Are power conditioners snake oil?

Velokki

Velokki

Inspired
Do I need one? Does it really do anything? Any PROOF of it doing anything?

I have seen countless Axe FX II setups with power conditioners in them, but I'm very skeptical towards getting one - if it does actually improve Axe's performance/sound/safety, then I could consider getting one, but it just doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. I feel it is just money + 1 rack space wasted. Are there any reported cases of an Axe FX failing, where the situation could have been remedied with a power conditioner?

Or are they just snake oil?
 
Dont need one in the UK. Possibly elsewhere - depends on the stability/reliability/consistence of the mains supply.

It helps with protection from surges of course - but a cheap surge protection 4 way will do the same job.
 
It depends on which one you buy. Most of the basic ones are just surge protectors.

Where it or any surge protector can help is to protect from voltage spikes. The surge protector rather than the other equipment will take the hit.

Another thing many power conditioners do is give you a voltage reading. This can be very helpful if there is something wrong with the amount of voltage at a venue.
We were having all sorts of equipment problems at a venue. Finally, I looked over at my rack and say the we were only getting 96 volts instead of 120. That can really screw up some equipment.

I like the rack form factor.
 
We use to rehearse in a place that would dim when the A/C came on, and often I lost all of my presets in my rack system. I would then have to go unit by unit using a sequencer to reload them, it took a long time. I purchased a Furman line conditioner and never had an issue again, still using it today. I'm not talking the surge protector thing, I mean the $700 AR-1215.
 
+1 Luke. And the foremost thing that power-conditioners do is to filter any DC out from the A/C. Apart from being a stable and convenient strip that makes the A/C routing neat and sturdy inside the rack.
 
I've been having the same thoughts myself seeing as how many users here fit them into their racks here as a matter of course. I work in electronics, mostly industrial control and before that I worked for Amek and built some huge mixers back in the 90s. In my opinion and experience in the UK at least, I can't think of a single situation where one of these would of made the slightest bit of difference. My home and workplace etc are full of cheap electronic products that rarely fall over from bad mains, it's usually bad design. We don't need them on our valuable consumer goods, we don't use them to protect our PCs and laptops that contain all our important data. Could it be that they are 19" wide and fill a rack space? And by the way, you can achieve the same thing yourself with a handful of cheap components from an electronics store.
 
POB said:
I've been having the same thoughts myself seeing as how many users here fit them into their racks here as a matter of course. I work in electronics, mostly industrial control and before that I worked for Amek and built some huge mixers back in the 90s. In my opinion and experience in the UK at least, I can't think of a single situation where one of these would of made the slightest bit of difference. My home and workplace etc are full of cheap electronic products that rarely fall over from bad mains, it's usually bad design. We don't need them on our valuable consumer goods, we don't use them to protect our PCs and laptops that contain all our important data. Could it be that they are 19" wide and fill a rack space? And by the way, you can achieve the same thing yourself with a handful of cheap components from an electronics store.
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My PC is certainly protected by a battery backup and line conditioner. A lot of people use them. All my expensive electronics go through a surge protector. Lightning strikes are always a possibility here in Colorado.
 
javajunkie said:
My PC is certainly protected by a battery backup and line conditioner. A lot of people use them. All my expensive electronics go through a surge protector. Lightning strikes are always a possibility here in Colorado.
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+1. As for lightning, I've even had home networking gear fried by lightning-induced current in my twisted pair wiring.

While surge suppression is important for non-tube electronics, I'm not inclined to use my tube amps without voltage regulation. Line voltage can vary quite a lot: my home runs 128-131 while other places I've played have been 118 or less.

Since my current A rig isn't very sensitive to voltage variations (AxeFx runs down to 100V and the switching power supplies in most Class D amps can handle reasonable voltage swings gracefully), I have a Carvin power unit in my rack instead of my Furman regulator. It tells me what the voltage is and provides sequential startup and shutdown to minimize pops. It's also a good bit lighter than the Furman. :)
 
javajunkie said:
All my expensive electronics go through a surge protector. Lightning strikes are always a possibility here in Colorado.
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Did you really think that 2 cm part would stop what three miles of sky could not? That is your reasoning. Somehow its few hundreds joules will absorb destructive transients that are hundreds of thousands of joules. Advertising has successfully deceived you.

Line conditioners for noise must weight tens of kilograms. Only then can it equal and maybe exceed filtering already inside electronics. Unfortunately many see a subjective advertising claim (no spec numbers). That proves their system has better sound.

