Happy new Star Wars day!

What was wrong with admiral "it's a trap!"??

I was bummed that Admiral Ackbar was killed and they just sort of 'noted' it...I thought his death deserved more screentime/respect.

The only good characters in the movie are luke and kylo. Rey is okay and actually gets things done, but she lacks depth compared to the other two, and has no real character flaws to make her interesting. Can you imagine Rey being tempted by the dark side? Nope!

Rey is too perfect, has no flaws, doesn't overcome any struggles, etc. Perfect is boring. Not a character I find interesting at all.

Lot's of really uncompelling, and/or useless, annoying, and shoehorned in characters with nothing really to do throughout (Finn, Rose, Phasma, Holdo) IMO.

I'm not invested in any of the new characters at all, and they certainly don't have the 'magic' team vibe that Luke/Leia/Han/Chewie/C3P0/R2D2 had.

It gave off a lot of political vibes. This wasn't subtle and seemed forced, which was distracting from the actual story. There was also an over abundance of stupid motivational happy feelings speeches.

Rose was outright annoying (even more so then Jar Jar for me...yes, really lol!); she is like an Ewok that can talk. Her speeches/agenda were too in your face for me and lacked subtlety. I felt like cooking up and eating a Unicorn after I listened to her preachy babble o_O
 
Last edited:
I was bummed that Admiral Ackbar was killed and they just sort of 'noted' it...I thought his death deserved more screentime/respect.

I liked it. That was a very realistic moment in my opinion. In a military organization (the rebellion/resistance is one) if the death of a senior leader in battle is any more than noted and adjusted for, chain of command and seniority were not followed, that's a sign of disorganization and weakness. Instead you saw professionalism, leadership and high speed low drag semper gumby (always flexible). A quality military organization is never dependent on any one individual (or even several). Conversely, any military organization that cannot quickly adjust to losses at any level is doomed to failure.

If you want to mourn Ackbar, you do it on your own time, not in the middle of a fight. Have some Admiral Ackbar cereal with rainbow marshmallows and imitation crab meat. Your tongue can't repel flavor of that magnitude.
 
I liked it. That was a very realistic moment in my opinion. In a military organization (the rebellion/resistance is one) if the death of a senior leader in battle is any more than noted and adjusted for, chain of command and seniority were not followed, that's a sign of disorganization and weakness. Instead you saw professionalism, leadership and high speed low drag semper gumby (always flexible). A quality military organization is never dependent on any one individual (or even several). Conversely, any military organization that cannot quickly adjust to losses at any level is doomed to failure.

Hmmm yea, true enough...I definitely see and agree with your points. I just wish they could have paid him a bit of a homage at some point. I loved Admiral Ackbar.

If you want to mourn Ackbar, you do it on your own time, not in the middle of a fight. Have some Admiral Ackbar cereal with rainbow marshmallows and imitation crab meat. Your tongue can't repel flavor of that magnitude.

I literally laughed out loud when I read that...good one...:cool:
 
I really enjoyed it. To me, they captured the SW universe perfectly - gorgeous planets, wacky animals, ridiculous characters, cringy humor. The soundtrack is amazing - even the bit where it just goes silent for a couple of seconds - blew me away.
 
Just watched the Phantom Menace again yesterday. I really am starting to have love for the prequals. They are not nearly as bad as people have made them out to be. I believe they are better than the latest 2 movies released. Better stories and scripts and things tie in with characters you care about.
 
Just watched the Phantom Menace again yesterday. I really am starting to have love for the prequals. They are not nearly as bad as people have made them out to be. I believe they are better than the latest 2 movies released. Better stories and scripts and things tie in with characters you care about.

Yep!
tdihy0engekkegs7oplv.jpg


I wish they'd do a "Spaceballs" type movie with Jar Jar...:D
 
Last edited:
Took the wife and my teenage boys to see the movie today.
I'm going to say - I thought it was awesome. Loved it.
The scene with Leia was a little odd , but , she's got the force , of course.
I was a slight bit worried , with all the bad press around here. 2 thumbs up from me.
 
The bad press is from the sadder mother's-basement dwellers that take this stuff way too seriously.
It has to be this.
It can't be that.
That's not the story I wanted.
This doesn't make sense.
That makes too much sense.
What did that whole thing have to do with anything?
Why did they not have sound in that scene?
Why didn't they just do this/that/the other thing?


