FM3 Firmware Version 5.03 beta 6 (release candidate)

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Rex said:
If I’m reading you right, you’re proposing that we take the highest value known to always work, and call that 100%. Is that correct? I’ve seen a preset mute at 82%. I’ve also seen an 87% preset continue to work just fine. That’s a 6% range. With your proposal, we’d shave off that top 6% and not let the user have it. Seems a high price just to make a number go all the way to 100.

I’d rather have it report the true CPU usage, as it does now
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I'm proposing only a change in the presentation of the CPU meter. It would just show up basically 100% around a particular range of real CPU usage. Whether that is 80-100% real usage or 85-100 or whatever seems appropriate. The idea is that the CPU meter being all the way to 100% or close to it represents "danger, try to reduce your CPU usage".

The current way it works showing real CPU usage including headroom is that the user has to learn that ~80% = max safe CPU usage. Considering it's not totally consistent when the output gets muted past that it's not really useful that your preset ran at 87% but another one failed to do so at 82%. If both of those situations showed 100% CPU usage then the user would know they are driving the unit at its limits and can run into trouble, making them either ignore the CPU meter and take their chances or understand that they might be better off turning settings down or removing a block. All without ever having to read the manual about the CPU meter.
 
laxu said:
I'm proposing only a change in the presentation of the CPU meter. It would just show up basically 100% around a particular range of real CPU usage. Whether that is 80-100% real usage or 85-100 or whatever seems appropriate.
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What does that mean, though? Does "basically 100%" mean 100%? Or 98%? Or 102%? Or more than one of these?

And what does "around a particular range of real CPU" mean? Does it mean you'll read 100% when the real CPU is running at 82% or 85% or 87%? That seems a bit messy and counterintuitive.
 
Rex said:
What does that mean, though? Does "basically 100%" mean 100%? Or 98%? Or 102%? Or more than one of these?

And what does "around a particular range of real CPU" mean? Does it mean you'll read 100% when the real CPU is running at 82% or 85% or 87%? That seems a bit messy and counterintuitive.
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laxu said:
The current way it works showing real CPU usage including headroom is that the user has to learn that ~80% = max safe CPU usage.
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The devil is in the ‘~’ …
 
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stdout said:
The devil is in the ‘~’ …
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Exactly this. Conceptually, it's easy to think of having the box read "basically 100%" when the real CPU is "around a certain percentage." But when you go to implement that, you start to realize that you have to make assumptions or throw away available CPU to get that to work.
 
Rex said:
Exactly this. Conceptually, it's easy to think of having the box read "basically 100%" when the real CPU is "around a certain percentage." But when you go to implement that, you start to realize that you have to make assumptions or throw away available CPU to get that to work.
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Also, people would gripe about the reported value when they realize they can go above 100% or it refuses to make sound at 93% and say it's not accurate, so no matter what they do Fractal can't win.

Since Fractal says that CPU use should stay below 80% I think that should be good enough. From the "Preset CPU Limits" section in the manual:
The maximum allowable load is about 80%, and if you manage to get much above that, audio performance may be compromised.
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All three manuals say the same thing, 80%. We know that's the recommended limit, so there's no need to change things.

Sure, there's a little wiggle room, but complaining when a preset stops working because the preset crowded the recommended limit is not Fractal's problem since they said "about 80%". I know there's a limit and I'm smart enough to know to not push the limits, whether it's with a modeler, my computer, or the red line on my car's tachometer. I'm generally not happy with the results if I do.
 
Ok I think I found a small bug. Not even sure it's worth posting though. Whenever I scroll though the types of compressors, the screen blinks rapidly. Also can hear popping. Not sure if its always been like this though, first time I've noticed it. Doesn't happen with any other kind of block.
 

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laxu said:
I'm proposing only a change in the presentation of the CPU meter. It would just show up basically 100% around a particular range of real CPU usage. Whether that is 80-100% real usage or 85-100 or whatever seems appropriate. The idea is that the CPU meter being all the way to 100% or close to it represents "danger, try to reduce your CPU usage".

The current way it works showing real CPU usage including headroom is that the user has to learn that ~80% = max safe CPU usage. Considering it's not totally consistent when the output gets muted past that it's not really useful that your preset ran at 87% but another one failed to do so at 82%. If both of those situations showed 100% CPU usage then the user would know they are driving the unit at its limits and can run into trouble, making them either ignore the CPU meter and take their chances or understand that they might be better off turning settings down or removing a block. All without ever having to read the manual about the CPU meter.
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+1. I think it isn't difficult to understand.
 
Rex said:
What does that mean, though? Does "basically 100%" mean 100%? Or 98%? Or 102%? Or more than one of these?

And what does "around a particular range of real CPU" mean? Does it mean you'll read 100% when the real CPU is running at 82% or 85% or 87%? That seems a bit messy and counterintuitive.
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The user shown value of 100% represents a wider range of actual CPU usage. It could be for example 82-100% real CPU usage = 100% user shown value. The meter hitting 100% does not necessarily mean your output is muted since like you said there are cases where lower or higher CPU will/won't work.

