Why can't I get my Axe + monitor to feed back normally like a guitar cab?

[merlin17]

The squealing sounds like my old Tele where the bridgeplate was not flat on the body and the bridge pickup had to be waxed, too. This is definately a guitar-specific thing IMO.

 

[Stringtheorist]

The squealing sounds like my old Tele where the bridgeplate was not flat on the body and the bridge pickup had to be waxed, too. This is definately a guitar-specific thing IMO.

No, I don't think so. Both my guitars are doing it. If you listen closely to Paul's guitar in the video, it's creeping into his sound too, only quieter as his volume is lower.

 

[axel]

Instead of everyone trying to determine why your preset(s) aren't providing controlled feedback, why not have someone with similar speakers/equipment send you a preset that they are getting good feedback with and go from there? If you don't get it with their presets either, then you can start looking at other possible issues. There are many other variables, which could be coming into play. Just a thought.

 

[npdcoremetal]

What flavour of music buddy,what amp,pickups,cab,speaker etc also check your gate param

 

[Stringtheorist]

Instead of everyone trying to determine why your preset(s) aren't providing controlled feedback, why not have someone with similar speakers/equipment send you a preset that they are getting good feedback with and go from there? If you don't get it with their presets either, then you can start looking at other possible issues. There are many other variables, which could be coming into play. Just a thought.

Good idea.

 

[Stringtheorist]

These are different settings than the ones you posted at the beginning of this thread (Mid: 0.83).
I forgot to put the 63Hz way down, though.
I monitor through RCF NX-12SMA.

Merlin, would you be kind enough to post a preset that gives you controlled feedback trough your RCF? Preferably not with too much gain.

 

[Deltones]

Maybe I need to add more gain.

No, you don't need more gain. And as Paul's video showed quite clearly, he basically had to play contortionist to get the little bit of feedback he was able to get. And he had plently of gain.

I have the same problem as you with my Ultra connected to my HS-80. Basically no satisfying feedback. The only time I had a little bit of fun with feedback was when I put my cab in a home-made iso cab, had the volume brutally loud and played with an hollowbody Dearmond. And even then, I had to coax the strings once in a while to keep it going. Here's what I got. Take note that I recorded this at the time for an ambient background track we needed for a song.



To tell you the truth, at home, I pretty much resigned myself to have a no-feedback zone as far as the Ultra is concerned. I just can't play with the volume necessary to get something worthwhile.

 

[axel]

No, you don't need more gain. And as Paul's video showed quite clearly, he basically had to play contortionist to get the little bit of feedback he was able to get. And he had plently of gain.

I have the same problem as you with my Ultra connected to my HS-80. Basically no satisfying feedback. The only time I had a little bit of fun with feedback was when I put my cab in a home-made iso cab, had the volume brutally loud and played with an hollowbody Dearmond. And even then, I had to coax the strings once in a while to keep it going. Here's what I got. Take note that I recorded this at the time for an ambient background track we needed for a song.



To tell you the truth, at home, I pretty much resigned myself to have a no-feedback zone as far as the Ultra is concerned. I just can't play with the volume necessary to get something worthwhile.

Not 100% sure of this, but I don't think you would be able to get "controlled" feedback using an ISO cab (no external speakers). Controlled feedback is feeback between the guitar pickups and the speaker, so if you isolate the speaker, you would not have that interaction, just echo from inside the ISO cab feeding back. Like I said, not 100% sure, so someone can correct me if I'm mistaken.

 

[Stringtheorist]

To tell you the truth, at home, I pretty much resigned myself to have a no-feedback zone as far as the Ultra is concerned. I just can't play with the volume necessary to get something worthwhile.

Interesting to note that it's not just me having this problem.

I got a little feedback with my Black Dog patch during a gig last night but I had to be very careful where and how I placed my guitar in relation to my cab, I had to keep coaxing the strings with vibrato, and even then it took a while to get going. And yet the whole gig I had to keep watching out for the shrill pickup squeal getting into the sound if the gain was too high or I was too close to the cab. Nightmare.

 

[ZeeW]

I've been reading this thread with a lot of interest.... I thought I'd chime in as I too have difficulties in getting feedback using a 12ma at lower volumes. Yet, I have a pal who uses Yamaha DSR112's (pair) at home at just above TV sound levels and has no problems what so ever in getting feedback. We both have the exact same ESP guitar with identical pups, the only difference being string gauge. We have even used/shared identical patches and he gets nice controlled feedback and I can only get this at high sound pressure levels.

Or setups are the same except I have the Verve and he has the Yamaha!

I'm no acoustic engineer or anything like that, but in my example it has to be the Verve that is the issue.

