New Fractal product coming!!

Given the ire that a different manufacturer recently drew for releasing a product without a screen, I’m not sure we’ll see that.

I avoid using all on-device UI as much as possible. Every modeler's UIs suck compared to a computer with M&K. A small laptop can be had for pennies - I have a stack of old ones lying around. In the studio, I touch my AxeFX maybe 2x a year, but I can see why some things are needed playing live. That's why I'll stand by my 1u controller rack guess: https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/new-fractal-product-coming.207160/post-2589526
 
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It was I who came up with the EXACT product concept that would eventually become the Strymon Iridium. I shared the product concept with Cliff first, in 2010.

Initially my idea was for a single space rack unit with knobs only. Amp sounds only, no effects and no menu or editor. Operating just like a real amplifier, but with Fractal quality modeling under the hood. Then, my idea morphed into a guitar pedal...

My amp modeler pedal product idea had one specific thing about it that was an innovation - true stereo, separate left & right paths from physical input to output with stereo amp modeling running within the internal DSP of the pedal, so the user could place their other stereo effects pedals either before, or after their "amp sound" - enter the stereo amp modeler pedal.

In 2010, there was not a single digital amp modeler pedal that operated in true stereo. Not one in existence. The reason why I came up with the idea for a stereo amp modeler pedal in the first place was because in 2010, companies like Eventide and Strymon started to release stereo effects pedals that had a sound quality approaching the previous era's DSP effects rack units and now, due to these pedals all having true stereo operations with dedicated left and right inputs and outputs, in order to build a stereo pedalboard around this new generation of stereo effects pedals, (that could incorporate amp modeling), a possible amp modeler pedal also had to be equipped with dedicated left and right inputs and outputs, so that users could have a compatible "amp sound" with the ability to position their "amp sound" anywhere they wished, within the stereo pedal signal chain. I knew back in 2010, that the day would come when the majority of guitarists and producers would be working from a home studio, and that running their guitar rig in stereo would become standard as people became familiar with stereo guitar sounds while using technologies like the Fractal Audio Axe-Fx, Line 6 Helix and Amp suite plugins like Guitar Rig and eventually Neural DSP's Archetype plugins. Stereo guitar sounds would be the expected norm, and no longer something niche. How did I know this back in 2010? Because I've been running stereo guitar rigs since 1992 and understood that no one who spends $400 on a reverb or delay pedal is going to run it in mono, once they hear what it sounds like in stereo.

Before you consider responding to this post with a claim that a stereo amp modeler pedal is an obvious product, or that anyone could have come up with the idea, or an attempt to debunk that the product idea was originally mine and no one else's, please consider the following:

Fractal Audio [2010]
I first pitched the idea to Cliff, who said that he liked the idea but that he was focused on the Axe-Fx platform and that a lower price point type of product was outside of his business model at the time. Since then, the FM3 has crossed that boundary, so perhaps a Fractal Audio guitar pedal is possible now?

Yamaha/Line 6 [2014]
In 2014, I had a meeting with Yamaha/Line 6 about my stereo pedal platform idea. I presented the idea and the immediate response was "No one runs a stereo guitar rig, who's going to buy this?" I explained why it was necessary and went into all the details about stereo pedalboards and integration between existing stereo pedals and amp modeling on a pedalboard, positioned wherever the user wants - stereo effects before, or after the amp sound. The response after all my explanation was: "no one is going to buy a pedal like that, especially if it only does the sounds of a Fender Twin/Deluxe, a Vox AC30TB and a Marshall SLP". In 2018, the HX Stomp came out, and it had separate left and right inputs, and dual amp modeling operation from the internal DSP. Was Yamaha/Line 6 bluffing, in order to collect information on my product concept? The smug attitude of this company's lead designer would have be believe that management went above his head to gather this info themselves from me, as the 2015 Helix product was PERFECT and a Fractal Killer according to the lead designer. He who told me that no guitar amp modeling product from Line 6 will ever have more than a single mono instrument input.

Strymon [2016]
In 2016, I pitched the exact same idea that I pitched to Yamaha/Line 6, to Strymon on their online blog, in a public space online. At this time, Strymon had a prototype amp modeler pedal, that they were using at trade shows to demonstrate their other pedals. Their prototype had only one amp model and was mono only. At this point, they had only considered that such a pedal needed to be mono because wet effects go POST AMP sound. I explained how experimental guitarists like Neil Halstead & Christian Savill of Slowdive and Robin Guthrie of The Cocteau Twins commonly ran stereo effects like stereo delays and stereo reverbs in front of a pair of guitar amps - that sound of wet effects in front of two amplifiers was a completely unique sound where the effects were baked into the amp tone. Compared to sending a dry guitar amp signal into stereo effects, either by using guitar pedals, or by using auxiliary effects sends and returns on a mixing console in a studio, or with effects plugins after a dry guitar amp sound inside a DAW, having these big lush stereo effects in front of two amps was increasingly becoming highly prevalent in modern music, both live and in the studio. Especially within praise and worship music, where the sound of stereo delay in front of two amps - more specifically the sound of U2's "Where The Streets Have No Name" had become the newly adopted sound of Christian rock music.