Monster plays this game. They sold speaker wire with one end marked "amp" and the other marked "speaker". Many could 'hear' the different when wires were reversed. So Monster sold that $7 speaker wire for $70. So many knew it was better (because is was more expensive).

Battery backup does nothing to protect PC hardware. Otherwise manufacturer numbers that defined that protection are posted. Good luck. They only claim to protect hardware from anomalies already made irrelevant by what is inside all electronics - including dimmer switches, RFCIs/RCDs, and CFL bulbs.

Most failures (even in cheap electronics) are manufacturing defects. How many then 'know' it was destroyed by a surge? Most do not know how robust all electronics really are. For example, normal voltage for electronics is even when incandescent bulbs dim to 50% intensity. A 120 volt UPS can output 200 volt square waves with a spike up to 270 volts. Even that does not harm hardware.

Protection adjacent to electronics is already inside electronics. Your concern is the rare anomaly that can overwhelm that protection. That solution must be where utility wires enter the building. And within feet (or meters) of single point earth ground. Do you need it? These typically destructive anomalies are maybe once every seven years. Even less often in the UK. But you must decided based upon local conditions and history (at least the last ten years).
 
Though I agree that there is questionable value in the surge protection aspect; I see significant value in the form factor of these:

- keeps ac connections neat and tidy inside rack case.
- most provide convenient front facing ac socket.
- many provide back and front lighting.
- accessible front facing main power switch.

I can't imagine stuffing a standard power bar in the back of my rack to save 1u rack space. I got the cheapest Furman for 80$ - worth it in my view.
 
westom said:
Did you really think that 2 cm part would stop what three miles of sky could not? That is your reasoning. Somehow its few hundreds joules will absorb destructive transients that are hundreds of thousands of joules. Advertising has successfully deceived you.
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That reasoning only applies if the lightning strikes the device. The 2cm part will clamp voltage coming through the line.

If you don't understand that lightning can cause surges in power lines, I don't think it would be a good use of time to address the other non-sequitur components of your post. :(
 
aleclee said:
That reasoning only applies if the lightning strikes the device. The 2cm part will clamp voltage coming through the line.

If you don't understand that lightning can cause surges in power lines, I don't think it would be a good use of time to address the other non-sequitur components of your post. :(
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Hey, we are not talking about worst case scenario like a Carrington Event (Google). But being somehow prepared for DC-components, RFI etc. Andd, again, convenience.
 
I've had one in my rack since the very beginning, all the way up to my "fridge" rack which was 16 spaces. One button turn on, looks nice, more professional, and has lights when i'm in the dark.
 
We had a major lighting storm here in lockport ny two nights ago. I unplugged my axe fx and all my other gear. I did not unplug my pc, big mistake my computer was completely crashed and I had to perform a rebuild it. I wish I would have had it on a back up system that way I could have shut I down smoothly and wouldn't have lost allot of important files. Lesson learned once again make sure everything s backed up including your Axe Fx presets. You never know what will happen and we all know how long it takes to create the guitar tone we all search for.
 
aleclee said:
That reasoning only applies if the lightning strikes the device. The 2cm part will clamp voltage coming through the line.

If you don't understand that lightning can cause surges in power lines, I don't think it would be a good use of time to address the other non-sequitur components of your post. :(
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exactly.

And my battery back up is to take my PC down gracefully in the event of a power outage rather than going do hard and having the potential to leave my file system in an inconsistent state.
 
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One other thing to consider with lightning strikes is that a lot of these companies will provide a warranty against damage and if you file an insurance claim it could help to demonstrate that precautions were taken. Plus there are other things besides a 18GW lightning surge that could possibly happen.

But to be really frank about power conditioners I bought one of the Monster 3500's which actually regulates the power and filters it and all kinds of cool shit on paper. Plugged the AxeFXII into and about 20 minutes later the power supply in the AxeFXII gave up the ghost. Way too much of a coincidence to me. Sent that thing back to Musician's Friend and I'll just keep using my little furman PL8 with the goofy lights on it that I had to have that I have never used. :)
 
javajunkie said:
My PC is certainly protected by a battery backup and line conditioner. A lot of people use them. All my expensive electronics go through a surge protector. Lightning strikes are always a possibility here in Colorado.
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Same here. We live in an area with lots of trees and the power lines are constantly being broken. It beats on any electronic device when there are spikes, surges and disruptions.
 
The main reason I use one is that it provides convenient power sockets to connect my other devices such as my wireless without having loads of cables running down the back of my speakers to the outlet. :D
 
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