Why does the sound of a modeler have to be "the sound of a miced amp" instead of "the sound of an amp"

Xcdchdchjjf said:
Is this Cliff himself? If so im embarassed by any of my posts. I wonder if a small "HX stomp" sized pedal with JUST the FX from Fractal for like 400-500 bucks would sell 20million units or something. Since all the Fractal effects are better than... pretty much everything.
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Not saying things can't change, but just looking at the past, it's probably immediately unlikely. Basing that off of the FX8 and how it was apparently not as popular as the AX8.
 
Anyone who's gigged a bunch with an amp knows amps don't even sound like themselves from room to room requiring lots of adjust to get a similar response in differing environments. If a deluxe in your room is the epitomy of tone, just go with it and stop worrying about it. But a huge benefit of having a modeler is not being limited to the sound of said amp in said room...
 
Will Chen said:
Anyone who's gigged a bunch with an amp knows amps don't even sound like themselves from room to room requiring lots of adjust to get a similar response in differing environments. If a deluxe in your room is the epitomy of tone, just go with it and stop worrying about it. But a huge benefit of having a modeler is not being limited to the sound of said amp in said room...
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I though the huge benefit of the modeler was that is IS consitent, thus you show up to a venue and the "amp" sounds the same in the room.
Conflicting sentences there. Im not sweating it too much I was asking why it has to "contain" the "recording path" of the amp. An amp itself doesnt contain a recording path. If I was modeline an amp would I include the microphone to record it? No, but this has sort of been answered form a few different directions on this thread. If I "worry" (think) about it it is because theoretically this FM3 (or 9, or lll) would REPLACE the tube amps I have. Then I hear online how its not 100% figured out yet, people talk about the boxy etc, not gonne repeat the first question again. I still have to review the thoughtful responses above. But yeah I "worry" about tone and things like that all the time, and yes "other musicians" I know who "play shows" with covers and what I consider usually shitty gear (which is a result of "worrying," or THOUGHT, or lack of thought---) to me the gear a person uses (or doesnt use or whatever) tells me more about them than the sounds they play, but then where I live surrouned by great musicians but probably none of them know who John Cage is, or Frank Zappa, or Brian Eno??? So im sure they also dont "worry" about tone, and "just go with it."
I prefer to think about this sth, I got the Fractal because its the best there is really, beside the "real thing" but even thats an opinion. Like I said I just didnt understand why "modelers" have to include "mic options and mics and mic placements" (and can barely exist without them). But I suppose it is because you need the convolution/IR to even sample a "cab" to begin with. I guess....

I have not gigged a bunch of rooms.
 
The sound of a modeler needs to sound however the F you want it to sound! Sometimes, that means duplicating the sound of amp X and cabinet Y in room Z, sometimes that means you don't give a F about anything other than getting the sound you want (which may have never been heard before in your or anyone elses life, but you know it when you hear it)!! Trying to duplicate the sound of all amp/cab combos in all room scenarios with everybody perceptions adjustment dial built in is never going to happen, but what can happen right now is great sounds from a modeler (FAS of course) through good audio wave producers (be it FRFRs, studio monitors, PA, great cans, classic guitar cabs, etc.), whether it is a rehash of 30 years ago super sound or the next big thing!!!
 
If this were the day and age when guitarists just threw an amp on stage and blasted it into the audience with no help from the FOH PA sound system, then there would be more logic to wanting it to sound like an amp in the room as heard by the player's and audience's ears (though this is virtually impossible to replicate as explained in earlier posts). But in these days, most people mic their amp and send that to the FOH PA. Hence, a mic'ed amp sound is what the audience hears. So, that is what a modeler replicates. We "sacrifice" our "amp on stage" sound a bit so that the audience gets a sound they are accustomed to (a mic'ed guitar amp), and we get to hear what they are hearing. I have grown to prefer hearing it as the audience hears it over having a totally different sound on stage (compared to what the audience hears).
 
A bit of misinformation in this thread - paging @yeky83 :)

@Xcdchdchjjf I wouldn’t worry so much - use the trial period and see if you like the sound you can produce.

