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Question About Celestion F12-x200, is it ok if I do this?

FrancescoC26

New Member
Hello,
having read the hundreds of threads about FRFRs i stumbled upon these celestion speakers, and i already began planning for my future monitoring solution (i dont have an unit yet but i am a serial planner LMAO). I was wondering if it was okay to mount two of the F12-X200 inside of my old Fender Mustang IV v2 Combo, using it's power amp to power the speakers. right now the cab is loaded with 70/80s, i dont particularly hate them, its just that im going to switch to an fm9 sooner or later (whenever i get the money and my name comes up) and so i was wondering if it was safe to get a pair of f12'S and run them in stereo using the mustang's power amp. is it powerful enough? or should i spend money on an external power amp? i never swapped speaker and don't know how it all works so some enlightenment would be greatly appreciated. here are some pictures of the back of my amp. thanks in advance (i will even clean it eventually xD) photo1662200603.jpegphoto1662200603 (1).jpegphoto1662200603 (2).jpeg
 

FrancescoC26

New Member
if the speakers could be powered i would use the fx return of the amp to deliver the signal of the fm9 to the speakers
 

sprint

Axe-Master
The Mustang's return is not likely a neutral flat power amp and so could color the sound going to the F12s limiting their ability to translate accross varying sounds (their purpose wrt being Full Range). Clean, flat / high headroom amps (ie SD Powerstage, Matrix...) are more suited to this as they maintain a flat response and don't break up easily. Also, Celestion publushed a cab design for the F12s here - discussions on this suggest there is leeway to this design, but it could be that moving far from this spec would affect the F12's intended FR respose. Having said all this, if you get a pair of F12s it makes sense to carefully try them in the Mustang as it looks like an easy swap, and trying it may be the best way to know if it will, or will not, work well tonally (just make sure the F12s are compatble to the Mustang wrt to impedance, power rating ...). There are a number of threads here on the F12s (search for "x200") - i'd suggest reading those also.
 
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FrancescoC26

New Member
The Mustang's return is not likely a neutral flat power amp and so could color the sound going to the F12s limiting their ability to translate accross varying sounds (their purpose wrt being Full Range). Clean, flat / high headroom amps (ie SD Powerstage, Matrix...) are more suited to this as they maintain a flat response and don't break up easily. Also, Celestion publushed a cab design for the F12s here - discussions on this suggest there is leeway to this design, but it could be that moving far from this spec would affect the F12's intended FR respose. Having said all this, if you get a pair of F12s it makes sense to carefully try them in the Mustang as it looks like an easy swap, and trying it may be the best way to know if it will, or will not, work well tonally (just make sure the F12s are compatble to the Mustang wrt to impedance, power rating ...). There are a number of threads here on the F12s (search for "x200") - i'd suggest reading those also.
thanks! i looked at one hughe thread that was mostly about trouble shooting. the speakers in the mustang should be 8 ohms so i guess the impedance (if that is what im looking at) should be matched. i am opting for a first case scenario going on the cheaper route seeing that i am going to spend a few year's worth of birthdays and side money (even getting a few jobs here and there to pay for the unit) so when i saw threads praising the x200 i wanted to chime in. we'll see in the future though. thanks a lot
 

FrancescoC26

New Member
The Mustang's return is not likely a neutral flat power amp and so could color the sound going to the F12s limiting their ability to translate accross varying sounds (their purpose wrt being Full Range). Clean, flat / high headroom amps (ie SD Powerstage, Matrix...) are more suited to this as they maintain a flat response and don't break up easily. Also, Celestion publushed a cab design for the F12s here - discussions on this suggest there is leeway to this design, but it could be that moving far from this spec would affect the F12's intended FR respose. Having said all this, if you get a pair of F12s it makes sense to carefully try them in the Mustang as it looks like an easy swap, and trying it may be the best way to know if it will, or will not, work well tonally (just make sure the F12s are compatble to the Mustang wrt to impedance, power rating ...). There are a number of threads here on the F12s (search for "x200") - i'd suggest reading those also.
btw i checked and it should be flat enough. for my needs i could start with that and later on the line build the cabinets and get a dedicated power amp, or another pair of speakers altogether (i tried the elis8 which i loved)
 

FrancescoC26

New Member
I'm sure you're aware, but Celestion's cabs are a specific design, and most importantly, not open back.
You might like the sound you get, but that's not the sort of enclosure they're intended to go in.
thanks, will then see if i can afford enough money for another solution like the elis 8 instead of needing to buy a dedicated power amp and diy a cab
 

FrancescoC26

New Member
I'm sure you're aware, but Celestion's cabs are a specific design, and most importantly, not open back.
You might like the sound you get, but that's not the sort of enclosure they're intended to go in.
i had seen people flaunt about their amazing results by dropping them in any guitar cab, i just wanted to see if i could put my old mustang to use (since im selling my main amp to afford the fm9). i'll see if its better for me to go diy or buy another product. ty
 

skolacki

Power User
I ran one in an open back 112. I needed to stuff a cushion behind the speaker because of the wall reflections. It sounded great. So then I built a spec cab, expecting a big improvement. Both solutions sounded great.
 

