whats wrong with gibson and fender ?

Some time ago I went to a music store to get me a LesPaul just to find out the thing I dreamed of was junk. Grabbed an ESP Heritage I of the wall and loved it except for the action that someone had turned so low you practically didn't need to touch the strings at all.
 
"$200 china knock off guitar has ebony- Gibson needs $6000 to sell you a guitar with ebony."

Thank the current administration for all the regulations they provided..
 
I have (2) Gibson Les Paul Stds. 2012 & 2016 both stock. I am very pleased. I learned how set them up correctly through trial and error. They stay in tune for me using the FX-8 Tuner..
 
I have owned two higher end Les Pauls and an SG that sounded great but the G string would NEVER stay in tune despite set ups by good
technicians. Live this simply does not work.

I honestly believe my EVH Wolfie (USA) can get the best of a Les Paul tone with all the snap and tone of a Super strat -must be why Ed went for this wood combo and pick up wind that captures everything tonally I want.

Then there is Suhr -not a Les Paul but when you play one you will notice the attention to detail where every note is perfect of the neck and it stays in tune.
 
Last edited:
My Custom Shop Gibson SG for a while was probably my worst guitar at staying in tune. The G string would detune in the middle of playing it. The corian nut tended to bind up, so I had it replaced with a bone nut. It stays in tune much better now.
 
Fender is putting their name on tons of Chinese guitars today

That's the Squier brand. Fender brand guitars and basses are all made here in the USA or in Mexico (standard series). Same goes for Gibson. Gibsons are all made in the USA and Epiphones are imports.
 
I get the frustration, but all the corporate bashing is a bit much. Gibson and Fender both still make very fine instruments. They both could step up their QC a bit, but I sure as hell wouldn't turn down either one as a gift. Biggest difference in cost between a domestic and import instruments is labor cost. We Americans like our higher wages, retirement benefits, health insurance, and safe working environments. That comes at the cost of higher prices. No way around that. Welcome to the global economy. When comparing instruments by price, the cheaper imports will always seem like a better deal, because generally they are. Modern production techniques like CNC routing allow companies to produce higher quality and more consistent instruments, so that price difference based on labor cost will get more and more glaring as time goes on. Because of that cheap labor, foreign producers can devote more man hours to QC and setup and still have a low priced instrument. Not the case here in the USA. Considering the price difference between a typical Suhr and a USA standard Strat is close to $1000, it's no surprise they can afford to devote more time and attention to their products.

As for the ebony thing. Ebony is a very slow growing wood. That's why it's so hard. Common sense says you that if you run around cutting down all the 100+ year old trees and use up that wood, you are going to have to wait another 100+ years for those trees to re-grow. It's mostly supply and demand and the supply is shrinking very fast. Government regulation has little to do with it. They are simply trying to ensure that we don't run out completely, albeit a bit heavy-handedly. Plus, those cheap Chinese guitars may say that it's ebony, but don't hold your breath.
 
Go to a small builder, Tom Anderson will build something that will roast anything gibson or fender makes, and still be cheaper. Some of the prices that Gibson charges is literally retarded. I have a MIJ Tokai Love Rock that i'll put up next to any Gibson any day of the week.

People are suckered into the name and the misguided idea that they will blow up in price like a 59 burst someday. Those days are gone, there are far too many produced to blow up like that ever again.

If you must have a gibson, i'd buy it new, and i'd ride whoever i bought it from to fix it until it's right. Anything commanding that kind of dough should be perfect.
 
The Roller nut concept is interesting. I've heard tell about negative tone impact but it seems it would only affect open notes and it's the same material as frets so seems like not much Impact to me

Yep. Tonal differences in nut materials is often exaggerated. It does make a difference, but not as much as people think. Nickel silver frets are much harder and more dense than Corian or bone, yet do you hear a substantial difference in tone between open and fretted notes? There is a difference, but it's usually fairly subtle unless you've got a really soft nut. Luthiers love bone because it's traditional and easy to work. In reality, synthetic materials are often more consistent and durable, since bone, like wood, has natural variations in density throughout. Roller nuts and locking nuts are often made of steel, which is much harder and more dense than nickle-silver fretwire, so changing from say bone to a roller nut is going to be a bit more noticeable change since you are going from something softer than frets, to something harder. Brass (copper + zinc) is fairly similar in hardness to nickel-silver (copper + nickel + zinc) fretwire. Generally, the harder the material the more easily vibrations travel through it, so you tend to get a bit brighter sound and longer sustain. Same goes for wood too.
 