As for your original question, it all boils down to the cabinet simulation.

You see it’s much easier for IR producers to sample a cabinet using close mic’ing techniques (just as you would use on a typical recording session) - but you can absolutely remove the microphone contribution by using calibrated measurement mics - but you don’t see a lot of that from IR producers.

However, even when removing the contribution from the mic (by using a calibrated measurement t mic) you are still left with the fact that for most IRs the cabinets are being sampled with close micing.

When you play your existing amp+cab, do you have your ear right next to the grill ? Probably not - this is what makes most of the difference. Measuring the cabinet at these close distances is capturing the “near-field” response.

Now it is possible to properly capture a cabinet’s response from a typical players position (which is roughly in the “far field”of the cabinet) but doing so requires a really big space and very careful measurement technique to eliminate any room reflections from contaminating the response (about 20-25ms void of reflections) - this is not something the majority of IR producers have access to or knowledge of how to properly acquire.
You may see some IRs being touted as FF IRs but all they did is measure with the mic at a distance - it’s not that simple.

The last element you would need is a truly flat response-full range playback system. The keyword there being “truly”- there are a lot of systems that advertise themselves as FRFR but fall short for the promise.

In addition, to simulate an open cabinet, you could set up your playback system in a dipole configuration - you could also acquire the cabinet’s back reponse in the far field for increased realism.

Then there’s the consideration of how a guitar cabinet directivity will be different than a FRFR directivity therefore interacting with the room differently - in my experience this not a major issue - you can still produce a convincing amp in the room sound despite this difference.

So as you can see, modeling the sound of an amp+cab combo to sound like and amp+cab in the room is not as trivial as it may seem.

As suggested by others, if you really want the “amp in the room” experience - the easiest way is just to play through an actual guitar cabinet.

Or alternatively, you could just get used to the close mic’ed sound :)
 
As someone has already said, a lot of this discussion gets hung up in semantics. "Amp in a room", "consistent", and the like. At least for me, while you asked a fair question in terms of what to expect from using a modeler your actual expectations aren't necessarily valid, IMO. If you're going to expect a modeler to sound the same in every room you have to level the playing field and ask, "Will my favorite amp sound the same in every room. Disclaimer: my heaviest gigging days were back in the 70's and 80's but I think a lot of this will apply.

The answer to that question is, "Not necessarily." If you're going to ask if it sounds like an amp in the room you also have to ask, "What room?" As well as "Where is it sitting? Where is it facing? How high is it? How loud is it?" It's already been pointed out that the off axis vs, the right at your head sound is generally pretty different. And playing in a room by yourself vs. when other band members are thrashing away modifies what you hear. I mean, I remember a case where the drummer got new drums and the sound of my guitar in our practice space changed. Actually, when people talk about amp in the room, to me it's more of a retro concept to me harkening back to those old days when sound reinforcement was in its infancy. Like when you go and watch some else's band practice. Or a junior high school gym with nothing mic'd up and just a Shure Vocal Master PA that could barely keep up with the drums, much less a couple of 100 watt guitar amps. That's certainly a pure amp in the room sound - it's also a pure PITA to get mixed correctly.

Which brings me to the two reasons why you go to a modeler - any modeler, not just Fractal. And this applies to drummers as well as guitarists. Keyboardists and the often maligned bass players got on board with direct way before their more bang-ish counterparts.

1. You play a gig. You're loving your tone. It's just a degree or two short of completely awesome. You're a rock god. You hear the recording afterwards and go, "Oh God, my guitar sounds like ass!" Another completely different gig, different venue. You're dying a death. No matter how you tweak it sounds like shit to you. You're almost in tears and you even mess up a few times because you're so preoccupied with how bad it sounds. You listen to the recording after and exclaim, "Wow, that actually sounded pretty OK. I would have had a lot better time and probably played better if I could have heard that!"

