Fender FR-12 preamp mod : The Hissterectomy

[Budda]

Pup concerns are not fun! Ours had what seemed to be stomach issues - fortunately im home and can keep an eye on her today.

Best wishes for yours!

 

[∞Fractals]

FWIW (not a vet, don’t play one etc),

For future thought…

We’ve got GSDs, and about a decade ago had a female dog w the same diagnosis… opted to try 6-8 weeks of rest since it was required anyways if post-op.

Healed up fine as far as we could tell. Best wishes for full recovery.

 

[Ken Os]

My Master of all floor devices had 2 torn ACL's as well, he is 13.5 years old now and not giving up control of any of his equipment!!

 

[Rex]

8-12 weeks of slow rehab starting with carrying that nearly 100 lb pup around. It's gonna be rough.

Sounds like you're in it for the long haul. Good luck keeping her off those feet.

Think of how buff you'll be at the end of it.

 

[Fearuvthedark]

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She's coming home this afternoon with a pink satellite dish of a cone. I'm glad she is happy and hasn't chomped on anyone with those teefers.

She’s a pretty pooch, sending all the good doggy and healing vibes!!

 

[PSea]

Our Ukrainian head of Security Reese had doggy orthopedic surgery today on both back knees. She tore ACLs and the meniscus on both sides. She got 2 TPLO tibia reshaping procedures done at once. She is doing good and will be home in the next 2 days for a long recovery.

Thoughts, prayers, and good doggy vibes much appreciated.

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gorgeous pup! i have a chocolate lab. my true love!

 

[LolainNB]

Love dogs. Get well soon pooch.

Also I apologize for not being around lately. Being playing lots since I installed the V2.

 

[Budda]

@WKSmith how’s pupper today?

As I continue to collect 412s I will have a 212 not in use. Apparently my local store has a demo FR-10. I dont expect they will give me much for my 212 (but a used 1960A is $1100cad there iirc) so I will likely trade it towards that. Then its a case of where do I put it

 

[WKSmith]

@WKSmith how’s pupper today?

As I continue to collect 412s I will have a 212 not in use. Apparently my local store has a demo FR-10. I dont expect they will give me much for my 212 (but a used 1960A is $1100cad there iirc) so I will likely trade it towards that. Then its a case of where do I put it

She's already feeling and walking better than before the surgery.
I am also running out of room for cabs. That's an awesome thing

 

[JTI]

Gigged the FR with Liam's preamp upgrade Friday night for the first time. Everything was loud and clear and smooth sounding. VERY pleased. Would love to see the preamp with a high power power amp to use with my Celestion F12 cabs.

 

[davi_ssilva]

Hey guys, now that it seems that there's some of you that have both FR10 and FR12 with the mighty V2 board, I'd love some insight comparing those two regarding:

• sound quality (EQ, fidelity, "boomy-ness" and stuff like that)
• sound feel (that "amp in the room" mojo stuff)
• power (the overal volume as a backline audio source in a live band scenario)

Now I have the opportunity to finally get an FR for myself for a fair price, but I didn't have the oportunity do compare them side by side, nor to play them at great volume or in a live band scenario, so I'm kind of clueless about those things.

Considering that I have no problems with the size/weight differences, which would be the better solution for my case (a mix of home/live playing: classic rock, contemporary blues-rock, a lot of 80's stuff and some modern metal/prog), the FR-10 or the FR-12?

 

[Beexter]

I haven't tried an FR12 but given the amount of bass my FR-10 kicks out,
I've no desire to. I'm still waiting for my name to reach the top of the waitlist for a V2 preamp so mine is an unadulterated version, lacking even the factory "stealth" update.

 

[WKSmith]

@davi_ssilva
The difference to me personally has nothing to do with the low end. The bottom sounds almost identical with the V2 pre. They slam. Probably way too much.

The difference I'm getting is a slightly scooped upper mid frequency in the 12 that is nice and silky and very musical. I'm guessing it is from the high end roll off of the 12 vs the 10. I am hoping my used 12 coming in this week is exactly like my first hissy FR.
I want a matched pair of those.

 

[davi_ssilva]

@davi_ssilva
The difference to me personally has nothing to do with the low end. The bottom sounds almost identical with the V2 pre. They slam. Probably way too much.

