Axe-Fx III Firmware 29.00 Public Beta

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My name is mud said:
You have no bass, no warmess , lifeless. Weak …

And if you hit too hard it is a crunch to me, that is distorted ..
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How quiet are you running the master ?? “No bass, weak” that’s a tube amp that doesnt have the power section running yet, pick a brand and I can reproduce that result.

“If you hit hard it crunches” yes this is the picking dynamics people claim modellers dont have :) and softer is cleaner.

Not saying you have to like the amp at all. I know you’re a scrutizing guy. But a guy who was running juiced superleads designed an amp to get that sound - which is why its largely a superlead on clean and crunch :).
 
Everyone obviously has better hearing than I do. I don’t always hear the difference. I load every new update.

Fractal demonstrates a singular focus toward improving the modeled characteristics of real materials, components and circuits, and therefore increasingly accurate models over time. Frequent small incremental changes make more sense than less frequent, grand changes.

My point here, is that I absolutely cannot quantify (hear) how different each firmware sounds. But over time, my Fractal gear improves. I can report, that I haven’t had any issues with the beta update. Also, it’s been years since I have rewired a pedalboard, lol.
 
swass said:
Sounds mucho good. Any chance you'd post the preset? Wouldn't mind running this down the drag strip a few times. Just to clarify, "drag strip" as in "top fuel".
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thanks , the preset is Here. :D

It consists of 2 scenes,

I matched the first scene with the feeling I used in the recording yesterday by recalling my memory.

Since I recorded the 2900test sample and turned it off without saving, the gain or tone brightness may be slightly different. However, you can adjust it to your taste.

Try the second scene too. It's still a work in progress, but I think you'll like it. The attached sound sample was recorded with the second scene.

Thank you.
(*Just in case, I'll also attach the file exported as IR with tonematch.;))





 
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francis said:
thanks , the preset is Here. :D

It consists of 2 scenes,

I matched the first scene with the feeling I used in the recording yesterday by recalling my memory.

Since I recorded the 2900test sample and turned it off without saving, the gain or tone brightness may be slightly different. However, you can adjust it to your taste.

Try the second scene too. It's still a work in progress, but I think you'll like it. The attached sound sample was recorded with the second scene.

Thank you.
(*Just in case, I'll also attach the file exported as IR with tonematch.;))

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EXELLENT! Thank you. Will give it a hard workout.
 
biggness said:
This take is a bit much, man lol

Price doesn’t equate tone. The 5150/6505 is probably the most recorded metal amp in history for a reason. It’s raw, aggressive, and cuts through a mix better than most. If it was all about price, then I guess Andy Sneap, Colin Richardson, and half of the 2000s metal scene were too broke to afford a Mesa? The “cheap amp” argument falls flat when that same amp defined the sound of an entire generation of heavy records. Spectacular tone doesn’t always come with a boutique label or a $3K price tag.
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Well said! Some of my favorite recorded tones came from affordable gear. For example, people have been trying to replicate Josh Homme’s iconic sound for years, which, surprisingly, was created using a Peavey Decade.
 
biggness said:
This take is a bit much, man lol

Price doesn’t equate tone. The 5150/6505 is probably the most recorded metal amp in history for a reason. It’s raw, aggressive, and cuts through a mix better than most. If it was all about price, then I guess Andy Sneap, Colin Richardson, and half of the 2000s metal scene were too broke to afford a Mesa? The “cheap amp” argument falls flat when that same amp defined the sound of an entire generation of heavy records. Spectacular tone doesn’t always come with a boutique label or a $3K price tag.
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Sorry but to me they sound bad, they are undefined, not tight at all ( when it is what you are looking for doing metal), full of buzzes because of the poor soldering . In a band if one guy got a peavey and the other a rectifier, the guy with the peavy will cry in his father’s pants after the show

I use the peavy’s to sell Mesa’s back in the day in the store.

You put the Mesa at four, do a palm mute, and the whole room was shaking, the devil appear from The ground , blood in the wall etc 🤣

Cough

Joking.