The room, the sound man, how he mic'd the amp, or even your bandmates' equipment and what were doing at the time could all create tremendous discrepancies in what you heard and what was out front. To be fair there's a lot of space in between those extremes, but it can get kind of nerve racking. And just saying, "Trust the soundman," IMO falls into the category of: famous last words. They're not deities and let's face it, skills can vary dramatically. And some of them have the skills, but they really don't give a shit about how you sound. Or what they like isn't even close to your vision. Or the front mix is great, the monitors, not so much. So minimizing the risk factors can't help but benefit you over the long haul. And a modeler will do that. What goes to the board is entirely under your control. You'll still have to work on your tone and trust the soundman to some degree. If it's like the one guy who used to always fall asleep at the board you might still be screwed but at least you did due diligence.

All the time I was playing I wished there was some way I could have more influence in making sure what I heard was the same as what was output to the FOH. And then just concentrate on the gig. I guess some people just do that anyway, which is why the have the expression ignorance is bliss.

2. You don't have a dedicated rehearsal space where you can turn up as loud as you want whenever you want and you wish to maintain normal human societal relationships. Particularly those with family and neighbors. There is a distressingly small subset of the population who upon hearing a cranked up guitar amp will exclaim, "Wow, monster tone!" More common is: "Can you please turn that down?" or in the worst case: "I'm calling the police!" I don't have any statistical evidence to back it up, but I would expect that guitarists who have gravitated to modelers and exercised the headphone capabilities probably have substantially lower divorce rates than those who haven't. As Bill Maher would say, "I don't know it for a fact, I just know it's true."

And it's not just your significant others. I have a friend whose band are internally at war now over onstage volume levels. The two primary singers are pitted against the others who are in a proverbial cage match to get over the top of each other. Great monitors - they can hear themselves sing, but in this day and age with the technology that's available a lot of people just don't want to reproduce the performing experience of 50 years ago when all you could do was turn it up.

I won't say that you can do anything direct that you can do on a big soundstage with a loud amp. At least not without some real R&D and a specialized rig. When you're in a big room you can turn up in and have a setup with a lot of headroom you can move around a lot of air. And when you're moving that much air and it's interacting with your guitar strings you can get some pretty happenin' things going. But I gotta say, that's a niche case. Unless you're on a Hendrix or Ted Nugent trip and really work that stuff in a creative way you're just knocking points off your future hearing scores without a commensurate benefit IMO. And again, different rooms will make each attempt to replicate this a huge challenge.

When guitarists started amplifying the signal, those who were purely acoustic bemoaned the loss of purity. When they started turning up the amplifiers loud enough to distort and feed back, the jazz players with cleaner tones cried foul. Active vs. passive pickups, same thing. Sold state vs. tube. Modeler vs. "Real Amps". Something new comes along and a lot of musicians turn into their grandparents.

If you require a similarly retro experience where in order to create and perform you need the same conditions as they had those fabled yesteryears, OK. Just a choice, no judgement here. But I think you do have to at least interrogate yourself as to what the actual benefit is and whether it's a case of need vs. want. And keep in mind that when that person was inventing the wheel there were invariably people walking by going, "What are doing that for? You got feet, don't you?"
 
Xcdchdchjjf said:
I though the huge benefit of the modeler was that is IS consitent, thus you show up to a venue and the "amp" sounds the same in the room.
Conflicting sentences there. Im not sweating it too much I was asking why it has to "contain" the "recording path" of the amp. An amp itself doesnt contain a recording path. If I was modeline an amp would I include the microphone to record it? No, but this has sort of been answered form a few different directions on this thread. If I "worry" (think) about it it is because theoretically this FM3 (or 9, or lll) would REPLACE the tube amps I have. Then I hear online how its not 100% figured out yet, people talk about the boxy etc, not gonne repeat the first question again. I still have to review the thoughtful responses above. But yeah I "worry" about tone and things like that all the time, and yes "other musicians" I know who "play shows" with covers and what I consider usually shitty gear (which is a result of "worrying," or THOUGHT, or lack of thought---) to me the gear a person uses (or doesnt use or whatever) tells me more about them than the sounds they play, but then where I live surrouned by great musicians but probably none of them know who John Cage is, or Frank Zappa, or Brian Eno??? So im sure they also dont "worry" about tone, and "just go with it."
I prefer to think about this sth, I got the Fractal because its the best there is really, beside the "real thing" but even thats an opinion. Like I said I just didnt understand why "modelers" have to include "mic options and mics and mic placements" (and can barely exist without them). But I suppose it is because you need the convolution/IR to even sample a "cab" to begin with. I guess....