Ugh. It's a frakkin' space movie FFS. Turn your brain off for a minute and just enjoy it.
 
The people who don't like this movie are wrong.

Sit yo ass down'. We gon' do you some learning. I've had to break this post into 2 different posts because I exceeded the character limit. Get yourself a coffee and be ready for some high-level nerd stuff from a film teacher.

First of all: There will be no mentioning of the prequels from this moment on. Jesus Christ people. Those movies are appalling. Super quick: Here's a few questions for you:
1) Who is the main character in Episode 1? (Trick question: There isn't one)
2) Without referring to their job title or what they look like, describe one of the characters from the prequel.
3) Who were the Trade Federation? Who were the Seperatists? Why were they doing anything?

I could go on. However the amount of appalling plot holes, atrocious acting, the love story, the complete lack of characterisation, the fact that every dialogue scene in all 3 films were shot the exact same way with almost no emotion or urgency put into the lines...all of it is an unmitigated disaster of film.

Now that the filth is out of the way, let's get to what makes The Last Jedi amazing. It certainly isn't perfect but the things it does right, it knocks out of the fucking park.

Let's look at the context of this film. No piece of art exists in a vacuum and everything always needs to be taken into context. For a series, we don't have to look at the political climate as such, moreso we have to look at the public perception of the series.

Since the prequels were that bad and the fact that Disney had bought Star Wars, they needed to restore faith in the franchise to repair the damage done by the prequels. The very first line of The Force Awakens was: "This will begin to make things right." On top of that, Disney needed to prove that it can play with Star Wars without fucking things up. They needed to convince the hardcore crowd that they could make a typical Star Wars movie without fucking it up.

And that's what Episode 7 was. It was effectively a clone of A New Hope but that's what it needed to be. That was Disney and the new guys convincing the old guard that it can play with Star Wars without ruining your childhood. Episode 7 has a few misses as well, but the overall point of the movie was that they can do all the Star Wars stuff that you love like X-Wings and The Force and Lightsabers and scary bad guys and superweapons and huge "WHAT THE FUCK" moments without fucking it all up.

So what was the deal with Episode 8?

Well in case you haven't noticed: Mark Hamill is old. Harrison Ford is old and aaaaaaalways hated Star Wars. Carrie Fischer...has become one with The Force. No matter how much the old guard and the audience in general would have loved to see it, if they are going to continue the saga of Star Wars, they can't keep rolling out the old characters. At some point in time, we need to let go of Han, Luke and Leia. They can't just drop those legendary characters and move on without some sort of transition.

And that's what this movie was all about: Transition.

BIG ASS SPOILERS FROM HERE. I ASSUME YOU HAVE SEEN THE FILM.

This movie can be summarised with Luke's very first moment in this movie. He looks at his old Lightsaber, something which every human being on the planet thinks is cool as shit. And he just throws it away.

That's what this movie is doing.

It's acknowledging your cool stuff, but then getting rid of it in order to open the door to new and exciting things.

What Luke, Ren and Yoda are trying to do in this movie is kill the past, destroy the mythos and deal with reality. Deal with what's right in front of your nose rather than getting swept up in old legends and stuff. That was all meant for the audience as much as it was the characters. Star Wars is legendary, everybody has romantacised ideas about what it is in their heads. This movie is asking you to let go of the mythos so that the series can continue. Otherwise Star Wars couldn't do anything except be a rehash of 1950s adventure movies with pure good vs pure evil and nothing in between. Then you would all complain that the New Star Wars movies are just a rehash of the old ones which is what everybody did with Episode 7 anyway. Even though that's exactly what Episode 7 had to be.

So this movie (as flat-out stated by several characters) was about is letting go of the past and creating something new. As stated, it's impossible to continuously roll out Luke, Han and Leia for other films, so this is the transition movie.

And what they did to make that happen is that they forced you to focus on all the flaws of our favourite characters and idealogies and even conventions set up by the old Star Wars movies. People complain that Luke was a grumpy old fart instead of Space Jesus. Luke Skywalker was (is?) my childhood hero. Even I was confused by his lack of Jesusness. However all the "negative" traits we saw in him were things that we saw in previous films.

