The importance of Mono for live guitar playing

tubelessone said:
I feel this topic so deep. YouTube guitarist are always doing their videos in stereo, and yeah, it sounds nice, but I make all my presets in mono, for a few reasons.
One, saving space on the mixer, just one xlr and done. Two, a lot of venue sound guys are going to laugh, slap your guitar on one mono, and call it good. Three, something about guys that play live in stereo seems very, um, "oh look at my fancy rig, I'm going to need TWO inputs". At the end of the day, these little differences don't matter in the middle of a set when the full PA is blasting and the band is rocking out. In the headphones or the car yes you can really enjoy that, but live mid-song, nah.
My 2 cents.
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32+ channel boards mean house guys don't sweat 1 extra input in my experience. Whether it's to have a 2nd amp sound (works in mono) or to run stereo fx in a mono system (moot) is when they'll give you the 'you're fresh outta the box' look. .02
 
Shepdoggiest said:
32+ channel boards mean house guys don't sweat 1 extra input in my experience. Whether it's to have a 2nd amp sound (works in mono) or to run stereo fx in a mono system (moot) is when they'll give you the 'you're fresh outta the box' look. .02
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that's fair. I've deal with some curmudgeons LOL
:D
 
This is why you do your own mixes live. (Clubs, small shows)
Some clubs require us to send the two bus out to their PA. We mix our own ears everywhere.
Might not translate that stereo preset live but it isn't gonna hurt. No one complains about my live tones. Ever.
 
I have been playing stereo since 1991. I own the PA and mixer for my band, and my latest band is just guitar, bass and drums. Our sound man can tell when I kick in a stereo chorus, echo, or enhancer, and says it really opens up the Live sound of the guitar, from when I don’t have any stereo effects on, to when I kick one or more on. It’s a great effect live.
Since the volume of the guitar is the same both left and right, it doesn’t detract from what people can hear, be it in a small or large room, or even outdoors.
 
bread said:
As stereo as I can get it. Never had any issues
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Same here, it works great, I have a stereo cab on stage, and a separate stereo feed to FOH, panned hard L/R. Sounds huge.
All the internet troll talk of it not working or phase issues, or not being any good if you’re not stood slap bang in the centre of the stereo field, well that’s all total bollocks. Never ever listen to any of it, it’s nonsense.
 
I use to use two Mesa Boogie Mark IV's with a rack and I noticed that in different venues one side would always be louder than the other and if it was a club that you played at a lot, every time you'd play there it would sound different. I also realized that when using chorus or a panning delay unless the audience is sitting directly in the middle (which we know is impossible) it sounds really weird. I rarely had the luxury of having a sound system (unless we were playing at a festival) so everything had to be balanced with the rest of the band and even playing solo. After hearing from some people that said it sounded weird that's when I realized it was because of stereo so I went back to playing mono in live situations and the problem was instantly solved.
 
mlancaster1 said:
So I typically run output 1 in stereo to my x32 rack and then output 2 goes to my power amp and cab in mono but if I wanted to give FOH mono and keep my in ears in stereo, how would I achieve this?
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If you have channels, just send both lines and let the desk sort that out.
 
Admin M@ said:
If you have channels, just send both lines and let the desk sort that out.
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I never rely the on the desk to sort it out. I take my guitar out of the IEM mix and use a line mixer to blend in the stereo mix. That way no matter what, at least I can hear myself. Anywhere I play out uses a stereo mixing board and typically streams in stereo. I also rum my IEM mix through a dbx IEM processor. The multiband compression and a touch of reverb really glue the IEM mix together and makes it easier to here all the instruments and vocals. My my wireless IEM is a stereo mix (minus my guitar) from an IEM mixer to the dbx iem processor and output 2 in stereo.

I always check my preset for mono compatibility so I don't run into FOH phase issue. One advantage of splitting off the guitar signal from my IEM mix is I get less latency on the guitars signal (since the boards and monitor sends are usually digital).

The concept the desk sort it out always makes me nervous :)
 
Absolute garbage to have mono sound whether at home, in a club, install or live. It sounds like CRAP period. I just went to Machine Head/Fear Factory/Orbit culture in toronto and for any 2 guitar bands the sound atrocious, muddy, confusing in the directionality of the sound, had more phase issues as is expected, and was just overall mushy. Which is why only Fear Factory had ok sound cus it's just Dino's guitar. But the rest was really bad.