Strymon seemed to understand all this, and that stereo effects in front of two amps was a thing.... is a thing... and that thing was going to continue to grow in popularity, within several different musical genres until it might one day become the most common way that guitarists use effects.

In my experience, many hard rock and metal players who grew up in the 1980's HATE this kind of "stereo effects in front of two amps" rig and fail to understand it, no matter how it is explained. As much as I love hard rock and metal music myself, I have found that guitarists in these genres largely believe (religiously) that wet effects must be positioned after the dry amp sound as POST effects and that any other positioning of effects with a guitar amplifier is incorrect and improper. Sacrilegious! I have also found that most metal players think that an amp's effects loop is the only way to implement wet effects into a live guitar rig. Dave Friedman would do a service to humanity, making a YouTube video explaining how mono effects loops in guitar amplifiers came to be and why they are a totally compromised attempt of replicating the effects mixing system in a recording studio, where stereo effects are used within the auxiliary send/return channels of a mixing console to mix music.


To be continued...
 
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Continued...


What happens when you place stereo effects in front of two amplifiers?
The limited frequency range of the amp + speaker cab makes the wet effects merge with the dry guitar signal. The dry guitar and the wet effects become one. Baked together like sugar and butter are to make caramel. The effects no longer sound like they are separate from the dry guitar and living in a separate stereo dimension that exists "behind" or "beyond" the dry signal. When the effects go in front of amps, they become a part of the guitar sound as a whole, and you end up with a guitar sound that occupies it's own space in a mix with drums, bass, vocals, keys. The guitar effects occupy the same sonic territory in a mix, as the guitar amp does and they don't live outside of the "guitar realm" within the full frequency audio spectrum of the mix, where POST reverb on a guitar might get lost in the mix because it's occupying the space where the vocals, drums, vocal reverb and drum reverb lives too.

Finally... someone is getting it
Many other people commented on my post on Strymon's blog. My product idea was written out in great detail and other posters commented on how much they too would love to have such a pedal that worked in stereo so they could integrate an amp sound with their existing Strymon pedals. Strymon thanked me on their public forum for the suggestion and obviously saw the immediate demand for a stereo amp modeler pedal. In October of 2019, the exact product I suggestion was released with the exact three amp models that I suggested. It even included IRs from Ownhammer, which was something I specifically noted, as I felt at the time that this would be advantageous. If I were recommending IRs today, it would be those from York Audio, as I find they are exemplary of the best IRs available.

Proof Of Concept [2019 - 2024]
Since the Iridium pedal came out and became one of the best selling guitar pedals in the world, several other companies, most notably Walrus Audio, Universal Audio and BOSS have come out with their own stereo amp modeler pedals in response to Iridium, that follow the same product concept of total integration with the user's existing stereo pedals.

Here & Now
Perhaps in 2024 Cliff has come full circle on the stereo amp modeler pedal concept? My contribution to the discussion of this as a possible new Fractal Audio product is that I believe the most significant make or break features of a Fractal Audio amp modeler pedal starts with separate left and right physical inputs and outputs, in addition to stereo amp modeling operation. There are many other features that people have already discussed - lots of amp models, MIDI functionality, IR loading, dynamic cab blocks, effects loop, expression pedal input, etc. Stereo operation and integration with other stereo pedals is the most significant feature for such a device and something sorely missing from the FM3, so a Fractal Audio amp modeler pedal would fill that void and be very welcomed and appreciated.

A Fractal Audio stereo amp modeling pedal would be an instant purchase for me, and likely thousands of others. At the price point of an Eventide H90, and with some onboard effects capabilities, this could become the new "high end" standard in the amp pedal platform area, occupying it's own unique space in that market.
 
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girl crying GIF
 
It was I who came up with the EXACT product concept that would eventually become the Strymon Iridium. I shared the product concept with Cliff first, in 2010.

Initially my idea was for a single space rack unit with knobs only. Amp sounds only, no effects and no menu or editor. Operating just like a real amplifier, but with Fractal quality modeling under the hood. Then, my idea morphed into a guitar pedal...

My amp modeler pedal product idea had one specific thing about it that was an innovation - true stereo, separate left & right paths from physical input to output with stereo amp modeling running within the internal DSP of the pedal, so the user could place their other stereo effects pedals either before, or after their "amp sound" - enter the stereo amp modeler pedal.