Let's have a look at what they did with Luke, because it's my favourite part of the film (almost)

In terms of his lack of jesus-ness, let's look at his personality. In Empire Strikes Back, he runs off to save Leia and Han and get his hand chopped off on the strength of a Force vision. He trusts these things explicitly. Thus when he gets a Force vision about Ben Solo, yet I believe he would act on it and trust it explicitly. Luke has shown himself to be impulsive and flipping his shit. In Return of The Jedi, he flipped out and nearly killed his Dad. Luke had been shown to be impatient, but also easily crushed when his ideas failed (As in most of his training with Yoda in Empire Strikes Back).

SO. Let's have a look at his actions now. BIG BASTARD OF A SPOILER. LAST WARNING YA JERK. For a moment, Luke goes to kill Ben based on a Force vision. This is his trust, his impulsiveness and kinda his insecurity coming through which we have seen in previous movies.

However it's also because at that stage, Luke was aware of the "Legend of Luke Skywalker" (add delay\reverb). Luke Skywalker was Jedi Jesus! The bringer of light and destroyer of darkness in the galaxy wherever it may be found. Not only was he going to kill Ben due to the negative character traits which we've seen in the other movies, he was doing it TO LIVE UP TO HIS MYTHOS.

Until he realises that it's all bullshit.

Ben wakes up and the next sequence of events is fairly straightforward as to how\why Ben became Kylo etc. However this is also the moment that Luke came to the conclusions which he "taught" Rey during the movie. This is when he deemed the Jedi a failure. Luke explained that to regard the Jedi as the sole guardians of light is vanity, and that for balance to exist, there must be great light AND great darkness. It wasn't JUST his character which made him try to kill Ben, but it was also due to the ideas about WHAT the Jedi were and WHAT Luke Skywalker was which made him try to kill Ben. There was a TONNE of complex motivation going on as to why he was going to kill Ben and a lot of forces to push him to do it...

Until he realised that living up to legends and mythos is bollocks.

Since Luke is convinced that mythos\legends are bollocks, he decides to do the polar opposite of what his mythos dictates. He becomes a grouchy old hermit who doesn't interfere with the galaxy. He wants to get as far away from his legend as humanly possible.

Which is why he doesn't want a thing to do with training Rey. It's also why when he DOES train Rey, it's all: "There's no ultimate light\dark" (which was a mindset that he had until it was broken by him murdering Ben), "The Jedi are a failure" (created Sidious, Killed his Dad, destroyed his family and the galaxy a few times over). Everything in his character was well accounted for.

However you were too busy wanting Luke Skywalker to be Space Jesus weren't you? YOU the audience member had to let go of the past, let go of the old legends and mythos and deal with what was right in front of you. DO YOU SEE WHAT THE MOVIE WAS DOING YET?

Most of the genius in this movie is the callbacks to stuff from the old movies which it then reverses and flips on its head. Many of the scenes had similar setups and followed conventions of the old Star Wars movies (Throne Room confrontation, battle on Hoth, being trained by an old wise master, Luke being Jesus etc.) but pretty much every scene played out with an opposite result. Finn's mission was a total failure. Snoke got slaughtered in his Throne room before we had a chance to find out who\what the fuck he is (how ballsy and awesome is that!? That right there just screams "Fuck your Star Wars conventions!"), Poe could blow shit up awesomely, but he was a freaking liability, Rey's parents were NOT some member of the Skywalker lineage they were nobodies (the hall of mirrors scene where she was "shown" who her parents were? She was shown an image of herself because she looked after herself, hence she was her parents), Ren was being set up to be a Vader character who turns at the last second, but instead he BECOMES Vader at the last second. The balls this movie had were unbelievable.
 
But let's talk about the things this move fucked up. Because there is a half to this movie which is legitimately pretty awful.

#1) The military in this film are criminally stupid. Seriously, none of the battles were handled with any finesse, or intelligence whatsoever. Every decision was criminally dumb and the worst possible way to handle something. There were other ways of dealing with every single battle\chase in this film so to be blunt: I don't respect either the military of The Resistance or The First Order. Also: If the Resistance ships are faster than the First Order ships, that means that throughout the course of the movie they would slowly be pulling away. This plot of the movie was not well thought out.