I have not gigged a bunch of rooms.
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No offense, but your lack of experience is clouding your perception. At loud volumes, the room greatly impacts your tone and every room sounds different. For example, rooms with a high hollow stage are going suck the low end out of your tone vs a room with a low ceiling where you set up in a corner will greatly boost bass. I played a bar once that had painted dinner plates all over the walls and ceiling that was ear piercing bright. Conversely playing outdoors you generally get a pure dry sound. The consistency in these cases with a modeler is that the tone going to the mixer/house is 100% consistent with the house PA adjusted to serve the room. And you additionally use master EQ from your monitor for room correction of personal monitoring. Changing a real amp's EQ at higher volumes not only changes the tone but can dramatically change the way an amp feels/responds.

Within a bedroom, near field monitors set up correctly will reduce (but not eliminate) the impact of the room as they are made for close monitoring at low to moderate volumes. This allows the flexibility of sounding like any amp in any room which is a huge benefit in recording AND in dialing in tones which will translate to different environments (same as mixing).

But circling back...if your ideal tone is 1 specific amp in 1 specific room go for it and enjoy tonal bliss, modelers aren't the answer for all players.
 
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Xcdchdchjjf said:
I though the huge benefit of the modeler was that is IS consitent, thus you show up to a venue and the "amp" sounds the same in the room.
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The modeler is consistent. The room isn’t. The two combined affect the sound of the modeler in the room, in spite of what we use to amplify the sound.

The benefit of FRFR is that the cabinet and speaker are capable of being neutral and having as little effect on the sound of the modeler as possible. The sound of the modeler is reproduced accurately and as a result can mimic a 1x12, 4x10, or a single 4x5” speaker, and switch between them at the player’s command. Many FRFR also have a much wider sound pattern so they allow the player to move around and hear the sound in a much larger area on stage.

Traditional speakers and cabinets beam the sound in a much more narrow pattern and if you get off-axis the sound volume and frequency response changes radically. The actual speakers also filter the sound, affecting the highs and lows, and even inject their own distortion, and will do so with every sound they reproduce.

The end result of the modeler and FRFR is that we can adjust our sound to fit a room more easily because the tools inside the modeler are more flexible. PEQ and GEQ blocks let us quickly tailor the sound of a preset to a room. Global EQ lets us affect all the presets at once. We can store them and reload them for the next time we need to play that space, allowing us to have consistent sound. We can even send an unaffected feed to the FOH and they can adjust it for their needs. With a traditional rig, if you try to compensate for the room by turning tone controls or a graphic EQ pedal you can affect the sound, distortion, and feel of the amp and sometimes not get the sound of the amp you want.
 
Never really understood the whole “I hate it because it doesn’t sound like an amp in the room” thing. If you gig, they throw some crappy 57 on your speaker and that’s that. I love being able to know exactly what it’s going to sound like out front to the audience.

If you want an amp in the room, stick with an amp.
 