That’s not the metal tone I like . That’s for nu métal, metalcore etc. I’m more in thrash tones

But at first, what I was trying to say amongst other, is that I don’t recognize the 5150 I know in the axe fx. The rest is a matter of taste 👅
 
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My name is mud said:
Sorry but to me they sound bad, they are undefined, not tight at all ( when it is what you are looking for doing metal), full of buzzes because of the poor soldering . In a band if one guy got a peavey and the other a rectifier, the guy with the peavy will cry in his father’s pants after the show

I use the peavy’s to sell Mesa’s back in the day in the store.

You put the Mesa at four, do a palm mute, and the whole room was shaking, the devil appear from The ground , blood in the wall etc 🤣

Cough

Joking.

That’s not the metal tone I like . That’s for nu métal, metalcore etc. I’m more in thrash tones
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I kinda fall on the opposite end of this, lol.

Back when I was touring all anybody used was either Rectos or 5150s/6505s, and the Peaveys s--t all over the Mesas all day long. Maybe it was the circles I ran in and the specific players I was involved with, idunno. A Dual and a 5150 was the setup my own band used for years, and it was just a never-ending battle with the Dual to keep it under control and not sound like doo-doo.

I grew up on thrash as well, and every single time I plugged into a Rectifier it sounded like an unwashed overweight chimpanzee's a--hole. Getting a good tone out of a 5150 was a piece of cake (aside from the extremely touchy post-gain.. they were always insanely loud and drowned out the Mesa), I was never successfully able to make a Dual or Triple Rec sound decent, no matter what signal chain I put it through. Could never understand why they were so popular. The idea that a Recto could somehow be perceived as "tighter" than a 5150/6505 just.. that's a new one to me. Not sure I've ever encountered somebody who's made that argument tbh.

Now, the Mark series... that's the sound of thrash IMO. Much easier to dial in and get something usable.

I'll 100% agree that 5150s are the sound of metalcore, but nu-metal? Nah man that's Dual Rectifier all the way. At least in my experience in the SoCal metal scene in the mid-90s to late 2000s.

But ultimately.. there's no right/wrong. Just vibes, really. Like what you like, use what makes you happy. And hell, s--t on products you don't like, sure. But don't s--t on people for liking something you don't like. I'm not sayin you are, it's just a general thing I like to remind people. I got nothin' but respect for your playing and enjoy your videos, keep on thrashin' 🤘

But at first, what I was trying to say amongst other, is that I don’t recognize the 5150 I know in the axe fx. The rest is a matter of taste.
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With you on this 100%. On both points. The current 6160 Block model doesn't feel like the 5150 BLs I've known and loved.
 
@rossipedia yes by default a rectifier is not tight at all, but with an od 👍🏻. And yes that’s why I switch to the jp, because the mark are tighter by default, with the rectifiers you are obliged to add an od boost to do that

About the comparaison in the room of both stacks, the rectifier was louder and got more mids and presence . With the drums the peavy vanished for what I remember…. Well it was the old days … days when the sound guys just need to set the vocals and drums in the PA because the amps on stage where loud enough for the audience haha . Good old days .
 
rossipedia said:
I'm out with my kids atm, but I'll make sure to sit down and try to articulate as best I can later this evening.

I'm also entirely open to it being an issue with me not knowing exactly how to dial it in just yet with these new changes.
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I think that every metal heads when they first try a rectifier feels disappointed.

Because you see all this bands with it with a good tone and when you try it at first you have huge amount of bass, the palm mute are muddy, in modern mode you have a crazy amount of bees and high that jump in your face, it took me soooo long to dial them . And the day I discovered the maxon 808 od with it : that’s it ! (Also it work with whatever tubescreamer too)

You turn the bass to 1 or 2 - mids as you want - treble at 4 . Gain at 5 or 6 with the maxon. You put a noise gate in the loop and you are set . Killer tone .

But with a jp dont dont need all of that, it sounds good very quickly . A rectifier is a truck lol

Also I prefer the vintage mode in rectifiers, the orange one
 
rossipedia said:
I'm out with my kids atm, but I'll make sure to sit down and try to articulate as best I can later this evening.