(Nerd Side-Note: Also, there is no gravity in space. The "bombers" were impressively stupid as an idea and the design of the ship was not only ugly, but monstrously impractical and stupid. Why do the turbo laser shots arc as though they are cannon balls? Gah)

#2) Finn's plot about the codebreaker was videogame bullshit. Stuff that could easily translate into a videogame. However, please remember that Star Wars is meant to be a kids movie. With all the hardcore characterisation going on with Ren\Rey\Luke, there's not much in this movie for kids to love is there? So Finn is there so that the main target audience has something about this film to love too.

#3) Laura Dern's Character (Purple-Haired "leader") is the worst character in Star Wars history. She literally fucked up everything. She was an atrocious leader and the one thing that she did right was remove herself from the galaxy. Let's break it down.

- When Poe asked her what her plan was, she refused to tell him.
Sure, in the military there's this thing called "Need-to-know" basis, but the entire Resistance was in crisis and looking for answers. She HAD answers AND REFUSED TO TELL PEOPLE WHAT THEY WERE. What a dumbass. As a leader, she was not inspiring confidence, capacity or hope in anybody. I know if I was on ANY of those Resistance ships I'd be sitting there going: "Why are we slowly flying in the same direction to our deaths" on top of "if our ship is faster than theirs, how come we are maintaining the exact same range throughout this whole film?"

- As a result of her being a stony-faced bitch: Poe sent Finn to find the code-breaker.
The terrible videogame subplot could have been entirely avoided if this fool of a woman told everybody what was up. HOWEVER: The reason why the First Order started blowing up the transports was because the code-breaker sold them out and told the First Order what Laura Dern's plan was. That also meant that The First Order knew where the Resistance was going to hide out which caused the ending (albeit, fucking awesome) battle in the final act. Her failure to inform her troops what was going on, set off a chain of events which lead to her plan being an unmitigated disaster.

- Droids can fly ships. She could've set up a robot to fly the Mon Cal cruiser, but y'know what? I'm kinda glad she killed herself. One less liability for the Resistance.

So to call this movie perfect is a big flaw. It's not perfect by any stretch of the imagination. 1\3rd of this movie is comprised of brain-breakingly bad decisions by the characters.

However the stuff it got right it absolutely bloody NAILED. Considering how ballsy this movie was that's an impressive feat. The whole movie had to untangle 50 odd years of Star Wars mythology in an attempt to open doors to new and interesting characters and ideas. It was trying to make it possible for Star Wars to be something OTHER than a 1950s Flash Gordon adventure movie set in space, yet working with the universe. It took ideas about what The Force is and removed the restrictive Pure Light\Darkness ethos to make it possible to have much more interesting conflicts. I saw it for the second time last night and I absolutely did bawl again with Luke's final scene in the movie. The way they handled Luke Skywalker in this film was not only a credit to the character, but also it was the statement about what they had to do with Star Wars to make something new from the franchise. They gave Skywalker a heap more depth without introducing anything new to his character, which is what they're trying to do to Star Wars in general.

So if you hated this movie: It probably means you only want Star Wars to be Good Guys vs. Bad Guys lasers pew pew with Space Magicians. However it was not possible to keep Star Wars on that path. They did it for Episode 7 (which was awesome) and a lot of people complained, Luke, Han and Leia cannot be around forever, so if they're going to continue Star Wars, they needed to destroy the old legends in order to create something new. From destruction comes creation.

And quite frankly: The new ideas that they've attached to the old ones have a shitload of depth and colour to them. I'm excited to see what they do for it. But I do need to acknowledge that if they mess up Episode 9, then all the good work they did in Episode 8 is kinda retroactively destroyed.

However, when you take into context what this movie was and what it was trying to do with the significance it had to deal with? I couldn't think of a better way for them to do it.


Oh and by the way.

Y'know when Leia floated back into the cruiser and everybody groaned and was like: "What is this Merry Poppins bullshit?"

LEIA IS A SKYWALKER.

SHE WALKED ON THE SKY


WE SAW A SKYWALKER...WALK ON THE SKY.

DO YOU GET IT?
 
But let's talk about the things this move ****ed up. Because there is a half to this movie which is legitimately pretty awful.

#1) The military in this film are criminally stupid. Seriously, none of the battles were handled with any finesse, or intelligence whatsoever. Every decision was criminally dumb and the worst possible way to handle something. There were other ways of dealing with every single battle\chase in this film so to be blunt: I don't respect either the military of The Resistance or The First Order. Also: If the Resistance ships are faster than the First Order ships, that means that throughout the course of the movie they would slowly be pulling away. This plot of the movie was not well thought out.

