The more IRs are used, the more realistic the amp/cab in the room sound is

The more IRs are used at the same time, the more realistic the cab in the room sound is

  • Yes

  • No

  • Maybe

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Scared Homer Simpson GIF by reactionseditor
 
The mistake is thinking that micing a cab is even meant to reproduce the sound in the room. Miced tone is it's own thing and usually the goal is to fit a mix instead.

While mixing multiple mics together can give a bigger, fuller sound, that might be too much in a mix.
 
"Never trust your ears" but this is a bad basis for discussions ;)

I optimized the wording: "Let's assume ears would have perfect perception"
 
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TheRedDevil said:
  • I know CabLab can still be used e.g. for FM3/FM9 but not such simple/userfriendly like in AxeEdit.
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^ I'm trying to understand this ^

From what I remember, the interface in Axe-Edit is the same as in FM3-Edit and FM9-Edit. The FM units don't support four IRs per cab, only two, because of hardware limitations, but the controls and features are the same. So, yes, they're just as simple and user-friendly.

The Cab-Lab interface doesn't change for the FM units, it's the same always. Because the external Dyna-Cab packs have more built-in mic positions Cab-Lab changes the display to help us visualize and access those positions. Said differently, Cab-Lab's display isn't needed in the Edit apps because the built-in factory Dyna-Cabs are missing all the other mic positions. Cab-Lab, because of the external packs, has added features compared to the built-in versions but it still feels as friendly and accessible, it just does more.
 
How to manage 4 IRs with the FM3 (2 in front of speaker and 2 L+R room IRs for headphones)?
Only 2 IRs in the one cab block can be used or 2x2 IRs coming from Cab-Lab in this cab block.
I read Cab Lab can not be used in parallel to Axe Edit, well that means I need to handle 2 tools not in parallel.
I'm also not sure if I can test these 2x2 IRs from Cab-Lab with the FM3 while changing it (Dyna-Cabs).
In AXE FX it's much easier without the HW limitations. I was thinking about to buy a FM3 for holidays but I don't want to manage CabLab or AxeEdit there, I just want to use the FM3 screen+pots. FM9 is much better but to large for holidays.
I had a look at HB DNAfx Git and Line6 Pod Go and thought about this topic here.
 
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TheRedDevil said:
It is also clear to me that our ears have perfect perception, whereas a microphone does not. It only records certain parts/positions of the sound source/speakers. In addition, each microphone is special and only records specific parts of the sound.
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Microphones can capture a wider range of sound than our ears can hear, and they can do it with greater accuracy. Our brain messes with what we hear and our perception of the sound changes with age, volume, and whatever else we're doing at the moment; it's not perfect, it's what we're used to. There have been some interesting studies about what our brain says happened around us even though it never occurred at all, but we can't tell because we only know what the brain tells us.

I think IRs are shot with standard studio microphones because those microphones add a well-recognized "color" to the sound that is desirable when recording in studios. It's not that they couldn't use reference microphones for the IRs, it's that people want that particular speaker cabinet's sound to be colored that particular way because the sound helps sell music. They use microphones on stage similarly, to color the sound, in addition to capturing the sound to let FOH amplify it.

FRFR and amp/cab-in-the-room is useful reading.
[115] You'll never get monitors to sound like "cab in the room". If you want that use a SS power amp and cab. No amount of forum discussion is going to change physics.
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dr bonkers said:
@TheRedDevil your poll does not account for single or stereo IR files that are a mix down of multiple mic impulses.

If you have a single good mix down file, sometimes that's all you need to fit into a mix.
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Aye, and I suspect that CabLab 4 is going to make this more common. I'm most curious about the effect of IRs panned into stereo vs dual amps of the same feather panned into stereo.
 
TheRedDevil said:
It is also clear to me that our ears have perfect perception
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I'd strongly recommend reading about Fletcher-Munson curves. Exempting people with hearing loss, the audible upper frequency limit for most people (on average) tends to fall somewhere between 15K-17K. Some specialized microphones, on the other hand, have a much higher limit. Moreover, sound perception is extremely subjective and is easily influenced by things like bias and expectations.
 
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I use two cabs that are not far from sounding the same. I pan them wide. sounds closer to what my ears say is an amp in the room.
 

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Singtall said:
I use two cabs that are not far from sounding the same. I pan them wide. sounds closer to what my ears say is an amp in the room.
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I treated my listening room with appropriate absorption/diffusion/bass trap panels and tuned everything using a calibrated mic and rew software. The treatments cut reflections that reduce clarity and keep decay similar across octaves. With the treatments i trust the sounds i am getting from my fm3 and pair of yamaha hs8 speakers. The room is part of the speaker.

If you have an untreated room and add more irs and/or volume who knows what will happen? Maybe it will sound better to you and perhaps to me as well? But i think it should all start with a treated room. Otherwise it isn’t going to be easy to control or reproduce in another room.
 
For me, all of this discussion just points to the reason I use an AFX3 — it’s a super-powerful tool that can do ANYTHING I need it to do. I’ve yet to hear a sound in my head that I can’t get (eventually). While it sometimes takes some effort, my spin is that if you can’t do it with an AFX3 you simply can’t do it. Period.

Multiple IRs sounds great to you? Excellent!

Factory preset with a stock IR rocks your world? Perfect!

Missing meals/showers b/c you’re tweaking? Good for you!
 
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