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Randall d said:
If this were the day and age when guitarists just threw an amp on stage and blasted it into the audience with no help from the FOH PA sound system, then there would be more logic to wanting it to sound like an amp in the room as heard by the player's and audience's ears
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I've played live in bands since 1978.
I NEVER played a gig where my amp wasn't mic'ed up.
Maybe some shitty bar bands somewhere without a proper PA and soundman might do that in some amateurish way. And boy does it sound bad when a band does that. All the audience hears from the guitar in that scenario is a loud angry mosquito
And yeah, I think it's an appropriate question to ask about why a modeler doesn't just create the sound of the amp when you play it.
That was ALWAYS my goal when using a real amp. My soundman's job was to recreate the sound I heard standing about 10 feet in front of my amp.
Thus the tweaking of the placement of the microphone, eq at the board, etc . And the Holy Grail at each venue was to be able to find that sweet spot along the speaker cone that would allow the soundman to use minimal eq on your channel (assuming that they used a room analyzer during sound check to flatten the PA system)
But the goal was always to closely recreate the sound I was making and get it out to the audience through the PA (or as the kids say these days "FOH")
My goal with modeling is similar in that it has always been to get my sound out to the audience through the PA system at whatever venue I'm at.
So when I tweak out my sound on my FM3...it's most definitely what I would have heard through my real amp and 4x12 cabinet as well with my "real" effects in the loop of the amp.
That's the way it should be. I use an FRFR speaker at home to get what I need. And then almost all of my gigs on the Las Vegas strip are "silent stages" where everyone is using IEM's and there are no amps allowed.
And my sound translates great through the PA at every venue I play.
It ain't rocket science.
P.S.: I never change my tones to "fit" a room. My sound is my sound. And the modeler allows consistency. It's the soundman's job out front to make sure that he's got the PA tweaked to the room to allow my sound to be heard correctly.
And it always is.
 
@Xcdchdchjjf , not sure if you saw this thread or not, but it'll take less that 2 mins of your time.

Marc gives a very succinct description of all the benefits of this modeling approach/reality. I realize that maybe you're asking because you just want to be able to reproduce an "amp in the room" sound for personal enjoyment (and that's cool), but just thought this might be good info. Great endorsement for Fractal.

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/marc-bonilla-on-the-fm3.182106/#post-2259184
 
Fat Dad said:
If you gig, they throw some crappy 57 on your speaker and that’s that. I love being able to know exactly what it’s going to sound like out front to the audience.
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I'm with you here, oh yea; one of the major reasons I went with Fractal devices circa 2009 was that I wanted total control of what I was sending out the main PA. So many times I had great, inspiring tone thru my 4x12 only to be horrified at what I heard coming out the PA when I went out front to listen. Combined with a soundman who says "it's good enough" or won't make any further adjustments with the mic and you have a recipe for a bummer time.
 
Just to clarify I'm only asking why a "mic" (and "mic Placement") has to be a variable in the modeler.

I have a Neumann that lives slung over my amp if I need to record which I dont think Ive used since I got the FM3 months ago.

The questions being slightly facetious / conceptual.

"Why does there now have to be this extra variable, mic type and position" when I just want to choose X wonderfully modeled amp (& cab apparently).


I believe the answer comes down to convolution/ IR modeling the cab sound which is different than the FRFR or monitors.

Becuase I have not used an FRFR (maybe a Bose L2) I dont know what "sound" it has.

From my perspective I was just looking to cut out yet another variable, if not needed. If I am not plugging in the fractal and recording, or doing FOH somewhere. If I am using it plugging straight into pedals for instance, which I do, maybe I would not want the added variable of the "simulated mic" running through pedals too. Though I know studios do that as do 90% of albums in history so its a great sound. Perhpas you can even split the signal before the virtual cab and have FX between amp and cab (of course you can).

Simply put it was a variable I didnt want but also I rarely mess with, I think it was more apparent on the HX stomp where it was the first option to adjust in an amp, and in that case I usually set it the same distance every time which didnt color the signal.

I have some 57's on my drum kit but to mic an amp I always use a Neumann. I wouldnt even know the sound of my own amp with a 57, and as nice as sound guys are.... I prefer to be in control of my own gear and sound 100% when live, as mentioned above maybe playing less than 20 gigs live in my life. If I want to turn something up, I do it. Watching musicicians beg to hear more guitar or more vocals over and over until its gotten right is so far from an experience I ever want to have. I want to go, play, and talk as least as I have to to anyone.

I did bring the FM3 to a gig in the past year and I cant even recall if I used an amp in it... I mustve but I know I was also going stereo out and using my massive stereo pedalboard so maybe I had that in a loop. Once the sound guy plugged in the XLR there was nothing more to say to him all night. Thats a pretty good experience to me. I also had 2 amos and 4 cabinet on stage, I told him dont mic them use the FM3 out. I have EQ blocks in my presets that I used live and changed the volume live and everything, never had to ask any questions.