FrancescoC26

New Member
I ran one in an open back 112. I needed to stuff a cushion behind the speaker because of the wall reflections. It sounded great. So then I built a spec cab, expecting a big improvement. Both solutions sounded great.
thanks for the response. what did you power it with?
 

sprint

Axe-Master
I ran one in an open back 112. I needed to stuff a cushion behind the speaker because of the wall reflections. It sounded great. So then I built a spec cab, expecting a big improvement. Both solutions sounded great.
depends on the definition of "sounds great" - imo, for an FR solution it needs to sound great and authentic as: a Vox AC30, a Fender Twin, Marshall Plexi / JCM800, a Dual Rec, an SLO, Dumble and ... without any added EQ to help it with any one of those vs a reference true FRFR. If it can't do this, it's just another great (or not so great, and possibly overly expensive given the price of F12s) amp/cab flavour.
 

skolacki

Power User
depends on the definition of "sounds great" - imo, for an FR solution it needs to sound great and authentic as: a Vox AC30, a Fender Twin, Marshall Plexi / JCM800, a Dual Rec, an SLO, Dumble and ... without any added EQ to help it with any one of those vs a reference true FRFR. If it can't do this, it's just another great (or not so great, and possibly overly expensive given the price of F12s) amp/cab flavour.

I’m happy with it and that’s all that matters to me. My cost came in well below most of the highly regarded solutions since I build my own stuff whenever possible. I’ve never tried anything besides a QSC PA speaker and a Headrush 112 so not sure how it compares.
 

sprint

Axe-Master
I’m happy with it and that’s all that matters to me. My cost came in well below most of the highly regarded solutions since I build my own stuff whenever possible. I’ve never tried anything besides a QSC PA speaker and a Headrush 112 so not sure how it compares.
fwiw - not saying you should not be happy with it - my point is more related to what criteria an FR solution needs be evaluated against for someone in the market to comfirm it can do all that an FR solution is designed for. If the OP wants it to perform accross all those sounds I mentioned then he'll be better off trying to confirm those screarios ahead of any big expenditures (if he'll only play Marshall presets then a couple of v30s at 1/2 the price may suffice just fine) - depends. But as I mention above, there's little cost to him trying them in the Mustang ahead of any further cab/amp purchases - I just would not have high hopes it'll translate well across many sounds given it's not an FR type power amp and the cab spec is way off from Celestion suggested design for the F12.
 
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skolacki

Power User
I think the F12’s are fairly forgiving as far as cab design goes. I base that off user feedback and demos on the tube where people loaded them into normal guitar cabs. To be honest, it sounded better in the open back. I think that is because of the wall reflections. The cushion I stuffed in there doesn’t stop it, it just tamed it down. In my living room with high ceilings it sounded huge. I never tried that cab in a jam with the guys. The ported cab works great with a band, cuts very well and definitely loud enough.

No idea about the amp in that Fender. Maybe it will be good and maybe not. Only one way to find out and that’s to throw money at it and hope it sticks. All this stuff costs a lot of money. So many people are looking for a cheaper way to amplify their modelers.

To the OP, try running your modeler without a cab block into the fx return of your mustang. That should give you an idea of how it will work out.

Edit: never mind I see you said you don’t have your unit yet. Smart to plan ahead.
 
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FrancescoC26

New Member
thanks to you for both of your response. the thing is that i am switching to fractal to get a various range of tones (i'd want to use a lot of different amps) so i will look into other amplification alternatives whenever i get my unit, and i'll go and ask a guy I know that has had fractal product for years. tried a jad&freer cab and liked it a lot
 

FrancescoC26

New Member
I think the F12’s are fairly forgiving as far as cab design goes. I base that off user feedback and demos on the tube where people loaded them into normal guitar cabs. To be honest, it sounded better in the open back. I think that is because of the wall reflections. The cushion I stuffed in there doesn’t stop it, it just tamed it down. In my living room with high ceilings it sounded huge. I never tried that cab in a jam with the guys. The ported cab works great with a band, cuts very well and definitely loud enough.

No idea about the amp in that Fender. Maybe it will be good and maybe not. Only one way to find out and that’s to throw money at it and hope it sticks. All this stuff costs a lot of money. So many people are looking for a cheaper way to amplify their modelers.

To the OP, try running your modeler without a cab block into the fx return of your mustang. That should give you an idea of how it will work out.

Edit: never mind I see you said you don’t have your unit yet. Smart to plan ahead.
i wanted to try and use the speakers in the mustang for live use (just to hear myself) and i think i'll start dialing tones via hedphones and the crappy pa speaker i have whenever i first get my unit, then we'll see for an upgrade. i am a 20 year old kid that is selling his gear and starting to work to afford this unit, so its kinda hard to spend 2400€ and then needing more money for better usage (i know that the weakest part of the signal is going to make the overall tone worse) but hey i still have a lot to go!
 
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