I'm also entirely open to it being an issue with me not knowing exactly how to dial it in just yet with these new changes.
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I only change things in the name of accuracy. The latest changes improve the accuracy of the bias excursion. In general this means less bias excursion for low frequencies which means "tighter" tones and palm mutes. It depends on the particular amp though. Some amps will be essentially unaffected by the new algorithm. The 5150 is mostly unaffected. There may be a tiny difference but I doubt it's audible.

I actually made measurements of the bias excursion of the 5150 before and after and there is very little difference.

The most useful thing would be clips comparing the model to an actual amp. If you feel your amp is significantly different than the model then we would be happy to analyze your amp and compare it to our reference amp. Perhaps there is a problem with our reference amp. I doubt it because the model required very little tweaking compared to the model based on the schematic. You would have to pay shipping both ways though.
 
FractalAudio said:
Can you put into words what is wrong. I've made every measurement known to man and done listening tests for hours and the model matches our reference amp nearly perfectly IMO.
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Ok so my initial gut reaction was centered around the response in two areas:
  • hi-gain pick attack feeling less responsive
  • low / low-mid build-up ("mud")

Poking around at my A/B and tossing an analyzer on the null-test seems to somewhat validate this, as it shows a couple bumps:

  • ~80hz - 150hz
  • ~2.5k -5k

Now I know that a null test is of limited value and we can't really tell from it which of the two sounds is adding or removing the content in those areas, it just tells us what's different between the two sounds. I also realize some level of difference is expected due to the non-linear nature of this kind of modeling.

But it does feel like the sound of the null test is representative of the kind of differences I'm hearing: a somewhat flubby buildup in the low/low-mid area, and a reduction in response of the upper-mids / pick attack area.

Thinking about it, I might be able to tweak some things to get back to my happy place (and is probably why a low cut at 120hz in the Input EQ section helps, as it eliminates that low-mid build up before the gain stages).

I hope that's helpful. And thank you once again for your community engagement, and everything you and everybody at Fractal does for your users.



The most useful thing would be clips comparing the model to an actual amp.
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Unfortunately I no longer have any of my previous BL heads :( just the 6505+ combo, which is definitely not the same. Although... it might be worth dusting it off and hooking up my old analog chain to see if it's actually an issue or just a ghost in the shell, so to speak...
 
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FractalAudio said:
https://www.fractalaudio.com/downlo...xe-fx-3/29p0/axefxiii_dsp_rel_29p00_beta1.zip

Axe-Fx III Firmware Release Notes​


29.00

Improved Amp block preamp modeling. Most amp models have been updated as a result. Audition presets and adjust as necessary.

Changed name of Supro 1695T to Supro Black Magick at Supro’s request.

Fixed switching from Supro Black Magick model to certain models using the editor can cause a crash.

Various other fixes and improvements.
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Fractal is the best. At everything really.
 
Burgs said:
This is great, Cliff. Thank you. I'm noticing more detail in the classic Marshalls and greater distinction between things like the Plexi 50W High 1 & 2 where I guess those preamp improvements would come into play. Off to write a few new patches... Thanks again.
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cant wait to hear em. I always get your patches edit: I grabbed the mixed bag patch and it sounds great. The marshalls do sound more "open" to me, but might just be placebo. The mids feel less like a wall of frequencies, but again.. probably placebo.
 
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My name is mud said:
@rossipedia yes by default a rectifier is not tight at all, but with an od 👍🏻. And yes that’s why I switch to the jp, because the mark are tighter by default, with the rectifiers you are obliged to add an od boost to do that

About the comparaison in the room of both stacks, the rectifier was louder and got more mids and presence . With the drums the peavy vanished for what I remember…. Well it was the old days … days when the sound guys just need to set the vocals and drums in the PA because the amps on stage where loud enough for the audience haha . Good old days .
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People boost 5150s for more tightness and mid shift too. If you want a tight high gain head, the trick is less gain. Most metal guys dont use less gain ;)

Im thinking bands you saw didnt know how to eq for the band. Common problem for smaller acts and newer acts.

I had a spider ii halfstack seem louder than my jsx, but i wouldnt have called it a better tone yknow?

Some nostalgia and early biases in your posts on this one imo. We all have our experiences, they’re worth sharing.

Curious re “5150 sounds off” going forward. Im sure a few forumites have enough real ones to compare :)
 
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