In 2010, there was not a single digital amp modeler pedal that operated in true stereo. Not one in existence. The reason why I came up with the idea for a stereo amp modeler pedal in the first place was because in 2010, companies like Eventide and Strymon started to release stereo effects pedals that had a sound quality approaching the previous era's DSP effects rack units and now, due to these pedals all having true stereo operations with dedicated left and right inputs and outputs, in order to build a stereo pedalboard around this new generation of stereo effects pedals, (that could incorporate amp modeling), a possible amp modeler pedal also had to be equipped with dedicated left and right inputs and outputs, so that users could have a compatible "amp sound" with the ability to position their "amp sound" anywhere they wished, within the stereo pedal signal chain. I knew back in 2010, that the day would come when the majority of guitarists and producers would be working from a home studio, and that running their guitar rig in stereo would become standard as people became familiar with stereo guitar sounds while using technologies like the Fractal Audio Axe-Fx, Line 6 Helix and Amp suite plugins like Guitar Rig and eventually Neural DSP's Archetype plugins. Stereo guitar sounds would be the expected norm, and no longer something niche. How did I know this back in 2010? Because I've been running stereo guitar rigs since 1992 and understood that no one who spends $400 on a reverb or delay pedal is going to run it in mono, once they hear what it sounds like in stereo.

Before you consider responding to this post with a claim that a stereo amp modeler pedal is an obvious product, or that anyone could have come up with the idea, or an attempt to debunk that the product idea was originally mine and no one else's, please consider the following:

Fractal Audio [2010]
I first pitched the idea to Cliff, who said that he liked the idea but that he was focused on the Axe-Fx platform and that a lower price point type of product was outside of his business model at the time. Since then, the FM3 has crossed that boundary, so perhaps a Fractal Audio guitar pedal is possible now?

Yamaha/Line 6 [2014]
In 2014, I had a meeting with Yamaha/Line 6 about my stereo pedal platform idea. I presented the idea and the immediate response was "No one runs a stereo guitar rig, who's going to buy this?" I explained why it was necessary and went into all the details about stereo pedalboards and integration between existing stereo pedals and amp modeling on a pedalboard, positioned wherever the user wants - stereo effects before, or after the amp sound. The response after all my explanation was: "no one is going to buy a pedal like that, especially if it only does the sounds of a Fender Twin/Deluxe, a Vox AC30TB and a Marshall SLP". In 2018, the HX Stomp came out, and it had separate left and right inputs, and dual amp modeling operation from the internal DSP. Was Yamaha/Line 6 bluffing, in order to collect information on my product concept? The smug attitude of this company's lead designer would have be believe that management went above his head to gather this info themselves from me, as the 2015 Helix product was PERFECT and a Fractal Killer according to the lead designer. He who told me that no guitar amp modeling product from Line 6 will ever have more than a single mono instrument input.

Strymon [2016]
In 2016, I pitched the exact same idea that I pitched to Yamaha/Line 6, to Strymon on their online blog, in a public space online. At this time, Strymon had a prototype amp modeler pedal, that they were using at trade shows to demonstrate their other pedals. Their prototype had only one amp model and was mono only. At this point, they had only considered that such a pedal needed to be mono because wet effects go POST AMP sound. I explained how experimental guitarists like Neil Halstead & Christian Savill of Slowdive and Robin Guthrie of The Cocteau Twins commonly ran stereo effects like stereo delays and stereo reverbs in front of a pair of guitar amps - that sound of wet effects in front of two amplifiers was a completely unique sound where the effects were baked into the amp tone. Compared to sending a dry guitar amp signal into stereo effects, either by using guitar pedals, or by using auxiliary effects sends and returns on a mixing console in a studio, or with effects plugins after a dry guitar amp sound inside a DAW, having these big lush stereo effects in front of two amps was increasingly becoming highly prevalent in modern music, both live and in the studio. Especially within praise and worship music, where the sound of stereo delay in front of two amps - more specifically the sound of U2's "Where The Streets Have No Name" had become the newly adopted sound of Christian rock music.

Strymon seemed to understand all this, and that stereo effects in front of two amps was a thing.... is a thing... and that thing was going to continue to grow in popularity, within several different musical genres until it might one day become the most common way that guitarists use effects.

In my experience, many hard rock and metal players who grew up in the 1980's HATE this kind of "stereo effects in front of two amps" rig and fail to understand it, no matter how it is explained. As much as I love hard rock and metal music myself, I have found that guitarists in these genres largely believe (religiously) that wet effects must be positioned after the dry amp sound as POST effects and that any other positioning of effects with a guitar amplifier is incorrect and improper. Sacrilegious! I have also found that most metal players think that an amp's effects loop is the only way to implement wet effects into a live guitar rig. Dave Friedman would do a service to humanity, making a YouTube video explaining how mono effects loops in guitar amplifiers came to be and why they are a totally compromised attempt of replicating the effects mixing system in a recording studio, where stereo effects are used within the auxiliary send/return channels of a mixing console to mix music.


