Help! FM3 sounds dull vs Tonex or Amp w/Pedalboard

J

JPS225

Member
Help! I'm fully aware this is probably user error, so guidance is requested. I know the FM3 can sound awesome, but i'm struggling. When compared with my current pedalboard with ToneX one (WT Fender Pro capture). Pedalboard is Ego>Boss BD2>Tumnus Dlx>BossSD1>ToneX One>EP booster>HX Stomp (delay and reverb). To be as close as possible, i've been testing against the WT Fender Pro patch for the FM3, (although I have tested with others as well). I know the sounds are in the FM3, it just doens't seem as alive, either in headphones or a FRFR (QSC 8.1). I've also been trying to build from an Austin Buddy patch as well. I know this leaves a ton of variables, but are there any suggestions anyone would have? Do you notice this as well?

For reference, I play 90's country/southern rock. I seem to find way more for High Gain players with Fractal than lower gain like my style. I'd love to have it all in the FM3 size to setup and carry reasons, but I need to sound/feel good to me.
 
And the unit is up-to-date, software-wise? Just curious, as far as variable removal.

Also, any chance you could post the preset with which you're working?
 
Here is the main preset:
1716319529935.png

And yes, it's up today. I love the gapless switching now!! just gotta get the sound right
 
We need more information.

Is the unit new or used? If used, follow the steps in "How to reset Axe-Fx III, FM9, or FM3 to a "factory fresh" condition".

How are you amplifying the sound? What are you using to monitor your sound speaker-wise? Compare your set-up to the setups in Section 4 in the manual and tell us which most closely matches, and what is different.

The volume you use when comparing sounds can make or break the comparison. Quieter sounds will be perceived to have more mid-range compared to louder ones, it's just how our brain works, so make sure the volumes are equal. See "Fletcher-Munson" in the Wiki for more information.

Thank you for sharing a screenshot of the preset, but we need to see inside the preset itself, so export it and attach it to your post… unless it's a 3rd-party/commercial preset. If it's the later, then tell us what it is and we might have it already. Or, use unmodified factory presets so we can compare against our copies.

The built-in factory presets cover a wide range of sounds and styles, and with simple adjustments of the amp's "Tone" controls, the ones in the "Tone" tab, you should be able to get very suitable southern-rock sounds. The second factory preset, "65 Bassguy", is a great starting point.
 
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I'm using headphones to make the comparison, and I do have the volumes as close to the same level as possible. the patch is a third party, from Worship Tutorials, their WT 64 Pro tone match for HB. My initial guess is an eq issue, just not sure what it would be. I think the EP Booster in the pedalboard makes a huge difference in that sound, so i'm wondering if I need something eq wise to replicate that on the FM3. I'd love to use the FM3, would save me a ton of potential headaches!
 
JPS225 said:
Here is the main preset:
View attachment 140624

And yes, it's up today. I love the gapless switching now!! just gotta get the sound right
Click to expand...
What I meant by 'posting the preset' is to literally export the actual preset from the FM3 as a .syx file, and then post it here as an attachment so we can see what's going on beyond the screen shot.
 
This is apples vs. oranges. Could be any number of things. Try turning on the bright switch. Try a different amp model. Try a different cab.

I have no idea what a "WT 64 Pro" is so I can't recommend an amp model.
 
A lot of presets I've seen from WT include IRs (what they call 'Tone Match') which need to be imported to the Cab List then load the associated IRs in the cab block of the preset.
 
Little OT: those send/return blocks are useless in that preset, you can place the out blocks in the last column and connect each block in the previous column to both of them.
 
Just because it is a commercial 'Tone Matched' preset doesn't mean that you aren't allowed to move the amp tone knobs. It was 'Tone matched' with a different guitar than yours. It will likely need some tweaks for your guitar, to get where it was intended to be. And what the preset creator intended might not be what you are specifically after.

Have you tried turning up the 'Presence', the 'Treble', turning on the 'Bright Switch', or messing with the amp block 'Output EQ' page.
 
