Real AC30TB using 4CM with Q6.02beta

Toopy14

Toopy14

Axe-Master
I just had to share this...

I have an AC30 CC2, with a Weber Blue Dog and Weber Silver Bell. The amp. was modified to original 1965 specs. and it also has power scaling, which works great. I get great tones from it with single coils & Humbuckers and thanks to the power scaling, I can keep what's left of my hearing (I'm 52).

A while back I connected the AC30 using the 4CM. When using amp. sims., with the Weber's, it sounded okay, but you could still tell the difference between the real amp. and the sim., at least to my ears anyway. I spent a lot of time reading and asking questions, learning about 4CM. I set the levels properly, I tried cabinet modelling on and off, etc., but still wasn't happy with it. So I never really used the 4CM again....now and then I would try it again, but still wasn't happy with it.

Thanks to @edo and the settings he posted a while back, all my presets sound pretty darn good when I'm using headphones, so I only used the amp. sims, with headphones. In those settings Edo posted, a few versions back, I also learned about the Speaker Drive parameter. It definitely made a difference, but now my headphone presets sound even better with Q6.02b. So, I thought I would give the 4CM a try again.

After getting all the levels re-adjusted so I could switch back and forth between the real amp. and amp. sims., so the volume was the same, I was floored. I honestly could not tell the difference anymore. I bet if someone was sitting in the room listening, they would not be able to tell me which was the AC30TB amp. sim. and which was the real AC30TB. I'm actually going to test that theory in the near future with a colleague of mine who's been playing guitar for a long time and is also extremely knowledgeable with amp. design and repair.

@FractalAudio, I'm not sure what series of 1's and 0's you added to that new Speaker Drive algorithm, but what ever they were, they were definitely in the right sequence. At least to my ears, I would say you achieved the holy grail of amp. modelling...the 'amp. in the room' feel!! :)

BTW, I'm an MK-I user too...so thank you very much for continuing to support all the MK-I and MK-II owners!!!!
 
Last edited:
FractalAudio said:
If you're wondering where the release version is we're waiting for a "Timmy" pedal to show up so we can add that to the Drive block.
Click to expand...

Not really wondering where the release version is. The longer you take to release it, the more goodies we get! I am wondering though, what's a "Timmy" pedal? :oops:

I also have to add. That other than delay and some EQ, on the Axe-Fx, I mainly used my pedals...MIJ SD-1, TS-9, Vintage Dynacomp, MIJ CS-2, MIJ OD-2, etc. with my AC30TB. The pedal OD's just sounded better with my amp. The SD-1 absolutely makes the JJ's in my amp. sing. I always heard that term, 'singing tubes', but never knew what it meant. Well, after your recent tweaks of the OD pedals, I can tell you that the SuperOD can make the JJ's sing just like my SD-1!!! The Axe-Fx OD's sound amazing into the AC30 now!!
 
Toopy14 said:
Not really wondering where the release version is. The longer you take to release it, the more goodies we get! I am wondering though, what's a "Timmy" pedal? :oops:

I also have to add. That other than delay and some EQ, on the Axe-Fx, I mainly used my pedals...MIJ SD-1, TS-9, Vintage Dynacomp, MIJ CS-2, MIJ OD-2, etc. with my AC30TB. The pedal OD's just sounded better with my amp. The SD-1 absolutely makes the JJ's in my amp. sing. I always heard that term, 'singing tubes', but never knew what it meant. Well, after your recent tweaks of the OD pedals, I can tell you that the SuperOD can make the JJ's sing just like my SD-1!!! The Axe-Fx OD's sound amazing into the AC30 now!!
Click to expand...
https://reverb.com/p/paul-cochrane-timmy-pedal
 
When I was using real amps, I had the Timmy always-on to simulate an edge of breakup touchy feelyness without blasting the amp.

In Fractal-land, I use it in front as a "this amp tone sounds awesome, let's add a little special sauce" drive stage.
 
FractalAudio said:
If you're wondering where the release version is we're waiting for a "Timmy" pedal to show up so we can add that to the Drive block.
Click to expand...

Great ! I was hoping to see it someday in the Drive block (the last drive updates are amazing btw) . Thank you !
 
Btw @troopy14, I'm not sure what you mean by 4cm.. I mean, as far as I know (and I admit I don't know much about it as It's been quite a long time since I used to have an amp with fx loop), 4cm refers to a specific configuration where you have your preamp fx going into the amp input and your post fx going into the fx loop, so I don't see how you would use that to compre a real amp to the axe amp...
 