For the user the function of the CPU meter is "how much more stuff can I put in my preset". If it's at 100%, they know they should not try to add more even if it's not muting the output. At the moment we use the 80% marker as that indicator but it's only obvious for experienced users. The exact percentage above 80% is largely irrelevant because it can work or it might fail in different situations as you said. Thus for the user this range can be shown as 100% to tell them "don't try to add more blocks", "try to lower CPU usage" and "you may experience problems".
 
laxu said:
The user shown value of 100% represents a wider range of actual CPU usage. It could be for example 82-100% real CPU usage = 100% user shown value. The meter hitting 100% does not necessarily mean your output is muted since like you said there are cases where lower or higher CPU will/won't work.

For the user the function of the CPU meter is "how much more stuff can I put in my preset". If it's at 100%, they know they should not try to add more even if it's not muting the output. At the moment we use the 80% marker as that indicator but it's only obvious for experienced users. The exact percentage above 80% is largely irrelevant because it can work or it might fail in different situations as you said. Thus for the user this range can be shown as 100% to tell them "don't try to add more blocks", "try to lower CPU usage" and "you may experience problems".
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I understand what you want and why you want it. But if this gets implemented, think of the forum posts:

My preset was running at 100% CPU, and I added a Filter block, and there was enough CPU available to keep it running. So now I'm at, what? 102% CPU??? Can't Fractal make a CPU meter I can trust? One that reflects reality?
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Rex said:
I understand what you want and why you want it. But if this gets implemented, think of the forum posts: "My preset was running at 100% CPU, and I added a Filter block, and there was enough CPU available to keep it running. So now I'm at, what? 102% CPU??? Can't Fractal make a CPU meter I can trust? One that reflects reality?"
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I think those would be fewer than "why is this not working when I should have 16% CPU still left?" You can't account for every situation. The purpose of the CPU meter is really to guide the user in what they can cram into their preset. Tracking the actual CPU usage is mostly useful for Fractal developers.

Ideally the Fractal system would be able to determine if you can add something before you add it so it just disables any options that would overload it. But that's not a reality in its current design. Line6 Helix is able to tell you even on a model by model basis if you can add it or not but since it doesn't have an equivalent for channels it's much easier to do that.

I think the FM3 is a bit of a special case here because it's so much harder to run into those limits on the Axe-Fx 3 and FM9 whereas FM3 does require far more "block Tetris".
 
I see it like the rev counter in cars.... you may could go over the red mark for a short time (lets say 6k rpm) but should not or enigne could stop 🤔
But you are able to see that theoretical the engine can run up to 8k rpm. So even in cars the rev counter do not stop at 6k rpm or only shows this maximum value. And most drivers are able to get it and running the enigne not up to absolute limit. OK there are cars with limiters but most not ;)
 
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Think the whole “problem” would be solved if the CPU usage would be displayed in zones instead of a %.
Could be something like:
Low
Medium
High (up to the point where there is no risk of sound cutting out)
Critical (up to the point where there is a risk of sound cutting out)
Overload (from the point where there is a risk that the unit overloads)
 
Rex said:
What does that mean, though? Does "basically 100%" mean 100%? Or 98%? Or 102%? Or more than one of these?

And what does "around a particular range of real CPU" mean? Does it mean you'll read 100% when the real CPU is running at 82% or 85% or 87%? That seems a bit messy and counterintuitive.
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100% would mean 100%. 98% would mean 98% and 102% would mean 102% and your seriously pushing your luck.
That way 82% would mean 82%. 85% would mean 85% and 87% would mean 87% and no worries.
Either way is fine- it’s just peoples OCD acting out on both sides and I can relate.
Although if someone owed me $100 dollars and then tried giving me $82 and telling me it’s actually fine- just pretend it’s $100-
I think I would feel like- that’s cool whatever man I just need to update/tweak to see if anything in 5.03 helps my leads cut thru ovr another guitarist playing my MV modded Marshall- and by Friday night so that I don’t make all the ladies deaf with merciless volume boosts.🙅‍♀️
Of course less stereo effects would help but then why use the Fractal-
other than someone would have to play thru the Fender with a MetalZone. 🤦‍♀️
 
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We will play some gigs in the near future. For playing live, the new setlist function will be very helpful and I hope, that this feature will be implemented in the FM3 soon. Is there already a schedule for the implementation of this function?
 
Lupo said:
We will play some gigs in the near future. For playing live, the new setlist function will be very helpful and I hope, that this feature will be implemented in the FM3 soon. Is there already a schedule for the implementation of this function?
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I have seen no promises as to when it is coming, only that it is coming.

It's easy enough to build a setlist using FM3 Edit, then couple that with Scene Ignore in this FW and "viola'".
 
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