 

[Jay Mitchell]

I too have difficulties in getting feedback using a 12ma at lower volumes. Yet, I have a pal who uses Yamaha DSR112's (pair) at home at just above TV sound levels and has no problems what so ever in getting feedback. We both have the exact same ESP guitar with identical pups, the only difference being string gauge. We have even used/shared identical patches and he gets nice controlled feedback and I can only get this at high sound pressure levels.

Or setups are the same except I have the Verve and he has the Yamaha!

And he uses a pair vs. your single speaker, he uses different gauge strings than you (which can't be ruled out as a contributing factor), and he is in a completely different acoustic environment. Then there's the fact that two different examples of the same model guitar can easily have significant differences in this area. All of the above are variables which could potentially have an effect on the ability to generate controlled feedback.

I'm no acoustic engineer or anything like that, but in my example it has to be the Verve that is the issue.

Nope. It could be a combination of any (or all) of the named variables. Speaker type is just one of those.

 

[Deltones]

Not 100% sure of this, but I don't think you would be able to get "controlled" feedback using an ISO cab (no external speakers). Controlled feedback is feeback between the guitar pickups and the speaker, so if you isolate the speaker, you would not have that interaction, just echo from inside the ISO cab feeding back. Like I said, not 100% sure, so someone can correct me if I'm mistaken.

You're right, but in this case, I was standing next to my iso cab, and you know how easy it is to get feedback with a hollowbody. There was still plently of sound leaking out so I was still able to get something decent (but man would the cops have showed up at my place if that cab was in the open). I was looking for a certain sound at the time, and the iso cab seemed like a good idea.

 

[ZeeW]

And he uses a pair vs. your single speaker, he uses different gauge strings than you (which can't be ruled out as a contributing factor), and he is in a completely different acoustic environment. Then there's the fact that two different examples of the same model guitar can easily have significant differences in this area. All of the above are variables which could potentially have an effect on the ability to generate controlled feedback.

Nope. It could be a combination of any (or all) of the named variables. Speaker type is just one of those.

Well I'm due to travel next Wed to see him for a few days and I'm going to take the Verve for us both to have a play around with. I'm going to have a go with the Yamaha either as a pair or single config.

I take your point on the variables, but will report my findings.

 

[axel]

Well I'm due to travel next Wed to see him for a few days and I'm going to take the Verve for us both to have a play around with. I'm going to have a go with the Yamaha either as a pair or single config.

I take your point on the variables, but will report my findings.

That's the way to do it, and it will be very interesting to hear your findings. I would even include individual playing technique as a variable.

 

[ZeeW]

I've just spent an afternoon with my pal who owns a pair of the Yamaha DSR112 with a view to seeing how he gets feedback (as he's always saying getting feedback is relatively easy) and to try and understand why I have some difficulties getting feedback using a single 12ma.

As mentioned before we have the same guitar, pickups etc...

We tried with his setup and patches via my Verve and with my guitar. Simply, feedback was difficult unless I cranked the volume to a level that was not comfortable in a room that measures 20 x 20 feet. Standing further away from the monitor made feedback more difficult, whilst moving closer made it a little easier.

Paul tried his ESP that is identical to mine, including pickups but has 8s and I use skinny bottom heavy top strings. Same findings as me - hard to get feedback unless the volume was high.

We changed over to his pair of DSRs that were placed on the back wall about 10 foot apart. Using my guitar and the same patch and roughly the same volume level, there was plenty of controlled feedback. Feedback was even achieved at lower volumes and even standing further away from the monitors.

Next we used just one DSR and here's the thing - almost the same findings as using my single 12ma - probably a little easier with the Yamaha than the FBT. Little feedback at both high and lower volumes, and even when almost sitting on top of the monitor. We reintroduced the second DSR and BANG back to plenty of feedback at high and lower volumes.

As mentioned before, I ain't no audio/acoustic engineer and I have no idea what permutations and variables are involved in getting feedback. BUT I know it was easy to get feedback with two monitors and more difficult with single.

 

[axel]

Just curious, did you try various positions, as far as angle of guitar to speaker, when trying to get feedback with his single cabinet?

 

[ZeeW]

Not really - used them on the floor as monitors. I can try moving them around tomorrow and try different angles.

 

[Rex]

Definitely, do play with angles and such. In a relatively small room (20 x 20 feet qualifies as small), a change in position (of speaker or guitar) as small as an inch or two can make radical differences in response at a given frequency.

 

[JJunkie]

i could put some duct tape on the on the floor where i am supposed to stand, then put some duct tape on the wall, where i should point my headstock at, get awesome feedback~~~and look like a mega retard

 

[Rex]

i could put some duct tape on the on the floor where i am supposed to stand, then put some duct tape on the wall, where i should point my headstock at, get awesome feedback~~~and look like a mega retard

Or you could do what Carlos Santana (and a lot of others) do: walk around during sound check to find the sweet spot on the stage, then park yourself there for most of the show.