Toopy14 said:
I just had to share this...

I have an AC30 CC2, with a Weber Blue Dog and Weber Silver Bell. The amp. was modified to original 1965 specs. and it also has power scaling, which works great. I get great tones from it with single coils & Humbuckers and thanks to the power scaling, I can keep what's left my hearing (I'm 52).

A while back I connected the AC30 using the 4CM. When using amp. sims., with the Weber's, it sounded okay, but you could still tell the difference between the real amp. and the sim., at least to my ears anyway. I spent a lot of time reading and asking questions, learning about 4CM. I set the levels properly, I tried cabinet modelling on and off, etc., but still wasn't happy with it. So I never really used the 4CM again....now and then I would try it again, but still wasn't happy with it.

Thanks to @edo and the settings he posted a while back, all my presets sound pretty darn good when I'm using headphones, so I only used the amp. sims, with headphones. In those settings Edo posted, a few versions back, I also learned about the Speaker Drive parameter. It definitely made a difference, but now my headphone presets sound even better with Q6.02b. So, I thought I would give the 4CM a try again.

After getting all the levels re-adjusted so I could switch back and forth between the real amp. and amp. sims., so the volume was the same, I was floored. I honestly could not tell the difference anymore. I bet if someone was sitting in the room listening, they would not be able to tell me which was the AC30TB amp. sim. and which was the real AC30TB. I'm actually going to test that theory in the near future with a colleague of mine who's been playing guitar for a long time and is also extremely knowledgeable with amp. design and repair.

@FractalAudio, I'm not sure what series of 1's and 0's you added to that new Speaker Drive algorithm, but what ever they were, they were definitely in the right sequence. At least to my ears, I would say you achieved the holy grail of amp. modelling...the 'amp. in the room' feel!! :)

BTW, I'm an MK-I user too...so thank you very much for continuing to support all the MK-I and MK-II owners!!!!
Click to expand...

Can you point me to where @edo shared his AC30 settings? I need to get the AC30 dialed in on my AX8.
 
FractalAudio said:
If you're wondering where the release version is we're waiting for a "Timmy" pedal to show up so we can add that to the Drive block.
Click to expand...

@FractalAudio since you brought out the final release topic, I noticed that in the current beta the ac30tb preamp tube type defaults at 12ax7 syl while the ac30hot defaults at ecc83. Correct me if I'm wrong, aren't these models from the same exact amp/preamp (current vox ac30hw2 hand wired), hence share the same preamp section with the same tubes??
 
edo said:
Btw @troopy14, I'm not sure what you mean by 4cm.. I mean, as far as I know (and I admit I don't know much about it as It's been quite a long time since I used to have an amp with fx loop), 4cm refers to a specific configuration where you have your preamp fx going into the amp input and your post fx going into the fx loop, so I don't see how you would use that to compre a real amp to the axe amp...
Click to expand...

I can guarantee you know more than me about this stuff! :)

If I understand correctly, with the FX-Loop and Cab in the Axe-Fx bypassed, I'm using the power amp section of the AC30TB and the speakers in it as a powered cab. Then I use the Amp block along with any effects I want in my chain.
 
edo said:
Btw @troopy14, I'm not sure what you mean by 4cm.. I mean, as far as I know (and I admit I don't know much about it as It's been quite a long time since I used to have an amp with fx loop), 4cm refers to a specific configuration where you have your preamp fx going into the amp input and your post fx going into the fx loop, so I don't see how you would use that to compre a real amp to the axe amp...
Click to expand...

Edo, I think what he means is he is using the 4CM for maximum flexibility and use the Axe with the real amp or with headphones. In a comparison, I'm sure Tony would still put the effects in front of the real amp (and not in the effects loop) which wouldn't require the 4CM, but it's there if he needs it. I think Tony is just comparing real amp with the amp sims and the 4CM is being used similar to the way he would use the amp sim (effects in front of the amp).
 
I've got a Rockett Blue Note I could send if anyone is interested (similar to Timmy). I'm guessing one or the other could be tweaked with the deep parameters in the AX to cover both.
 
Cool on the Timmy addition- I've used the original Tim pedal on virtually every pedal board I've built since Paul first released it. Fantastic boost pedal for Marshall circuits especially.
 
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