Last edited:
Suhr solved all my guitar gas

Thinking about pulling trigger and buying a Suhr. Stuff we play is in rock and alternative realm. I'm in terms of Les Paul (actually PRS here), tele and Strat world - next guitar, flexibility is the goal. Anything to keep in mind as I Iook?
 
I got into Fractal in 2009 and basically sold all my amps & cabs in the following 2 to 3 years. In the mean time, I had been using a combination of PRS, Les Paul, MusicMan and Fender guitars. I tried a Suhr classic(SSS) with SS frets and a built in Illitch system sometime in 2012, I absolutely loved it. After more research I settled on a Suhr S4 HSS with SS frets and an Illitch.
I have since sold every guitar I own except 1 PRS that never leaves the house and purchased an identical backup S4(different color) with Illitch.
It's been approximately 5 or 6 yrs now and I never ever think about guitars and amps anymore, just accessories (picks, strings, etc...).

My focus is on playing.

If I cant cover it with an S4 and Fractal, the problem is not the gear, it's the player.

FWIW, the Les Paul I had was a stunning highly flamed 2004 that would not stay in tune, very frustrating instrument.

Good luck on your search.
 
It is no secret that Gibson and Fender both suffer from quality issues. They used to compete for sound, style, and quality. Now they compete for bottom line profit margin. I have tried to like their new guitars, I mean really tried. I WANT to like them, but truth is, I really don't. I play Suhr (a modern with 2x humbuckers and a Classic with ML 3x single coil). I have a bunch of PRSs, but I favor the Suhrs. They are expensive, but well worth the $$$ for a discerning player, at least IMHO. Both Fender and Gibson will have to maintain the highest quality standards for many years to gain back a reputation for quality. Once you lose a customer over quality, it is very difficult to get them to return.
 
as i can see if you want a normal functional fender/gibson you have to to the range of 3000dollars or you may have to modify/upgrade some parts to make it work fine.
i think ibanez is good with its quality too i dont know its recent models but i have a rg prestige that i beated for almost 7 years but i never encountered a problem. only thing is its freatboard is too flat for me but thats just personal likings.
how is prs and esp ? anyone had any problem similar to gibson/fender ?
 
Not true at all. Take any brand new Gibson or Fender to a decent luthier and spend $50 having it professionally setup (or learn to do it properly yourself) and you will have a very good quality instrument that will get the job done for years to come. Personal preference aside, the idea that stock Fenders and Gibsons are not good enough is just plain false. The idea of having to spend a little bit of money on a new guitar is frustrating, but it's not like they are complete junk. A sticking nut slot is not a reason to spend $3000 on a new guitar.
 
I have the exact same guitar as the OP - a 2012 LP traditional - I haven't had any tuning issues other than what would be considered "normal" amount of tuning. I love that guitar - plays and sounds great. I have had one set up done on it and it probably played a little better after. I also have a Fender Ritchie Kotzen (made in japan) Tele - I LOVE that thing - it has more sustain that most guitars I have played - right out of the box it was set up perfectly. That being said - I also got an American standard strat a few years ago and it was set up horribly from the factory - and I still have some issues with it. I also have a PRS Custom 24 which is probably my #1 - locking tuners, perfect setup, exquisitely made - just great all around instrument. Its kind of like buying a new tv - spending $1800 then getting it calibrated...
That being said there are plenty of Korean made guitars that are pretty well made these days....
 
If you are in the market for a fender, and are in near the California shop, take the tour, you can test one right out of their racks and a great discount.
 
The trick to the G string is to just get some 1000 grit sand paper fold it in halve and open up the slot in the nut just a little, clean it and stretch and set your strings in place. The G string is binding, and you know this if you are hearing a "ting" when tuning. Keep it from binding. If you have an older LP with no locking tuners than you have to learn how to lock in your strings when restring your guitar or they will loosen up when you bend them.....
 
Back
Top Bottom