As someone said it comes down to SEMANTICS and Im sure thats what it is. I dont even know WTF people are tlaking about when they talk about "amp in a room" etc but they must just mean, "an amp." I hear "My amp" when I am playing in a room, and generally not "the room."
If I want to record I use the neumann which sounds "almost the same" as what my ears hear, but with a little more "sparkle" since its a good mic.

SO, as someone else said I guess.... If I was playing an FRFR magically someday, bank account willing??? What If I draped the same mic over the FRFR to record.

Anyway I am not even thinking about that, or any of the scenarios. I was simply asking WHY there has to be another variable in the chain when at its most basic its supposed to be and "amp" modeler, with 200 amps, the end. Of course an amp "includes a cab." which in modeler world equates to "captured IR" + EQ curve.

I think I saw someone commenting on the Strymon Iridium and how its not for them because they dont want a "fake eq filter" over thier whole sound. Which is a similar but different comment.

Mine is " so you built these amps transitors, qualities, from scratch, why does it have to include a "fake ribbon mic, or fake "57" in the model. But the answer is becuase its the only way to capture the qualities of the cab that generally goes with that amp, and that its not a "fake" mic, becuase its hopefully what was used to capture it.

I think someone above explained you CAN remove the "mic" variable from inside the modeler, perhaps I will do that.

I am not someone who needs convincing or anything I am just wondering "why" people say these things about modelers/amps but again its semantics. Whats not semantics is that it truy does include a "mic" sound with "placement" in all sounds. Even if youre trying to be dead basic as pluggin into an amp in real life.
 
Xcdchdchjjf said:
Just to clarify I'm only asking why a "mic" (and "mic Placement") has to be a variable in the modeler.

I have a Neumann that lives slung over my amp if I need to record which I dont think Ive used since I got the FM3 months ago.

The questions being slightly facetious / conceptual.

"Why does there now have to be this extra variable, mic type and position" when I just want to choose X wonderfully modeled amp (& cab apparently).


I believe the answer comes down to convolution/ IR modeling the cab sound which is different than the FRFR or monitors.

Becuase I have not used an FRFR (maybe a Bose L2) I dont know what "sound" it has.

From my perspective I was just looking to cut out yet another variable, if not needed. If I am not plugging in the fractal and recording, or doing FOH somewhere. If I am using it plugging straight into pedals for instance, which I do, maybe I would not want the added variable of the "simulated mic" running through pedals too. Though I know studios do that as do 90% of albums in history so its a great sound. Perhpas you can even split the signal before the virtual cab and have FX between amp and cab (of course you can).

Simply put it was a variable I didnt want but also I rarely mess with, I think it was more apparent on the HX stomp where it was the first option to adjust in an amp, and in that case I usually set it the same distance every time which didnt color the signal.

I have some 57's on my drum kit but to mic an amp I always use a Neumann. I wouldnt even know the sound of my own amp with a 57, and as nice as sound guys are.... I prefer to be in control of my own gear and sound 100% when live, as mentioned above maybe playing less than 20 gigs live in my life. If I want to turn something up, I do it. Watching musicicians beg to hear more guitar or more vocals over and over until its gotten right is so far from an experience I ever want to have. I want to go, play, and talk as least as I have to to anyone.

I did bring the FM3 to a gig in the past year and I cant even recall if I used an amp in it... I mustve but I know I was also going stereo out and using my massive stereo pedalboard so maybe I had that in a loop. Once the sound guy plugged in the XLR there was nothing more to say to him all night. Thats a pretty good experience to me. I also had 2 amos and 4 cabinet on stage, I told him dont mic them use the FM3 out. I have EQ blocks in my presets that I used live and changed the volume live and everything, never had to ask any questions.

As someone said it comes down to SEMANTICS and Im sure thats what it is. I dont even know WTF people are tlaking about when they talk about "amp in a room" etc but they must just mean, "an amp." I hear "My amp" when I am playing in a room, and generally not "the room."
If I want to record I use the neumann which sounds "almost the same" as what my ears hear, but with a little more "sparkle" since its a good mic.