JPS225 said:
Help! I'm fully aware this is probably user error, so guidance is requested. I know the FM3 can sound awesome, but i'm struggling. When compared with my current pedalboard with ToneX one (WT Fender Pro capture). Pedalboard is Ego>Boss BD2>Tumnus Dlx>BossSD1>ToneX One>EP booster>HX Stomp (delay and reverb). To be as close as possible, i've been testing against the WT Fender Pro patch for the FM3, (although I have tested with others as well). I know the sounds are in the FM3, it just doens't seem as alive, either in headphones or a FRFR (QSC 8.1). I've also been trying to build from an Austin Buddy patch as well. I know this leaves a ton of variables, but are there any suggestions anyone would have? Do you notice this as well?

For reference, I play 90's country/southern rock. I seem to find way more for High Gain players with Fractal than lower gain like my style. I'd love to have it all in the FM3 size to setup and carry reasons, but I need to sound/feel good to me.
Click to expand...
I have found that if you spend some time finding a really good IR, the rest falls into place. Mess around with that first.
 
I'd try building from scratch if possible , however with the WT Fender patch in mind:

I tried out a WT free Rev preset this morning, the Tone Match IR bundled, was pretty dark sounding, it seemed as if there was a roll off at 5-6k and made things sound kinda boxy to be honest, which might have translated on a certain system, but didn't suit me at all , i'd suggest trying a different cab in the cab block in that preset to see how you get along, tweaking or turning off the COMP block might help too

i've got various presets/walkthroughs on my channel , attached two here in case you want to check those out for ideas
 

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  • pb - blue skies.syx
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  • pb - Matchbox D-30 + Pedals.syx
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I have some of the WT stuff, and they dial sounds in with a healthy emphasis on the mids, which in my experience sounds good in a mix, but can be a bit boxy all by itself. It looks like you're using one of the tone match presets that they sell, which as @JoKeR III mentioned, requires a particular IR to be loaded- make sure you have that loaded in- it came with the preset and needs to be saved to the FM3, and then manually selected into the preset.

If it were me, I'd 100% try a different preset and see if you like that any better, and as everyone else has said here, make adjustments! If something's not working for you, experiment and try and get closer to what you want, and be sure to dial in a band volumes- tones that sound good quiet are usually far too bright cranked up.
 
Paul Bradshaw said:
I'd try building from scratch if possible , however with the WT Fender patch in mind:

I tried out a WT free Rev preset this morning, the Tone Match IR bundled, was pretty dark sounding, it seemed as if there was a roll off at 5-6k and made things sound kinda boxy to be honest, which might have translated on a certain system, but didn't suit me at all , i'd suggest trying a different cab in the cab block in that preset to see how you get along, tweaking or turning off the COMP block might help too

i've got various presets/walkthroughs on my channel , attached two here in case you want to check those out for ideas
Click to expand...
Same here. I've tried several worshiptutorials tonematch patches (free ones and one commercial) and I have found something strange in all of them, that cab block 'tone match' IR. It always sound off to me, boxy, bland sounding...changing to any other IR always improved the tone. As soon as I opened it I closed it again. Definitely not for me. I'm not definitely into this tonematch thing on modelers to be honest.

Maybe you can find some interesting FX chain and borrow it for your main preset. ;)
 
What IR are you using?

Also try to dial back the input trim and compensate with bringing the gain up. Some of those cleaner amps get quite thin if you dont have enough gain. Don´t be shy with the presence control and bright switch.

I´d put my money on the IR. If the Presets sound too dull or too bright, finding the right IR usually solves the problem.

Edit: I find that preset quite complicated for 90s rock and country.
 
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I find their (identically named) presets to be wildly different between platforms.

That high freq rolloff is absolutely necessary in the helix .. but those harsh highs aren't there in the fractal. The extra filtering is an extra blanket when applied the FAS ecosystem.

I love what the WT guys are doing,..but I find their presets are best used as a starting point effects wise, to building you own tone into, which takes some extra time in Fractal gear... but is way with the effort.

And the WT / TF Hislop IRs don't work for everything. Nothing really does TBH.

Tone match, capture, profile, component level modeling, real time spice models, are all entirely different. Trying to get them all to sound the same is a long journey. And it' a whole lot of time spent editing and listening.

You can shorten that process by choosing some amazing IRs and use them on everything.. at least until you work out the differences in platforms.
 
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