REMOVE The Noise gate

[Man With Gas]

REMOVE THE NOISE GATE ASAP

I'd like to be ale to remove the noise gate from the entire chain at will.

I have a suspicion that even though you turn the Threshold to zero it's still in circuit and could account for the transient attack not being 100% immediate. (????)

The transient pic attack in my mind is sitting at about 97% and the only thing that makes sense is to be able to remove the noise gate to fully confirm if 100% pic attack can be had. (Just like a real amp)

Cliff - why not make it a block item that can be inserted and removed at will?
I appreciate you can't switch it in out of circuit while playing as I imagine it would make a considerable noise/pop etc etc... If that's the case I'm fine with that.

 

[steadystate]

The noise gate does nothing when the threshold is set to to zero. A global threshold offset would be useful if you wanted to defeat the gate in all presets.

 

[Scott Peterson]

Set the threshold to zero and it is out of your chain. I've not had a noise gate in any of my presets in over 3 years with the Axe-FX.

 

[Man With Gas]

Set the threshold to zero and it is out of your chain. I've not had a noise gate in any of my presets in over 3 years with the Axe-FX.

Hello Scott - are you 100% certain the gate is "entirely removed" from the chain?

My request is about getting the transient attack faster/harder to be more like a real amp when playing live with a band.

Immediate Dynamic Response is everything to me and I believe this is what seperates virtual from real.

Once this is sorted out (if it can be) the AXE in my mind is then the ULTIMATE replacement for a real tube amp in a live band setting.

 

[Rex]

...are you 100% certain the gate is "entirely removed" from the chain?

My request is about getting the transient attack faster/harder to be more like a real amp when playing live with a band.

Remember that the Axe's noise gate is a software implementation, not an actual physical analog noise gate that has to be "bypassed" to be taken out of the circuit. The lowest setting of the Threshold parameter is "OFF." That tells the noise gate software to take the signal and "do nothing" with it — just pass it on to the first block in the signal chain. That is exactly equivalent to removing the noise gate software altogether. When the digital signal is run through the D/A converter and sent to the output jack, that output will be exactly the same as if the noise gate weren't there at all.

 

[Jay Mitchell]

I'd like to be ale to remove the noise gate from the entire chain at will.

You can. That's what the "OFF" indication that you see when you set the threshold to minimum is telling you.

I have a suspicion that even though you turn the Threshold to zero it's still in circuit and could account for the transient attack not being 100% immediate.

First, your suspicion is unfounded. Second, what are you talking about when you say "the transient attack not being 100% immediate?"

The transient pic attack in my mind is sitting at about 97%

"97%" of what? And just how did you come up with such a precise number anyway?

and the only thing that makes sense is to be able to remove the noise gate

Then do so. Setting its threshold to minimum does exactly that.

to fully confirm if 100% pic attack can be had. (Just like a real amp)

I'm getting "100% pic attack...(Just like a real amp)" right now.

 

[Man With Gas]

I'm getting "100% pic attack...(Just like a real amp)" right now.

There's always one isn't there. (LOL)

Using these actual amps http://forum.fractalaudio.com/axe-fx-general-discussion/35332-common-axe-fx-complaint-3.html (see my post) I can't get the same pick attack.

Do you play/own these amps and if so what's your approach or secret to get the AXE to play/feel the same?

 

[javajunkie]

There's always one isn't there. (LOL)

Using these actual amps http://forum.fractalaudio.com/axe-fx-general-discussion/35332-common-axe-fx-complaint-3.html (see my post) I can't get the same pick attack.

Do you play/own these amps and if so what's your approach or secret to get the AXE to play/feel the same?

Regardless, you are barking up the wrong three with the noise gate. At the worst case, it is not being triggered therefore it will not have an effect. However, IIRC when you take the threshold down to 0. I believe Cliff set it up not use CPU resources (in other words - removes). That is easy enough to check.

 

[Man With Gas]

Thank you for your replies.

At this stage the AXE FX is not ready for me so back to actual amps and my Eventide H8000 for live playing.

It was a journey that had to be travelled and my curiosity has now been satisfied and I continue the wait for a device that can
replace my live amps.

On the sale block in Australia the Ultra now goes.

 

[javajunkie]

FWIW, I just checked the noise gate. When when you set the threshold to 0 (off), the cpu usage is reduced by ~2.5%. This suggests it is no longer processing the gate.

