Going Stereo is just SO COOL!!!

not sure it's worth it in a 2 guitar band. assuming that you're panning one guitar a bit left and one a bit right, you're already creating a wide stereo spread. running one guitar in stereo will just muddy the waters, so to speak.

OK, got it.

Cheers
 
A guitar is a mono source. Stereo is a relationship between instruments in the L-R soundstage. Stereo takes time to create and recreate. A stereo mix can be obliterated by a guitarist using a boost and taking up another instrument's space in the soundstage. This, and many other reasons are why FOH engineers don't take the time to create compelling stereo mixes.

The AXE FX can create a "stereo effect" but if you fold that effect down to one speaker, it will have the same relationship in the mix as it does being panned hard L-R or anywhere else. If it doesn't, you probably have phase issues and besides feedback, phase is what you want to avoid most in a live environment. Keep in mind we're talking about a controlled L-R mix with other instruments - not the effect you get when you stand between two guitar cabs while running a stereo effect in your rehearsal space (which is actually dual-mono).

This debate will never end but "stereo" is misnomer for a single guitar in a mix unless you're talking about something Ike Chet Atkins split pickup guitar that routed different strings to different channels as it was being played by.... CHET ATKINS!

Every venue with left and right speakers and a pan control on any channel is capable of running a "stereo" mix. I don't know of any venue with "mono FOH". Stereo doesn't require more monitors, etc., it simply requires an audible image relationship between sources across the L-R soundstage.
 
I don't know of any venue with "mono FOH". Stereo doesn't require more monitors, etc., it simply requires an audible image relationship between sources across the L-R soundstage.
I know of several. The mains are a speaker cluster flown above center stage. The only other speakers are delayed fills.

Also, from the performer's point of view, if he wants to hear himself in stereo, he'll need another monitor. And if he lugs his own wedge(s), that's more weight and expense for him. Otherwise, it's just more expense for the house.
 
I know of several. The mains are a speaker cluster flown above center stage. The only other speakers are delayed fills.

Also, from the performer's point of view, if he wants to hear himself in stereo, he'll need another monitor. And if he lugs his own wedge(s), that's more weight and expense for him. Otherwise, it's just more expense for the house.

As I stated, any venue with L-R speaker columns and a pan control can create a stereo mix. A performer or group of performers do not have to hear themselves in stereo in order for a stereo image to be created at FOH. By design, a stage mix is a stereo mix as long as the performer has two working ears. Every monitor mix I've ever done is either personalized for "mostly me / some of them" or "can you just send us the FOH mix?" Which may or may not be configured as a stereo mix.

I don't know of any remaining venues - live or installed - that fly one column. I don't doubt that they exist - and I know that they have - but they are certainly outnumbered 100-1 by two column set ups.

Please keep in mind, I'm only referring to creating a true stereo mix at FOH and the hard panned guitar's contribution to that mix. There are hundreds of variables but, my point is probably this: a mono guitar (with or without stereo effects) can leave a lot more space in a mix to create a more compelling FOH mix. A hard panned dual mono L-R guitar doesn't translate well in large venues to those huge sounds one gets from standing between two guitar cabs in their rehearsal space. Precedence effect tells us the perception of the listener is lesser of where the sound localized than it is for when it arrives, meaning a well timed delay, echo or reverb is going to have more impact on the listener than which side of the stage the sound emanates. The most common time based effects can sound just as good in mono as they do in stereo.
 
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By design, a stage mix is a stereo mix as long as the performer has two working ears.
You lost me there. If every performer gets one wedge, it won't be stereo, no matter how many ears you have. :)


Every monitor mix I've ever done is either personalized for "mostly me / some of them" or "can you just send us the FOH mix?" Which may or may not be configured as a stereo mix.
I've played places that had five wedges and only one monitor mix. And three wedges with three mixes for six musicians.


I
...my point is probably this: a mono guitar (with or without stereo effects) can leave a lot more space in a mix to create a more compelling FOH mix.
True that.
 
I work at a venue that seats close to 2000 and we are mono. 3 of the 7 similar-sized venues in town are also mono while the rest are stereo, and it is mostly due to room shape and configuration, not really because of the added complexity of stereo. The arena shows are definitely in mono because of the width and breadth (sometimes the stage is in the center with arrays in all directions).

If you have a rectangle or square shaped hall and the option to cover all seating via just a pair of stacks or arrays, then by all means, run it in stereo. But don't hard pan guitars or other instruments - that doesn't set you up for a successful, evenly distributed mix.

Most (if not all) wedge monitor setups in town that I've come across are mono, while most IEM setups have been stereo.
 
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But for me it's a personal stage preference. I love listening to my guitar in stereo on stage. I always position myself between two wedges or cabs. Done it since the mid 80s. I'd prefer if the FOH takes my stereo sends. If he takes one or sums the two mono, that's ok. Not my hat. But in recordings I know it's possible to mix many stereo guitars, drum OHs, vocals, bass and have them
Make sense in the stereo field. I've done it a lot. I'm not really a FOH engineer and i know it can be a headache but it's certainly not impossible. Guys who I use a lot know me and know how I like it. If the system is limited, ok. But my thing is how it sounds TO ME on stage while I'm playing. I dig it.
 
...and it is mostly due to room shape and configuration, not really because of the added complexity of stereo. The arena shows are definitely in mono because of the width and breadth (sometimes the stage is in the center with arrays in all directions).
Excellent points. In a lot of places, the shape/configuration of the room just won't play well with stereo.[/QUOTE]
 
More complexity, more weight (monitors, etc.), more cost...and the fact that a lot of venues have mono FOH.

And of course there's the big one: Guitarists run mono because that's how it was done forty years ago. :)

If FOH is able to run stereo all you got to do is send stereo from fractal to FOH and mono to your FRFR or cab. Right?
 
If FOH is able to run stereo all you got to do is send stereo from fractal to FOH and mono to your FRFR or cab. Right?
Yes...with the usual caveats about collapsing your signal to mono. Read what the wiki has to say about stereo.
 
Yes...with the usual caveats about collapsing your signal to mono. Read what the wiki has to say about stereo.

Effects sound gloriously in stereo. However, when it comes to FOH sound, stereo separation may not translate very well to a live audience, because people seldom are in the right spot to hear both sides equally well. :)
 
Right so for small venue gigs with a 2nd guitarist (UK pubs and the odd small festival) I might as well just go out of Output 1 L with both guitars largely down the middle with a little bit of L or R pan for each guitar?

Clarification would be good!

Either way I know my guitar through the AX8 will still sound as good.
 
I love it too! Using a 212 cabinet, L and R from a stereo SS amps OUTS.
No more funky phasing issues on my time based effects doing the LR SUM from my AxeFXII.
Did the FRFR thing for awhile, really digging the cab now.
I can still send to FOH from my Axe L/R, or just place a mic in the middle of the cab.
 
I'm the only guitarist in our 4pc band and my axe-fx chain is SUM L+R. I use the enhancer block on all rythm stuff and then off for all lead stuff. It has seemed to work quite well. I provide 2 channels, L & R XLRs to FOH so I can sustain my Delay/reverb stereo effects but the dry signal is MONO for the most part, just widened w/the enhancer as not to compete w/any leads I play and also to match some backing track guitar parts that are double tracked, the FOH also gets two XLR's for the BT's, L & R (Signal comes from abelton Live into scarelett 18i20 then out to FOH).

All panning is left centered but panning hard L or R from FOH is equally the same, so I don't see why it matters a whole lot if the FOH is a stereo or mono board if the signal they are recieving is "pre-composed" in a sense. Correct me if i'm wrong.
 
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