SO, as someone else said I guess.... If I was playing an FRFR magically someday, bank account willing??? What If I draped the same mic over the FRFR to record.

Anyway I am not even thinking about that, or any of the scenarios. I was simply asking WHY there has to be another variable in the chain when at its most basic its supposed to be and "amp" modeler, with 200 amps, the end. Of course an amp "includes a cab." which in modeler world equates to "captured IR" + EQ curve.

I think I saw someone commenting on the Strymon Iridium and how its not for them because they dont want a "fake eq filter" over thier whole sound. Which is a similar but different comment.

Mine is " so you built these amps transitors, qualities, from scratch, why does it have to include a "fake ribbon mic, or fake "57" in the model. But the answer is becuase its the only way to capture the qualities of the cab that generally goes with that amp, and that its not a "fake" mic, becuase its hopefully what was used to capture it.

I think someone above explained you CAN remove the "mic" variable from inside the modeler, perhaps I will do that.

I am not someone who needs convincing or anything I am just wondering "why" people say these things about modelers/amps but again its semantics. Whats not semantics is that it truy does include a "mic" sound with "placement" in all sounds. Even if youre trying to be dead basic as pluggin into an amp in real life.
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There is no mic type/position variable within the FM3, IRs which have them listed are listed that way to give players an idea of how something is going to sound and a more limited selection to choose from based on preference gained through experience. Again, this is a huge benefit to those whose done significant recording or miking up live amps, not a limiting factor.

There is such a thing as a reflection free IR which are generally captured using measurement mics which are designed to eliminate room reflections (not talking about reverb, but the early reflections which enforce/cancel some frequencies) and measurement mics by their very nature are not colored like many of the well known mics people typically throw on amps. I've a few created by Jay Mitchell and others which I I've used on and off for a long time. Personally I think they work a littler better with a larger FRFR wedge to come closer to a sound of a cab without having to do a lot of EQ tweaking but conversely find they need a fair amount of EQ in order to sound "right" in a mix, so it's a give and take depending on use case. But even then, response off axis impacts the resulting IR and that's where your question simply doesn't make sense.

Take any amp you own and put your ear next to the speaker and listen to it (of course at a level which won't deafen you) and then without moving back move 2-3 feet to the side. You will notice a huge drop off in high end. Take any 1X12 combo and stand right in front of it with the speaker shooting at your calves and compare it to the sound 10 feet away, you will notice a large increase in highs at distance. How would any modeler possibly know which spot the user thinks sounds like a given cab? You might as well ask why a modeler doesn't just have 1 amp model without any parameters as it should know exactly what the user believes is a good sound.

Eventually...someone will come out with fully modeled cabs which will take a given speaker's measured response and allow a user to place it into a virtual cab and even potentially select a virtual axis on which one is monitoring without any mic involved. But really...I don't see this coming any closer to answering your Q as they still can not control playback system, and as long as there are amps in existence there will be people asking why monitoring through headphones doesn't sound like their 4X12, and the answer will always be physics.
 
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I can't even count how many times in a cover or jam situation myself and colleagues simply displaced the mic by kicking it with the boots when walking or pushing it with our asses while tuning pedals or even dragging it away from the cab by the cable :)

I can't recall even a single time when sound(wo)man got on the stage and fixed it during/in pause between the performance :)
 
Chromatizm said:
I can't even count how many times in a cover or jam situation myself and colleagues simply displaced the mic by kicking it with the boots when walking or pushing it with our asses while tuning pedals or even dragging it away from the cab by the cable :)

I can't recall even a single time when sound(wo)man got on the stage and fixed it during/in pause between the performance :)
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Never happened to my guitar amp (usually a boom stand mic'ing up a 4x12 cab)...but every gig where the drummer doesn't have a riser, that kick drum mic definitely gets kicked out of position.
One minute you feel that big thump and the next minute the band feels like a transistor radio. lol
 
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