 

[Jay Mitchell]

There's always one isn't there. (LOL)

I was tempted to say exactly the same thing myself....

Using these actual amps http://forum.fractalaudio.com/axe-fx-general-discussion/35332-common-axe-fx-complaint-3.html (see my post) I can't get the same pick attack.

That is a statement of fact with which nobody could logically disagree. We can't really argue with what you say you can or cannot get from a piece of gear, can we? The implication that follows is that the Axe-Fx is not capable of producing the attack. In my experience, it is.

Do you play/own these amps

Not all of them. However, I owned and played an early-1970s Marshall Super Lead 100 Watt for quite a few years. I can get all the sounds and feels from my Axe-Fx/FRFR rig that it was capable of producing. Ditto a range of Fender amps from a brownface Bassman onwards, a Marshall 50 Watt Super Lead (pre-MV) that I modified extensively, and various other amps I've played over the past 45 years. I have done direct A/B comparisons of my rig with several tube amps, and I've always been able to create equivalent, if not always perfectly identical, sounds and feels with the Axe-Fx.

and if so what's your approach or secret to get the AXE to play/feel the same?

There's no single "secret" to this. Depending on your familiarity with amplifier design, it could take some work to acquaint yourself with the process, and it is apparently more work than you're willing to do.

Here are some important items:
1. Choice of cab sim (in my case, always IRs of my own creation).
2. Methodical, thorough playing/listening/adjustment of parameters.
3. Use of an FRFR system that is as transparent as possible.

On the sale block in Australia the Ultra now goes.

Hmmm. Here's what you said in the thread you linked:

I'm NOT putting the AXE down at all and I like it very much and will use it.

So apparently your six-week experience with the box is enough for you. I personally think you're making a good decision.

 

[sprint]

My impression after 2.5 years with the Axe is that Off is really off on the gate - the CPU test above confirms it I think.

One change I would like to see if possible, is to be able to control the noise gate threshold via controller. Someday though, I hope to play well enough to avoid noise gates all together. Seems like accomplished players often outgrow the need for them (see Scott's post above). I also notice the really good hi-gain patches I've found (i.e. Yeks) don't seem to need so much gate.

 

[Jay Mitchell]

At present, I don't have the noise gate activated in any of my presets. I've never liked what gates do to the sound, particuarly to the decay side of notes and chords.

 

[Scott Peterson]

My impression after 2.5 years with the Axe is that Off is really off on the gate - the CPU test above confirms it I think.

One change I would like to see if possible, is to be able to control the noise gate threshold via controller. Someday though, I hope to play well enough to avoid noise gates all together. Seems like accomplished players often outgrow the need for them (see Scott's post above). I also notice the really good hi-gain patches I've found (i.e. Yeks) don't seem to need so much gate.

Well, I am not an 'accomplished player' more than I am just an old school guy that turns the guitar's volume down between playing and has done so with amps since I started playing. Even on super high gain stuff, I abhor gates. Just my personal preference; lots of 'brootlz' players lean on and depend on a noise gate. I hate that clipped mute (even softly done) on held notes and overtones. Drives me batty; but I don't play the hyper-gained rhythmic metal style those guys do either.

IMHO, YMMV.

 

[Man With Gas]

I was tempted to say exactly the same thing myself....

That is a statement of fact with which nobody could logically disagree. We can't really argue with what you say you can or cannot get from a piece of gear, can we? The implication that follows is that the Axe-Fx is not capable of producing the attack. In my experience, it is.

Not all of them. However, I owned and played an early-1970s Marshall Super Lead 100 Watt for quite a few years. I can get all the sounds and feels from my Axe-Fx/FRFR rig that it was capable of producing. Ditto a range of Fender amps from a brownface Bassman onwards, a Marshall 50 Watt Super Lead (pre-MV) that I modified extensively, and various other amps I've played over the past 45 years. I have done direct A/B comparisons of my rig with several tube amps, and I've always been able to create equivalent, if not always perfectly identical, sounds and feels with the Axe-Fx.

There's no single "secret" to this. Depending on your familiarity with amplifier design, it could take some work to acquaint yourself with the process, and it is apparently more work than you're willing to do.

