First Big Gig Axe II: Tips From FOH Guy

first off even the cheapest of mixing consoles have a 100hz hi pass filter that will rid the channel of any out of hand low end. His biased statements of digital vs analog also shows a lack of conventional understanding. I would not listen or give weight to any of his statements since they show a lack of professionalism and knowledge. I have 25 years of live sound engineering experience as well as studio engineering and 35 years of guitar playing. This dude just sounds inexperienced. So there is nothing to learn from him. BS is my vote. lol
 
If you don't usually play through systems with subs, you might not notice that you have a lot of low frequencies in your patches. I also cut everything below about 125 HZ. So far that keeps me out of the subs and my patches translate pretty well to FOH. And IMHO you really don't want to be down there most of the time anyway stomping all over the bass players and drummers low end??
 
Georg80 said:
Hey I followed your discussions and wondered which FRFR cabinets / rigs you are using?
I bought a couple of ATOMIC REACTOR FRFR and they sound completely like crap !!!

Which ones would you recommend?
I'm wondering if it would sound better with a "real" poweramp (e.g. Matrix) and "real" guitar cabs?
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It's all preference... The amp and cab section has a wealth of info so I would start there.
 
Wow. The sound guy miked your woofer, ignored your tweeter, and got a "bass-heavy" signal. Imagine that. :)
 
Rex said:
Wow. The sound guy miked your woofer, ignored your tweeter, and got a "bass-heavy" signal. Imagine that. :)
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but OP said he disconnected that mic and sent an direct signal? Amateur soundguy reply regarding what can/can't be done with a analog/digital setup. Would his reply be the same if he's working in a DAW...?
 
An SM57 in front of FRFR, wrong mike altogether he should have used a different brand, seriously though I used to send a line via XLR to FOH in the early 90s from a Gallien Kreuger. Actually it was the idea of our PA guy, as soon as I got the GK he said great now I don't have to mike the guitar cabs.
Here we are over twenty years later, what can you say...
 
Idiot sound guy who knows more than anyone else. " Naw you can't high pass that digital stuff... I know because I tried before and it didn't work. So I didn't try again today because in the past it didn't work."
 
Sebastian said:
No need for presets. Just turn down the global EQ sliders as needed.
Besides the fact, that it's more the job of the soundguy to work on the signal as needed for the venue - if he's any good at his job, he'll ask you which frequencies to turn down.

Ok, rule o' thumb :) just cut anything below 100-120 Hz. Should remedy most issues in this regard.
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You are right Sebastian..
I always cut off 125 Hz on my guitar channel in my band's mixer (we do our own mixes on digital desk,and give it to main mixer..just to survive "talented" sound guys,who seems to appear more often then expected..)..especially when I play on big stage with huge PA system..Sounds right in most of cases :)
 
HAHAHAA mojo ..

just ignore his blabla i bet he cant hear the difference between a miced up cab and the IR of it going through the axe ..

there are still some ignorant people out there who still believe you only can get a descent sound with a 20yr old marshall british setting through an even older 4x12 box and one simple sm57 in front of it ..

as a guitar player AND FOH i mixed several guitar solutions including miced up cabs, going analog DI (e.g. palmer pdi and stuff) and modeling and i can say u can get good results with all of them but a good modeling rig or DI rig is so much easier to mix if the guitar player has some experience in dialing mix friendly sounds ;)


.. mojo .. gotta remember that for my next argument :D
 
I'll play devil's advocate...

Isn't it so that some filters on the Axe are very steep but not 100% cutoffs?
If the lo-cut were like that, it could explain one of his arguments and he might still hear a bit of too much lows?

And a real moving speaker with real magical air between it and a real functioning mic, why could it in theory not have some different mojo, even if he couldn't hear it? ;)

Of course, I'm much helped by knowing nothing about it :p
 
Had this same issue. Took me about 5-10 minutes to get the guy to just trust me and let me plug his cable in. He finely understood that I wasnt shooting a power amp output down his input line. But it took a while. Oddly enough, will be back at that place this weekend. Wonder if he will remember me ;)
 
It's a shame, but there are still sound folks out there like that!
If the message hasn't already sunk in, that guy was/is clueless.

stratamania said:
An SM57 in front of FRFR, wrong mike altogether he should have used a different brand,
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There's nothing wrong with using an SM57 or a 58 for that matter... the mics will handle 40Hz-15Khz happily. It's not that it's the wrong mic for the job, it's that a single mic won't fully capture the two outputs in a standard FRFR cab unless you set the mic up on a stand about a foot away. That does not generally work in a live setting - too much bleed from other sources.
 
vAmp said:
Isn't it so that some filters on the Axe are very steep but not 100% cutoffs?
If the lo-cut were like that, it could explain one of his arguments and he might still hear a bit of too much lows?
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All filters are like that. There's no filter that sets up a hard wall and won't let any loser frequencies through. It's all about slopes.


vAmp said:
And a real moving speaker with real magical air between it and a real functioning mic, why could it in theory not have some different mojo, even if he couldn't hear it? ;)
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It's impossible to prove that there's not mojo in a speaker, a microphone, or even your dog's toenails—especially when you don't have to explain what "mojo" is. But audio is audio, and it all responds to filtering in the same way. I'll bet the sound guy has no problem EQing audio from a CD, and that's a digital source.[/QUOTE]
 
jimfist said:
Next time, just fake 'em out. Carry your OWN clearly marked SM57 and a claw/Z-bracket so that it is fully on display, mic'ing your "speaker" cabinet. Plug a dummy cable into the mic and have the house sound guy plug into it so he thinks he's mic'ing your cabinet. Then, discretely, take his cable and plug it into an XLR line running off of your AxeFx and say nothing. If you've tweaked things properly for FRFR, the soundguy will never know. The key is to make sure that VISUALLY, there is a mic cable plugged into a microphone so it is not obvious you've made the switch. Just be sure that your stuff DOES work properly. If FOH is getting a fouled up signal, the sound guy will start poking around looking for problems. So, if you do it, make sure you do it right. JMHO.
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this sounds like a lot of effort haha. i usually just unplug the mic thats on stage and plug it into out1 and start playing so that they see signal and hopefully theyre satisfied with the sound that they dont pick a fight about it
 
In my experience, when you run into a sound person like that, it really doesn't matter what you say or do, they have made up their mind and that's the way it is. The more you try to convince them, the more skeptical they get.

But if they have ever mixed keyboards, backing tracks or any number of other sources, then they would not bat an eye at a guitar preamp output.

Richard
 
So, was this anti-digital guy using one of these for his delay needs?

250px-RE201_Transport.JPG
 
I use a low cut in the amp section of 100-125 Hz.
I like bottom end in my patches too, but anything below 100 will step all over the Bass and Bass Drum.
So the 2% of the time when its just you, you'll have a tich less Bass, the other 98% of the time you'll sound awesome.
 
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