Need luthier advice from the wisemen

rsf1977

rsf1977

Fractal Fanatic
so i have a guitar problem I can't seem to correct:

Ibanez RGD321 hardtail Ibanez.com | Electric Guitars | RGD321
Scale Length: 26.5"
Tuned: A-E-A-D-Gb-B (drop-A)
Strings: Ernie Ball (.014 - .018 - .028w - .038w - .050w - .070w)
RGD321BKF.gif


It has never really played quite right. Originally I brought it to a good shop in NYC, I wont mention names, and they examined it and told me there was a a bit of a hump at the upper frets and they would fix it. They also put in my earvana nut and did a setup and all that jazz. Ok, so I get it back and it still feels like the notes are fretting out everywhere and slightly more towards the center of the neck. And it's not drastic, but everything feels splatty and kind of quacky if i dig in a bit while playing. The only remedy I can do is raise the action super high and add more relief then i want. And it still isn't completely gone.

Is there anything I can try that i haven't already done? Do neck shims address anything like this? Is there someone who is an awesome guitar tech in the NYC area I can go to? Any help would be great. I'm not a tech by any means, but i am comfortable with adjusting the small things, I'm learning slowly.
 
NP

Rich is pretty old-school.

If you hook up be sure to take the Axe with you...

He could stand to be dragged into the 21st...
 
rsf1977 said:
Do neck shims address anything like this?
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No--they accomplish the same thing as bridge/saddle height adjustment. One example: if you want lower action and the bridge is already as low as it can go, shimming can make it even lower. (Watch out for shimming advice that defies logic/geometry.)
 
oh damn!!! That Plek thing sounds amazing! Any idea what it costs to have a guitar put through that machine?
 
well i went to peekamoose for a consultation. They were really nice guys and I'm getting a set up and Plek-ing from them I'll let you know what happens
 
Probably the truss rod needs adjustment. Any good guitar tech will be able to easily test for this.

Part of the problem is also your tuning range and scale length... If you tune up to drop C or drop B you'll be in a range that's more sensible for that scale length. For drop A or lower, you should be more like 30" scale length. Even my 30" baritone with a 0.070 for the lowest string is sorta pushing it for drop G.

The neck is expecting a certain amount of tension from the strings, and with more or less than that amount, the neck will be under-bowed or over-bowed. That's where the truss rod adjustment comes in, with wood-necked guitars. The truss rod is adjusted before the action, your tech should already know that though.

Good luck!
 
rsf1977 said:
...they examined it and told me there was a a bit of a hump at the upper frets and they would fix it...I get it back and it still feels like the notes are fretting out everywhere and slightly more towards the center of the neck. And it's not drastic, but everything feels splatty and kind of quacky if i dig in a bit while playing. The only remedy I can do is raise the action super high and add more relief then i want. And it still isn't completely gone.
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For the following, I'm assuming that when you say you tried adding more relief, it means you've adjusted the truss rod to no avail.

There are a few possiblilities here:

  • If they got the neck angle wrong, that could cause the kind of problems you're seeing. Neck shims can change not only the action but the neck angle, depending on how they're used.
  • The frets may not have properly leveled. Fret leveling has to be done under string tension or the physical equivalent of tension. Good luthiers use a jig to put the right amount of stress on the neck before they level. Bad ones just lay the neck down and start filing away.
  • Did you change tuning or string guage since you got the guitar back? Either one could cause problems. New strings or tuning require a new setup.
 
Scott said:
Probably the truss rod needs adjustment. Any good guitar tech will be able to easily test for this.

Part of the problem is also your tuning range and scale length... If you tune up to drop C or drop B you'll be in a range that's more sensible for that scale length. For drop A or lower, you should be more like 30" scale length. Even my 30" baritone with a 0.070 for the lowest string is sorta pushing it for drop G.

The neck is expecting a certain amount of tension from the strings, and with more or less than that amount, the neck will be under-bowed or over-bowed. That's where the truss rod adjustment comes in, with wood-necked guitars. The truss rod is adjusted before the action, your tech should already know that though.

Good luck!
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I really think it goes beyond string gauge I have a normal 25.5" scale Ibanez RG in the same tuning with one gauge higher strings and it doesn't have this issue and the the action is lower. I guess I'll have the answers when the guitar returns from the plek-ing and setup, I'll let you know what I find out
 
Ok got my guitar back from being setup and plek-ed. This guitar plays and feels better then it ever did. It's really smooth now. The guys at Peekamouse NYC were really great too. I came in to pick it up and the action was too good, I needed them to raise it up a bit since I'm more familiar with high action and they did the adjustment right there while I waited. The frets look and feel amazing, there is way less buzz in general. I'm really happy with the work. I'd recommend anyone who has the extra cash to get a plek, it really elevated my instrument. And Peekamouse were excellent.
 
I'm glad it went well for you, and your guitar is performing as it should. I'm starting to wonder if the first shop didn't try to fix the upper-fret hump in your neck with a truss rod adjustment (you can't fix that problem without a fret dress, and it sometimes requires planing the fretboard as well).

For those of you who don't have access to a plek machine, never fear. You'd be hard-pressed to tell the difference between a plek job and one performed by hand by a competent luthier.
 
Peekamoose = great. I love that place. They've done almost all of my guitars. I am planning on bringing my JEM there as soon as I can afford it actually.
 
rsf1977 said:
Ok got my guitar back from being setup and plek-ed. This guitar plays and feels better then it ever did. It's really smooth now. The guys at Peekamouse NYC were really great too. I came in to pick it up and the action was too good, I needed them to raise it up a bit since I'm more familiar with high action and they did the adjustment right there while I waited. The frets look and feel amazing, there is way less buzz in general. I'm really happy with the work. I'd recommend anyone who has the extra cash to get a plek, it really elevated my instrument. And Peekamouse were excellent.
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cool! :)
 
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