(Nerd Side-Note: Also, there is no gravity in space. The "bombers" were impressively stupid as an idea and the design of the ship was not only ugly, but monstrously impractical and stupid. Why do the turbo laser shots arc as though they are cannon balls? Gah)

#2) Finn's plot about the codebreaker was videogame bullshit. Stuff that could easily translate into a videogame. However, please remember that Star Wars is meant to be a kids movie. With all the hardcore characterisation going on with Ren\Rey\Luke, there's not much in this movie for kids to love is there? So Finn is there so that the main target audience has something about this film to love too.

#3) Laura Dern's Character (Purple-Haired "leader") is the worst character in Star Wars history. She literally ****ed up everything. She was an atrocious leader and the one thing that she did right was remove herself from the galaxy. Let's break it down.

- When Poe asked her what her plan was, she refused to tell him.
Sure, in the military there's this thing called "Need-to-know" basis, but the entire Resistance was in crisis and looking for answers. She HAD answers AND REFUSED TO TELL PEOPLE WHAT THEY WERE. What a dumbass. As a leader, she was not inspiring confidence, capacity or hope in anybody. I know if I was on ANY of those Resistance ships I'd be sitting there going: "Why are we slowly flying in the same direction to our deaths" on top of "if our ship is faster than theirs, how come we are maintaining the exact same range throughout this whole film?"

- As a result of her being a stony-faced bitch: Poe sent Finn to find the code-breaker.
The terrible videogame subplot could have been entirely avoided if this fool of a woman told everybody what was up. HOWEVER: The reason why the First Order started blowing up the transports was because the code-breaker sold them out and told the First Order what Laura Dern's plan was. That also meant that The First Order knew where the Resistance was going to hide out which caused the ending (albeit, ****ing awesome) battle in the final act. Her failure to inform her troops what was going on, set off a chain of events which lead to her plan being an unmitigated disaster.

- Droids can fly ships. She could've set up a robot to fly the Mon Cal cruiser, but y'know what? I'm kinda glad she killed herself. One less liability for the Resistance.

So to call this movie perfect is a big flaw. It's not perfect by any stretch of the imagination. 1\3rd of this movie is comprised of brain-breakingly bad decisions by the characters.

However the stuff it got right it absolutely bloody NAILED. Considering how ballsy this movie was that's an impressive feat. The whole movie had to untangle 50 odd years of Star Wars mythology in an attempt to open doors to new and interesting characters and ideas. It was trying to make it possible for Star Wars to be something OTHER than a 1950s Flash Gordon adventure movie set in space, yet working with the universe. It took ideas about what The Force is and removed the restrictive Pure Light\Darkness ethos to make it possible to have much more interesting conflicts. I saw it for the second time last night and I absolutely did bawl again with Luke's final scene in the movie. The way they handled Luke Skywalker in this film was not only a credit to the character, but also it was the statement about what they had to do with Star Wars to make something new from the franchise. They gave Skywalker a heap more depth without introducing anything new to his character, which is what they're trying to do to Star Wars in general.

So if you hated this movie: It probably means you only want Star Wars to be Good Guys vs. Bad Guys lasers pew pew with Space Magicians. However it was not possible to keep Star Wars on that path. They did it for Episode 7 (which was awesome) and a lot of people complained, Luke, Han and Leia cannot be around forever, so if they're going to continue Star Wars, they needed to destroy the old legends in order to create something new. From destruction comes creation.

And quite frankly: The new ideas that they've attached to the old ones have a ****load of depth and colour to them. I'm excited to see what they do for it. But I do need to acknowledge that if they mess up Episode 9, then all the good work they did in Episode 8 is kinda retroactively destroyed.

However, when you take into context what this movie was and what it was trying to do with the significance it had to deal with? I couldn't think of a better way for them to do it.


Oh and by the way.

Y'know when Leia floated back into the cruiser and everybody groaned and was like: "What is this Merry Poppins bullshit?"

LEIA IS A SKYWALKER.

SHE WALKED ON THE SKY

WE SAW A SKYWALKER...WALK ON THE SKY.

DO YOU GET IT?

BRAVO!!!!

POAST OF THE YEAR NOMINEE!!!!!!!!!
 