To be continued...
I recall posting on TGP about it as well, specific to Strymon. What they did release wasn't quite what I anticipated, but still good and their own thing.

Prior to FAS, I used the Yamaha DG Stomp, which really wasn't bad. And yeah... I once had a V-amp. But, I made it work for my guitar lessons at the time.
 
Continued...


What happens when you place stereo effects in front of two amplifiers?
The limited frequency range of the amp + speaker cab makes the wet effects merge with the dry guitar signal. The dry guitar and the wet effects become one. Baked together like sugar and butter are to make caramel. The effects no longer sound like they are separate from the dry guitar and living in a separate stereo dimension that exists "behind" or "beyond" the dry signal. When the effects go in front of amps, they become a part of the guitar sound as a whole, and you end up with a guitar sound that occupies it's own space in a mix with drums, bass, vocals, keys. The guitar effects occupy the same sonic territory in a mix, as the guitar amp does and they don't live outside of the "guitar realm" within the full frequency audio spectrum of the mix, where POST reverb on a guitar might get lost in the mix because it's occupying the space where the vocals, drums, vocal reverb and drum reverb lives too.

Finally... someone is getting it
Many other people commented on my post on Strymon's blog. My product idea was written out in great detail and other posters commented on how much they too would love to have such a pedal that worked in stereo so they could integrate an amp sound with their existing Strymon pedals. Strymon thanked me on their public forum for the suggestion and obviously saw the immediate demand for a stereo amp modeler pedal. In October of 2019, the exact product I suggestion was released with the exact three amp models that I suggested. It even included IRs from Ownhammer, which was something I specifically noted, as I felt at the time that this would be advantageous. If I were recommending IRs today, it would be those from York Audio, as I find they are exemplary of the best IRs available.

Proof Of Concept [2019 - 2024]
Since the Iridium pedal came out and became one of the best selling guitar pedals in the world, several other companies, most notably Walrus Audio, Universal Audio and BOSS have come out with their own stereo amp modeler pedals in response to Iridium, that follow the same product concept of total integration with the user's existing stereo pedals.

Here & Now
Perhaps in 2024 Cliff has come full circle on the stereo amp modeler pedal concept? My contribution to the discussion of this as a possible new Fractal Audio product is that I believe the most significant make or break features of a Fractal Audio amp modeler pedal starts with separate left and right physical inputs and outputs, in addition to stereo amp modeling operation. There are many other features that people have already discussed - lots of amp models, MIDI functionality, IR loading, dynamic cab blocks, effects loop, expression pedal input, etc. Stereo operation and integration with other stereo pedals is the most significant feature for such a device and something sorely missing from the FM3, so a Fractal Audio amp modeler pedal would fill that void and be very welcomed and appreciated.

A Fractal Audio stereo amp modeling pedal would be an instant purchase for me, and likely thousands of others. At the price point of an Eventide H90, and with some onboard effects capabilities, this could become the new "high end" standard in the amp pedal platform area, occupying it's own unique space in that market.
I came up with the iPhone because I got tired of texting on a flip phone. I posted on an Apple forum that we needed a better way to text and have better maps.
 
BTW between speculations and whistling that forum post doesn’t bring that much. It’s just preventing potential customers from purchasing a product from FAS, waiting for novelty.
It makes sense if the new release is showing up rapidly. Saying that it’s not competing with existing product is too cryptic. A wireless system is not competing. But an Axefx plugin isn’t either. Both with very different impact. Even the FM0 speculation is actually a huge competition for FM3. And of course a ToneX capture product too. When you play guitar you don’t turn any knobs or sculpt you sound, you just play at the end of the day.
 
BTW between speculations and whistling that forum post doesn’t bring that much. It’s just preventing potential customers from purchasing a product from FAS, waiting for novelty.
It makes sense if the new release is showing up rapidly. Saying that it’s not competing with existing product is too cryptic. A wireless system is not competing. But an Axefx plugin isn’t either. Both with very different impact. Even the FM0 speculation is actually a huge competition for FM3. And of course a ToneX capture product too. When you play guitar you don’t turn any knobs or sculpt you sound, you just play at the end of the day.
So they wait a couple of weeks. The sun will still come up.
 
We're talking about all this, and I'm over here enjoying my lovingly used, 1st gen Effectrode Blackbird (knobs and switches only). For me, I still enjoy the Ethos more, but it's cool to have some more tubes in the house again. I've also gotten back into Kingsley pedals again... It is fun, of course with plenty of great sounds and feelz, just a lot less practical than the great digital stuff.

And, I'm still hoping for a new FX-only unit.
 
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