer go check out Thiago's original Progressive band "Bad Salad". First comes your physical ability on your instrument and then come the effects and chaining etc. Besides that his guitar is the same as John Petrucci's,pick up configurations,woods etc etc so keep that in mind. Pick ups in general contribute a lot when it comes to tone,and if you have another guitar with similar woods then the results can also be replicated. There are a ton of factors here to get a certain tone. There is absolutely no alternative to playing and working it out by yourself at the end of the day. Anyhow keep up with this attitude,and you'll never go far in your journey for learning,and growing as a player.

Bottom line don't take anyone's courtesy for granted.

 

[Radley]

Let it die with dignity....

 

[Righteoussound]

Ok, Everybody take a breather!

It's very clear that you're all in defense mode and very upset with my last post. Unfortunately this was not the response that I was looking to get from you. I would like to start by saying that many of you are right in telling me that my approach to using that guy who did the cover of the Breaking All Illusions solo as an example was wrong!!! I will say it again, I was wrong! My intention however was not to point out that this guy sucks, in fact I don't think the guy sucks and I tried to say that. But for whatever reason it was a failure attempt at illustrating a point that I was trying to make about how there is a gap in that sound and the one heard on the album. My apologies once again to him and everyone else on this forum who was offended or insulted by this and I do feel that I was out of line for doing that. So I ask this forum and all it's associated members forgiveness for my mistake and want all of you to know that I had no malicious intent or cruel intent in this at all!

The next thing that I would like to say is I read over all of your responses to this post and one of the common threads that ran through several of your posts was how many of you joined in to help me out. Many of you also accuse me of not being grateful for the help that you have offered me. I first off am very sorry that many of you do not feel that I am great full or appreciative for all the time and knowledge that you were willing to share with me as I thought that I did tell several of you how thankful I was for your responses. Regardless, for the record I would like to publicly say to all of you out here that has contributed to this thread in a positive way that I greatly thank you and appreciate all the time, experience and knowledge that you have been willing to donate to this thread and me! So Thank you!

But now I would like to address somethings that were also said. Many of you say you joined in to help me out and once again, I very much appreciate that! But I didn't exactly start this thread for people to "help me out" and this is were I think the whole problem started! Yes I did start the thread to get knowledge that I don't have but I also started the thread to have a good discussion about something that I believed being on this forum, others would take interest in as well. What I saw though after several replies was growing irritation at my interest and deep inquiries about the very things that I started the thread about. A couple of the members even began to insult and attack me for reaching out and trying to have a serious discussion. Nobody however has said anything to these members about this and yet you have come down quite hard on me for doing it! Right now I feel as if there is a double standard taking place! I don't understand what any of you want to talk about if this thread has been such an irritation to you??? Isn't this forum here to talk about all things related to the Axe-Fx and effects processing??? My whole point in the last thread that I posted was to say that Im serious about what Im asking about and would like some serious answers. However many of the questions that I have asked have either been dodged, ignored or not answered. Much of the advice that has been given has been very patronizing, presumptuous and not serious. In other words I don't feel that many of you have tried to really engage me in serious conversation and Im at a loss as to why you would continue to join in on something that you have no interest in??? I really enjoy having intellectual conversations, especially about anything sound technology related but maybe Im alone in that? Maybe others like yourselves don't and someone like myself is just a bore? For whatever it's worth, I hope this forum community will forgive me of my shortcomings and mistakes and hopefully become a much better place as a whole after this experience. Thank you once again and peace be with you!

 

[Dutch]

Peace. Please phrase carefully. People as a race are very defensive, people on the internet are defensive squared. And every word gets magnified to the extreme.


Yes, you can get those effects with The Axe-FX in a live setting. You can get very close in a direct recording session. As for amp sounds, you can also get very close to that with the Axe-FX. I'm still on an Ultra so no experience with the II's USB-thing, but I think with the digital connections the Axe-FX can be used "kind of like" a plug-in in arecording set-up.

How close you can get and how fast you can get there is dependent on several other factors beside the machine. Being the periferal equipment (monitors, guitar, etc.) used and the skill of the user.