9 out of 10 live sound people are incredibly incompetent and lack even the most basic of aesthetic sensibility in understanding any form of audio. They are clueless about creating a sense of space and even with the frequency balance. Always getting the nonsense juvenile V shape EQ clowns creating mono much. No surprise.

That's what they did in the 50's where they got the term monophonic when they didn't have sophisticated audio. To not run stereo or LCR is inexcusable and if it's just because you can't afford the extra cable runs for your venue then you have no business in the live sound business because you are ruining the sonic experience for everyone.

This especially becomes a problem for noisy and busy music like rock and metal and I can't believe this is still actually being debated.

If not true stereo then at least LCR is used in the most professional live setups if one finds it important to hear the other guitar player more on the other side but stereo is always preferable to mono and would much rather just have a focused sound if I'm stuck off to the side. One will still hear the reverse side information just like they do in night clubs that don't run mono.

If this wasn't such a heated issue then everybody would be running mono which isn't the case because you do sometimes do get some people know what the hell they are doing.
 
tubelessone said:
I feel this topic so deep. YouTube guitarist are always doing their videos in stereo, and yeah, it sounds nice, but I make all my presets in mono, for a few reasons.
One, saving space on the mixer, just one xlr and done. Two, a lot of venue sound guys are going to laugh, slap your guitar on one mono, and call it good. Three, something about guys that play live in stereo seems very, um, "oh look at my fancy rig, I'm going to need TWO inputs". At the end of the day, these little differences don't matter in the middle of a set when the full PA is blasting and the band is rocking out. In the headphones or the car yes you can really enjoy that, but live mid-song, nah.
My 2 cents.
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That's only if there is literally one piano and one vocalist/one of everything basically.
But add a second guitar player and it starts to muddy it all up.

If you have a band or orchestra you need to spread the width otherwise it sounds like everyone is coming from the same confusing source when your left and right and possibly center are that same source causing all that indistinctness. It really is bad and that's why it's unpleasant sounding to go see multiple guitar player bands live.

It's venues cheaping out on their own cable runs. It's running the left to right in series to save on the longer run. And forget LCR with those owners because that will never come. They prolly too thick-skulled to even understand what LCR for live is and prolly even are incapable of understanding what stereo even is.
 
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Sixstring said:
Yes!
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Got ya! It’s funny, because taking the stereo spread down to 0% really does sound different than just taking a Left out for a mono signal. It’s subtle, but sounds slightly less phasey and fuller, at least from what I’ve noticed. Almost like the true mono version where the relationship of the wet effects stay the same with the dry, only in mono if that makes sense.
 
Admin M@ said:
If you have channels, just send both lines and let the desk sort that out.
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So if I want to run mono to FOH and stereo in ears and using an x32 rack, would it look like this?

Output 1 from fractal (stereo) left and right going to in1 and in2, Output 2 from fractal (mono) going to in 3, and Output 3 going into power amp/cab and then just give FOH a line for Output 2 (mono)

I've actually never put much thought into this previously. I've always just gave FOH 2 lines for Left and Right, but curious to experiment.
 
mlancaster1 said:
So if I want to run mono to FOH and stereo in ears and using an x32 rack, would it look like this?

Output 1 from fractal (stereo) left and right going to in1 and in2, Output 2 from fractal (mono) going to in 3, and Output 3 going into power amp/cab and then just give FOH a line for Output 2 (mono)

I've actually never put much thought into this previously. I've always just gave FOH 2 lines for Left and Right, but curious to experiment.
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didnt read the whole thread but this confuses me. Why would anyone want to do this? IEMs are for monitoring, FOH is for the show. The show should be lush stereo effects. Monitoring is just so you can hear yourself. Seems like a waste of an output bus if you ask me.
 
A FOH SoundGuy Perspective —

Send me all the channels you like, but I strongly suggest you test listen to your stereo presets in mono — because that’s what the audience will hear for 90% of the show.

Here’s the deal: I’m doing everything I can to get every source separated from the many many sounds coming off the stage so that each source is distinctly “available” to be heard in the overall mix, and most of the time I’m taking your multiple channels and comping them down to an additional single mono signal — and THAT’S the fader I’m using in the mix most of the time, except for those occasions when you’re soloing front and center (which is when I dial up your additional channels to gloriously occupy more space in the mix). Without the ability to create that overall space in the mix you lose most of the punch and clarity that makes live music so exciting.

Do keep in mind that I do this every time, regardless if the FOH system is mono or “stereo” (a somewhat nebulous concept in most live applications) unless, of course, you’re soloing and you want the ambience of a huge/immersive sound.

So there. 👍
 
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