  • Like
Reactions: H13
The military in this film are criminally stupid. Seriously, none of the battles were handled with any finesse, or intelligence whatsoever

They're all reservists.
 
So much for turning your brain off and enjoying a science fiction flick, emPHAsis on the fiction. :rolleyes:

At no point in time did I ever say that...

If you do that in this movie, you're doing it wrong.

Which is why it's so great.
 
(Nerd Side-Note: Also, there is no gravity in space. The "bombers" were impressively stupid as an idea and the design of the ship was not only ugly, but monstrously impractical and stupid. Why do the turbo laser shots arc as though they are cannon balls? Gah)
There is no air in space, either, a fact which every Star Wars movie misses entirely. Spacecraft move, bank and turn as if they were flying through air, and they make sound as they scream past the camera. And, gravity or no, there is always a clear up and down in Star Wars space scenes. Star Wars physics is thoroughly broken.


The military in this film are criminally stupid
That stupidity is a hallmark of Star Wars. With all that technology, enemies still only engage each other at close quarters. Every Star Wars space battle ever could be ended in a moment with a single high-yield missile shot from a distance.


...please remember that Star Wars is meant to be a kids movie.
This is the key point. Star Wars is a vehicle for every eight-year-old boy's idea of what a cool space battle should be like. Seen from that perspective, these movies are masterpieces. Without that perspective, they all fall apart.



LEIA IS A SKYWALKER.

SHE WALKED ON THE SKY

WE SAW A SKYWALKER...WALK ON THE SKY.

DO YOU GET IT?
That kind of ham-fisted wordplay permeates the Star Wars movies. That's how we get generals named Grievous and drug dealers named Sleazebaggano.


Disney needed to prove that it can play with Star Wars without ****ing things up. They needed to convince the hardcore crowd that they could make a typical Star Wars movie without ****ing it up.
The biggest star in Disney's cap: they proved that they could make a movie without a goofy sidekick. :)[/QUOTE]
 
There is no air in space, either, a fact which every Star Wars movie misses entirely. Spacecraft move, bank and turn as if they were flying through air, and they make sound as they scream past the camera. And, gravity or no, there is always a clear up and down in Star Wars space scenes. Star Wars physics is thoroughly broken.

That was kind of always intentional. The Death Star run in the first movie was storyboarded and filmed after viewing WW2 Dogfight footage.

I know that ships don't really move that way, but...it's kinda the Star Wars things about how ships move as if they're in air. There is a clear up\down, but it's never been so freaking blatant before. They usually deliver ordanance through things like torpedoes as it should be. Nobody's REALLY watching Star Wars to get a physics lesson, but there's only so far you can suspend disbelief sometimes.

This is the key point. Star Wars is a vehicle for every eight-year-old boy's idea of what a cool space battle should be like. Seen from that perspective, these movies are masterpieces. Without that perspective, they all fall apart.

I can understand that, but I think even an 8 year old would have to admit the bombers are stupid. They were stupid slow, when one blew up it scattered bombs everywhere and destroyed other bombers etc. etc. etc. I don't think it takes a genius to figure out any of the following solutions to their problem:

First Order Ways Of Not Being Stupid:
- Have Snoke's ship shooting them from behind, but then jump the other dozen or so star destroyers in front of the ship to intercept.

- Instead of blowing up defenceless ships, capture them and their crew.

- Send the fighters in "without cover" and maybe knock out engines or their sheilds.

- Call in reinforcements to intercept.

Resistance Ways Of Not Being Stupid:
- Don't put Laura Dern in charge for fucks sake.

- Evacuate the ships, then set them to hyperjump in a variety of different destinations. See which ship was being tracked.

- Evacuate the smaller ships and use them to kamakaze the big ships.


That kind of ham-fisted wordplay permeates the Star Wars movies. That's how we get generals named Grievous and drug dealers named Sleazebaggano.

I am unfamiliar with these characters. Perhaps these characters exist in a different timeline.

The biggest star in Disney's cap: they proved that they could make a movie without a goofy sidekick. :)

Not to mention the level of character development with the complex motivations going on. One of the things I love about this movie is how ballsy it is and I didn't expect Disney to be that ballsy.
 
Wow. Those characters look like they come from movies which never ever existed. Ever.
Grievous was a key player in Episode III: Revenge of the Sith. Sleazebaggano was a bit player in Episode II: Attack of the Clones.
 
Back
Top Bottom