The difference I'm getting is a slightly scooped upper mid frequency in the 12 that is nice and silky and very musical. I'm guessing it is from the high end roll off of the 12 vs the 10. I am hoping my used 12 coming in this week is exactly like my first hissy FR.
I want a matched pair of those.

So, are you saying that the difference is really small, but the 10 is kinda "flatter" (FRFR-ish) whereas the 12 sounds a tiny bit more like a conventional guitar cab?

 

[Chewie5150]

refresh my memory if I've missed it in this thread...why did F-Corp make the stock pres 180 degrees out phase to the input? and what audible effect does this have? I was reviewing the V2 manual in preparation for my boards arriving this week! so out of phase vs in phase...I am not versed in electronic circuit design. Is the reason for phase inversion vs not to do with any audible benefit or more an efficiency consideration in the design of the circuit?

 

[WKSmith]

refresh my memory if I've missed it in this thread...why did F-Corp make the stock pres 180 degrees out phase to the input? and what audible effect does this have? I was reviewing the V2 manual in preparation for my boards arriving this week! so out of phase vs in phase...I am not versed in electronic circuit design. Is the reason for phase inversion vs not to do with any audible benefit or more an efficiency consideration in the design of the circuit?

I am certain it was just another mistake in their pre design, unless the TMP is also out of phase. Surely not.

It isn't a huge problem until you try to play the stock FR along with a tube amp or another FR with the V2 in it ..then the cancellation and comb filtering of lots of frequencies becomes apparent while it sucks the bass out of the room.

So, are you saying that the difference is really small, but the 10 is kinda "flatter" (FRFR-ish) whereas the 12 sounds a tiny bit more like a real cab?

I guess you could call the 10 flatter sounding. The difference is very small, but I think the highs are a little sweeter on my 12... Probably in the 3k range where our ears are really sensitive as it gets close to the resonant freq of our ear canal.

 

[Chewie5150]

I wonder if all stock FR's are still out of phase design or is there any inconsistency? reason I wonder that is initially when i went through a few cabs deciding which ones I wanted....I had a pair together that sounded like really bad comb filtering going on...so wonder if its possible one was in and the other was out of phase....i can't verify now as those cabs are gone but had me curious

 

[davi_ssilva]

I am certain it was just another mistake in their pre design, unless the TMP is also out of phase. Surely not.

It isn't a huge problem until you try to play the stock FR along with a tube amp or another FR with the V2 in it ..then the cancellation and comb filtering of lots of frequencies becomes apparent while it sucks the bass out of the room.



I guess you could call the 10 flatter sounding. The difference is very small, but I think the highs are a little sweeter on my 12... Probably in the 3k range where our ears are really sensitive as it gets close to the resonant freq of our ear canal.

Awesome answer from you, as usual! I've tried both at different stores, but both tests were short, done in less than ideal conditions, and weeks apart from each other, so I can't really compare them.

I'm more interested in a sweeter sound for real world use and fun, since I've already have studio monitors for the moments when I'm looking for just sheer acuracy during my tone shapping process.

So I guess I'll get the 12 then! Thanks a lot!

 

[WKSmith]

I wonder if all stock FR's are still out of phase design or is there any inconsistency? reason I wonder that is initially when i went through a few cabs deciding which ones I wanted....I had a pair together that sounded like really bad comb filtering going on...so wonder if its possible one was in and the other was out of phase....i can't verify now as those cabs are gone but had me curious

Of the three stock preamps I have here, they all use the same preamp board. The FR10 boards are missing several components that the FR12 has.. but the preamp boards are all the same revision # and date. Even the stealth half fixed ones. They all are out of phase with the input.

There may be some other versions out there, but I haven't seen or heard of any other preamp used in the FRs yet.

 

[Beexter]

Of the three stock preamps I have here, they all use the same preamp board. The FR10 boards are missing several components that the FR12 has.. but the preamp boards are all the same revision # and date. Even the stealth half fixed ones. They all are out of phase with the input.

There may be some other versions out there, but I haven't seen or heard of any other preamp used in the FRs yet.

@WKSmith - just out of interest, what components are missing from the FR10 boards and why would they be different to the FR12 given your V2 is the same for both variants?
Also, regarding the phase issue, do you think the stock preamps were designed that way for a reason? My electronics knowledge is very limited but I just want to understand the logic. Could they not have just reversed the speaker connections during assembly to resolve it or is it not that simple?