Here are some important items:
1. Choice of cab sim (in my case, always IRs of my own creation).
2. Methodical, thorough playing/listening/adjustment of parameters.
3. Use of an FRFR system that is as transparent as possible.

Hmmm. Here's what you said in the thread you linked:

So apparently your six-week experience with the box is enough for you. I personally think you're making a good decision.

I've never put the AXE down. What I said was it wasn't ready for me.

Amplifier design and I haven't put enough effort in? A grand statement from someone ignorant of who I am and the (enormous) hours I've clocked on the unit in the time I've had it.

From what I think you're indirectly saying is the Axe can exactly replicate the tone and feel of other amps in a live setting? If this is the case you may want to contact all the great builders who sell their amps for more than the AXE and let them know to stop wasting their time continuing as the AXE has it totally covered?

I'm making a good decision? I think not having to deal with you is the right decision as I haven't seen anything constructive from you yet. This board is for assistance and sharing? I can't see I've been destructive to date.

In general I think this board has good people, however, given you're a moderator for this board I can't say I've felt too much support from you. If you've provided it I've missed it and I'm more than open to be shown I'm wrong.

 

[stevorc321]

Did you see my post in the other thread?? I'm pretty sure this is why the initial attack isn't as strong as some tube amps, rather than a function of noise gate etc...

"If you recall the infamous 'crack' thread, I think Cliff stated that he has deliberately set the initial attack/crack (transient? or something I think it was called) 'softer' than a tube amp to make it easier to play and that the parameter wasn't going to be exposed at this stage. I also miss it a bit and would love to see it exposed. I only really miss it for clean, muted funk style playing, where, with a tube amp, you can typically get muted single notes to 'pop' out almost as much as the chords. IMO...YMMMV etc...A large part of it is probably my lack of tweaking skills or the amplification I am using."

 

[Rex]

"If you recall the infamous 'crack' thread..."

Can you help out those of us who don't recall it? I searched the forum for the term "crack," and didn't find what you're referring to, Thanks.

 

[Jay Mitchell]

I've never put the AXE down. What I said was it wasn't ready for me.

You said two directly contradictory things: first, that you were not putting the axe down and that you liked it very much and would use it, then - in this very thread - that you were selling it. And, of course, you listed in the For Sale forum.

Amplifier design and I haven't put enough effort in? A grand statement from someone ignorant of who I am

You're the famous Man With Gas. Everyone knows who you are.

and the (enormous) hours I've clocked on the unit in the time I've had it.

If you spent 8 hrs/day for the six weeks you've owned it, you'd have a grand total of 294 hours in it. Odds are you spent quite a bit less time/day than that. I'd wager you've got substantially less than 100 hours in it. I wouldn't characterize that as "enormous," but that's just me.

For purposes of comparison, how many hours would you say you have in playing and tweaking tube amps, experimenting with different cabs, etc., etc? How about time in learning to play guitar?

From what I think you're indirectly saying is the Axe can exactly replicate the tone and feel of other amps in a live setting?

All the tones and feels I've wanted. I can't say about amps, sounds, etc., that do not interest me.

If this is the case you may want to contact all the great builders who sell their amps for more than the AXE and let them know to stop wasting their time continuing as the AXE has it totally covered?

Talk about reduction to the absurd....

I haven't seen anything constructive from you yet.

Then you aren't looking. You directly quoted three specific items of constructive advice I gave you.

 

[Jay Mitchell]

Can you help out those of us who don't recall it? I searched the forum for the term "crack," and didn't find what you're referring to, Thanks.

That thread apparently has been sent to the great bit-bucket in the sky, either as a result of one of the prior forum database meltdowns, the migration to this forum, or the actions of a moderator.

 

[Man With Gas]

How about time in learning to play guitar?

Coming from a Moderator you'd have to be kidding right.

I can't say I know you and Scott personally but from my chair you may want to take a few pointers from Scott as you're looking less than helpful on any level.

Add to that you haven't helped the profle of Modeller users. I now have experience as to why there are haters.

I wasn't that keen on moving the Axe FX on, if it sold great if not it didn't matter. The thought of you presiding over this board has me running and not walking away.

For the record I can actually play, especially in a live band setting. I also believe I have a clue on programing/configuring digital audio devices, I have much experience on the Eventide H8000 platform using Vsig along wth many other units.

If you're that pissed feel fee to revoke my account ASAP as I won't be returning any time soon.