whats wrong with gibson and fender ?

Tonewicker

Tonewicker

Inspired
ok i dont want to bash any brand but im little bit angry about fender/gibson guitars here is my story:

i bought a gibson 2012 model les paul traditional about 2-3 years ago its a really good guitar the feeling is great and its tone is really phenomenal so i started playing non stop with it and i encountered a really unexpected problem (well unexpected for me anyway) it CANT stay in tune.. and the G string is worst when it comes to staying in tune. i need to play the instrument about 20-30minutes and tune the guitar almost every minute until it finally stays in tune. because of this issue i cant use that guitar on live performances (i used once and i was slightly out of tune nearly half of the gig) so i found the problem. it is the stock nut so i upgraded the nut and fixed it.

i also bought a 2004 model fender american deluxe stratocaster about 1.5 years ago. again the feeling and the tone is phenomenal. but it always go out of tune easly when i use its whammy bar and believe me i use it really soft and slow.. i still couldnt fix the problem but its not a reallly big deal for me since i dont use whammy bar much.

and recently one of my students bought a 2016 model fender american standart stratocaster and guess what happened... it cant stay in tune... and again we found that the problem is with the stock nut so he upgraded the nut and everything is fine now.

what makes me angry is you dont encounter a tuning issue with a 250dollar ibanez/cort/shecter but you have to upgrade or fix some part to make your 1000-1500dollar guitar stay in tune.

what are your thought ? does anyone experienced the same thing before ? or i was the only unlucky guy ?
 
Buy a Suhr or an EVH Wolfie USA model and never look back!
Mass produced products will never have the attention to detail a Suhr has. PRS lovers will say the same and so will Tom Anderson or Tyler users -try and see what you like the best.
 
I have a 96 American Standard strat abd i put locking tuners in and that solved it for me.
Good luck.
 
I bought a Les Paul custom in the same time period as you, and yep, had to replace the nut straightaway. I went into the purchase knowing about it though, after doing some reading beforehand. Gibson "quality" at this point is fairly well accepted as poor; buyer beware.
 
I love Joe Walsh even more now!!! He's hilarious.

I'm fighting with a signature Strat at the moment. It has locking tuners, a 2-point trem. and a pop-in trem. arm. I can't even put the trem. arm in without it going out of tune. It did come with 0.009's though and I've since changed to 0.010's. I tried moving the spring claw to counter the added tension, but I think it may need another spring or two. Probably needs some Big Bends nut sauce too.
 
Last edited:
Gibson and Fender have struggled with inconsistent quality for decades. Some are fantastic. Some are not. The period from the late '60s to late '70s was the worst. I know a guy who was a tech at a guitar shop in the '70s. There was a period when every Les Paul that came into the shop needed a fret dress before it went on display.

There are multiple things that can cause a guitar to not stay in tune. You owe it to yourself to find out which of those things is going on with your guitar so you know what to fix.
 
Toopy14 said:
I'm fighting with a signature Strat at the moment.I can't even put the trem. arm in without it going out of tune. It did come with 0.009's though and I've since changed to 0.010's.
Click to expand...
When you go up in string gauge, it's not unusual to need bigger nut slots. Can't really blame that on the guitar.
 
Rex said:
When you go up in string gauge, it's not unusual to need bigger nut slots. Can't really blame that on the guitar.
Click to expand...

I don't believe the strings are binding at the nut. I keep a 10" snippet of a set of old strings which I use as a gauge to check the slots in the nut.
 
Final attention to detail is where most mass produced instruments fall short. They don't put a ton of effort in to setting up the guitar because 9 times out of 10 the person that buys it will adjust it to their liking anyway. Changing strings sizes and even brands can have a noticeable impact on the setup especially when a tremolo system is involved. Many people also use different tunings too. Time is usually not a luxury for most builders as well. They push things through to get them out the door for the fastest turn around. Ideally, you should let the wood of a new guitar acclimate to being tuned up to pitch for a good couple of weeks if not longer before you do your final fret leveling, re-crown, nut adjustments and final setup. Freshly milled lumber often moves around a tiny bit as it slowly settles into it's new shape and any new stresses put on it like screw and string tension. Properly dried wood is more stable, but it always moves a little. It's the nature of wood. Factories aren't going to leave near finished inventory just sitting around for that kind of time though. They push it out and hope for the best. I think you have to pretty much assume that any guitar you buy will likely need a setup once you get it. Sometimes you get lucky, but more times than not, it will need to be adjusted to your tastes.

Beyond that, always stretch your strings repeatedly until they stop going flat.
 
Rex said:
Where do yo figure the problem is?
Click to expand...

I just spent about an hour going over the whole guitar. I added another spring, then set it up from scratch and it seems to be staying in tune now.

Tomorrow I'll double-check the nut slots though, as you suggested. If need be, I'll use some 2000 grit sand paper to clean them out a bit, then add some nut sauce.
 
cragginshred said:
Buy a Suhr or an EVH Wolfie USA model and never look back!
Mass produced products will never have the attention to detail a Suhr has. PRS lovers will say the same and so will Tom Anderson or Tyler users -try and see what you like the best.
Click to expand...

An EVH USA is made in the same factory as a USA Fender Strat...
The MIM EVH guitars are some of the worst guitars I've seen- the neck/fret work is literally on par with a $20 childs guitar at Target.
They look cool, and are finished fairly well (you really are just paying for the finish, any $150 Ibanez guitar is a better built instrument)- but the necks are hot trash.
 
Gibson is not the worst company to work for in musical instruments...
Year after year- Gibson is considered the worst corporation of all of the USA to work for...

It's #1 in employee dissatisfaction, and #1 in hatred for the CEO.
That's not just in music- that's of any company in America today!

$200 china knock off guitar has ebony- Gibson needs $6000 to sell you a guitar with ebony.

Anyway- here is my top 5 list of best NEW guitar manufactures today...
5.
4.
3.
2.
1.
(There are none- some are not so bad- but overall if you spend money on a new instrument today- you are getting a terrible value for the money compared to any other time in history- there isn't ONE new guitar I'd tell anyone to go out and buy today- and I spend more time shopping for guitars than I do playing them)
 
Jeries said:
...overall if you spend money on a new instrument today- you are getting a terrible value for the money compared to any other time in history-
Click to expand...
Sorry, I can't agree with you there. Things have never been better for getting a good guitar for reasonable money. On average, second-tier or lower guitars forty years ago were crude things compared to what's available today.
 
Gibson and Fender are living off of (long gone) past merits and are led by douche-bags who’s only goals are profit maximization, thus the overpriced, substandard quality instruments in relation to the price asked. Labeling a guitar as a 59 LP reissue is a marketing gag to (try to) justify the markup, which works to an extent, as there are always people out there who are willed to eat the shit they’re fed.

Every guitar I have is more or less modified; all have become a custom fitted bone nut (accept my Peavey Wolfgang obviously) due to the fact that 99% of the time this is the Achilles-heel of an off-the-shelf guitar.

Bottom line for me to get what I wanted was; I ended up buying a custom made body and neck (thanks Tommy @ USACG) and populated the rest with select parts (even routed the bridge cavities myself). Surprising to me, this became my go to guitar, even let my PRS Modern Eagle look old, and that to an extent that I couldn’t justify keeping it when my home-build (Avatar) was so much better for a third of the price, oh well… bye, bye Eagle.
 
Rex said:
Sorry, I can't agree with you there. Things have never been better for getting a good guitar for reasonable money. On average, second-tier or lower guitars forty years ago were crude things compared to what's available today.
Click to expand...

Guitars $100-500 are better than ever... some are so good it makes $1000+ guitars look bad.

Let me clarify my view... if you spend $2500 on a guitar today, which to me is a lot of money because I'm the cheapest bastard on earth- i don't think you get a good value. The $2500 guitar today would be a great $1000-1500 guitar- but for what your money gets you today- it's really bad.

Like- a New Gibson Les Paul Standard- should be $1250-1300- to have them $2500 then jump them a few years ago to $4000 list- etc- it's not a good instrument for the money.

ESP/LTD has great guitars in the $500-600 range, but when they get up to $1000... it's a little steep for what you get...

Fender is putting their name on tons of Chinese guitars today- those guitars look great and many of them have great necks and are well built- but they'll never hold value. I can't even think of a chinese guitar that holds it's value much- there's only a hand full of Korean ones.

Some guitars in the $1000 range are pretty fair too- but overall- i'd say if you're looking at new guitars $1500 or more- it's a horrible value for the money. Sweetwater Black Friday of last year- not this year was selling PRS SE's for $350 new- probably the best value in the last decade- but, a $1500 Fender USA is a good $600-700 guitar but for $1500- it's not worth it.

A MIM Fender with good pickups beats out most guitars 4x the price.
I felt that way about Ibanez too until I started only buying good Japan ones and not cheap Indonesian ones and it made my life so much easier.

But there's steals out there too- I found an MIJ 1999 Ibanez- purple- like a RG570 or something- maybe 2 weeks ago- asking $150 or 199- it was missing like $30 in floyd parts- got it for $75... BUT- all the great deals...aren't new. It's all used.
 
Which is why I buy used. I am a Les Paul lover. Some people say it's a clumsy design, and they are to heavy, but for me, the guitar feels extremely comfortable.
With that said, The last time I purchased a new Les Paul was back in 2001 when you could get a Standard new for 1800.00 out the door. In todays market I would never pay what the new price is for a Les Paul standard.
I would rather go on Reverb, and find a early 2000's Les Paul Standard (which IMO is a fantastic era of Les Paul as I love the 50's neck on those years) that is in great shape and pick it up for 1000 - 1600 used.
I have had new nuts installed in every Les Paul I own, and had them dressed properly as to eliminate as much as possible string binding. Unfortunately due to the design of the headstock though you will never eliminate binding all together, it's just due to the nature of the angle the strings come out of the nut slot to get to the tuner. it's not a straight pull, so it will inevitably bind up.
 
The Roller nut concept is interesting. I've heard tell about negative tone impact but it seems it would only affect open notes and it's the same material as frets so seems like not much Impact to me
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom