Kemper Player is out, so pretty much all the competition now has a mini 3 button product… still no Fractal FM3 Lite???

Tanax said:
That's why profiles makes a lot of sense since Fractal (or other modelers) cannot possibly model every amp everyone wants. The amps I want might not even at all exist in Fractal (not saying they don't), in that scenario it is useless that Fractal has 200+ amps if they don't have the ones I want. Profiles let's you get exactly the amp you want, albeit with a lot of less editing power since it's not modeled.
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I fail to believe that the tone you're wanting couldn't be created from an existing model with adjustments to the myriad of options within the models.
 
More click baity title nonsense and opening post silliness - not sure what your waiting for exactly as Profilers / Axfx are apples / oranges, but personally, though I'm all for Fractal realeasing as many hardware variations as possible to leverage their great modelling, I wish for Axfx never to do profiling which imo is just a waste of effort. I will never want a half assed snapshot someone else took of their fav static amp settings with limited adjustability when I can have a working, accurately + fully adjustable, dynamic, immediate, and interactive model of an entire amp channel (even if it's not the exact same amp, I'll still work with that rather than a profile). I'd hate to see happen to Axfx what's happened with one of my favorite plugin suite developers who seem to have reallocated a lot of resources to profiling and turned down to a trickle any furtherance of the previous great aggressive progress they'd been making on component based amp modelling accuracy in plugin format - wasted opportunity.
 
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fcs101 said:
You're oversimplifying it. As Dave Merrill stated, you're profile needs to be set up the way you want. After it's done the tweaking is very limited. You'll need access to the actual amp to get "your" profile.
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Not if it’s been liquid profiled and at the end of the day the regular eq is fine.
 
axl-fx said:
Not if it’s been liquid profiled and at the end of the day the regular eq is fine.
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You're still not getting the level of fidelity of FAS's modeling approach. And...your definition of "fine" might not be so fine for more demanding users. We're back to the analogy of photography from a digital vs an actual camera.
 
fcs101 said:
You're still not getting the level of fidelity of FAS's modeling approach. And...your definition of "fine" might not be so fine for more demanding users. We're back to the analogy of photography from a digital vs an actual camera.
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That makes absolutely zero sense, the source is an amplifier.

You set it how you like it and press profile. If you are lucky that amp may have been liquid profiled which at least according to kemper says was copied from the real amps controls.

If this isn’t satisfactory how many people start pulling out soldering irons on a real amp?
 
axl-fx said:
That makes absolutely zero sense, the source is an amplifier.

You set it how you like it and press profile. If you are lucky that amp may have been liquid profiled which at least according to kemper says was copied from the real amps controls.

If this isn’t satisfactory how many people start pulling out soldering irons on a real amp?
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It makes 100% sense once you admit that few people will have direct access to profile the amp to "their" settings. With FAS's approach you can tweak it any which way you want, even beyond what the actual amp can do. With a profile, you'll have to rely on someone else's settings, whether that's a vendor, friend, or a give-away.

And yes, with FAS you can, in effect, pull out a virtual soldering iron to customize your amp.

You are adding zero value to a discussion that has played out multiple times on this board. You'd be best served to search for those discussions. If you absolutely must have a profiler then maybe augment your Fractal device with a Tonex; that seems to be the best bang for the buck based on comments.
 
Tanax said:
That's why profiles makes a lot of sense since Fractal (or other modelers) cannot possibly model every amp everyone wants. The amps I want might not even at all exist in Fractal (not saying they don't), in that scenario it is useless that Fractal has 200+ amps if they don't have the ones I want. Profiles let's you get exactly the amp you want, albeit with a lot of less editing power since it's not modeled.
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IMO if you can't get the sound you're after with one of the 326 amp models in the AFX III you're not going to find it, even if you can get that elusive profile of someone's Sealclubber 3000 XLS. I pay little to no attention to the names of the various amp models. I just care about getting the sound I'm after, and if I can't get it in a few minutes with minimal tweaking, I'll move on to another model. So far, this method has never left me wanting.
 
fcs101 said:
It makes 100% sense once you admit that few people will have direct access to profile the amp to "their" settings. With FAS's approach you can tweak it any which way you want, even beyond what the actual amp can do. With a profile, you'll have to rely on someone else's settings, whether that's a vendor, friend, or a give-away.

And yes, with FAS you can, in effect, pull out a virtual soldering iron to customize your amp.

You are adding zero value to a discussion that has played out multiple times on this board. You'd be best served to search for those discussions. If you absolutely must have a profiler then maybe augment your Fractal device with a Tonex; that seems to be the best bang for the buck based on comments.
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I mentioned myself doing the profiling (ie you doing the profile) and if that model has a liquid profile then the controls should respond the same way... I say should respond as a certain modeller with an “official” model didn’t compare as close to the real thing. I say that for any device because unless I can compare it to the 300+ amps etc I have no idea if it will sound the same.

Not to mention how many improvements/fixes have been done to certain models.... and who knows how many is left? Have you checked every model to compare to the real
Deal?

Im talking about how many people pull out soldering irons on an amp itself?

“Limitations” .... how many people really dive that deep? I don’t know one person in my life who has tried out an amp if if they could dial in a good sound started talking about pulling out a soldering iron... they just move on.

I mean more power to you if you want and do custom IR blends/change motor drive/impedance curves etc etc but don’t paint a huge chunk of guitar players all wanting this.

And I have multiple fractal products, two kempers, a QC and recently picked up a line 6 helix rack because of being tired of using the axefx iii UI for a guitar synth project. They all have their pros and cons.
 
axl-fx said:
I mentioned myself doing the profiling (ie you doing the profile) and if that model has a liquid profile then the controls should respond the same way... I say should respond as a certain modeller with an “official” model didn’t compare as close to the real thing. I say that for any device because unless I can compare it to the 300+ amps etc I have no idea if it will sound the same.

Not to mention how many improvements/fixes have been done to certain models.... and who knows how many is left? Have you checked every model to compare to the real
Deal?

Im talking about how many people pull out soldering irons on an amp itself?

“Limitations” .... how many people really dive that deep? I don’t know one person in my life who has tried out an amp if if they could dial in a good sound started talking about pulling out a soldering iron... they just move on.

I mean more power to you if you want and do custom IR blends/change motor drive/impedance curves etc etc but don’t paint a huge chunk of guitar players all wanting this.

And I have multiple fractal products, two kempers, a QC and recently picked up a line 6 helix rack because of being tired of using the axefx iii UI for a guitar synth project. They all have their pros and cons.
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Your reasoning somewhat escapes me.

You like profiling because you can presumably get a profile of whatever amp you want (provided you can locate or produce the profile) and not be dependent on the manufacturer for support. Yet in this post and a previous one you mention that maybe the profile won't respond exactly like the amp and that's "fine" (I guess to be close enough and in the neighborhood).

I also note you ignore the comment that the user will need direct access to the amp get the profile at their desired settings otherwise you are taking whatever somebody else produced that sounds close enough.

The virtual amp models respond just like the amp though and even if an amp isn't supported you can find a solution to get you close and should be fine and in the neighborhood of whatever you want.

Sounds like you're just a fan of profiling which is great but I'll take a great modeler any day.
 
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fcs101 said:
Your reasoning somewhat escapes me.

You like profiling because you can presumably get a profile of whatever amp you want (provided you can locate or produce the profile) and not be dependent on the manufacturer for support. Yet in this post and a previous one you mention that maybe the profile won't respond exactly like the amp and that's "fine" (I guess to be close enough and in the neighborhood).

I also note you ignore the comment that the user will need direct access to the amp get the profile at their desired settings otherwise you are taking whatever somebody else produced that sounds close enough.

The virtual amp models respond just like the amp though and even if an amp isn't supported you can find a solution to get
Sounds like you're just a fan of profiling which is great but I'll take a great modeler any day.
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I have a few amps, I make profiles of the settings I like. I don’t need to tweak them because I picked the sounds I like. If that particular model has been liquid profiled according to Kemper they should respond the same (I take nothing at face value unless is test it myself because I’ve heard this plenty of times from various manufacturers and found it wasn’t always the case) if it hasn’t been liquid profiled it’s not like the kemper eq is horrible.


Have you tried all the virtual amp models to
The real thing and confirm they are the same? If they all are identical why have there been changes on some of the FW
updates?

Also it’s strange you ignore in some cases you might be able to profile an amp that doesn’t exist on a modeller but yet you can find a solution with the modeller.... nice.

And I have multiple fractal products, two kempers, a QC and recently picked up a line 6 helix rack.

4 fractal modellers , two profilers , a hybrid modeller and another modeller yet I’m just a fan of profiling?
 
You're talking in circles and totally ignoring the requirement to have the profiled amp on hand despite indicating that's what you personally do (hypocrite?):

axl-fx said:
I have a few amps, I make profiles of the settings I like. I don’t need to tweak them because I picked the sounds I like.
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Oh and you're not so sure the liquid profiles are 100% accurate but so what, it's okay because it's a profile and you're in favor of profiling (emphasis is mine):

axl-fx said:
If that particular model has been liquid profiled according to Kemper they should respond the same (I take nothing at face value unless is test it myself because I’ve heard this plenty of times from various manufacturers and found it wasn’t always the case) if it hasn’t been liquid profiled it’s not like the kemper eq is horrible.
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But yet you expect a fan of modeling to personally verify all models are accurate (what a load of bollocks). I would respond that there are enough critics (not just of FAS but of any manufacturer) to keep everyone honest. Any discrepancies would be an instant YT review video (AB of amp vs model):
axl-fx said:
Have you tried all the virtual amp models to
The real thing and confirm they are the same?
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Apparently you can't conceive of the need to innovate:
axl-fx said:
If they all are identical why have there been changes on some of the FW
updates?
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This one just kills me. You're okay eq'ing a subpar profile but yet can't accept a modeling solution.
axl-fx said:
Also it’s strange you ignore in some cases you might be able to profile an amp that doesn’t exist on a modeller but yet you can find a solution with the modeller.... nice.
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You either have tunnel vision or are just a troll. Like I said previously, it's fine to be a fan of profiling. That's not a diss. Just don't expect to be well received on a message board for the world's premier modeler.
 
fcs101 said:
You're talking in circles and totally ignoring the requirement to have the profiled amp on hand despite indicating that's what you personally do (hypocrite?):
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You seem to be ignoring that people can download/buy profiles if they choose as well. I’ve used some myself and they are fantastic.

No one pays for presets though or uses artists patches on modellers though right?
That could never work for a different player..
Shame if you take any profile on kemper it has only ever slightly changed the sound maybe once from FW 1 to the current now...... sure is nice not to have to tweak them after updates.

fcs101 said:
Oh and you're not so sure the liquid profiles are 100% accurate but so what, it's okay because it's a profile and you're in favor of profiling (emphasis is mine):
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Because I didn’t test it myself and by saying that it doesn’t mean they don’t match it’s just an unbiased statement.


“The virtual amp models respond just like the amp though”
You on the other hand seem confident, so that’s either from personal experience or a statement you have read somewhere.

fcs101 said:
But yet you expect a fan of modeling to personally verify all models are accurate (what a load of bollocks). I would respond that there are enough critics (not just of FAS but of any manufacturer) to keep everyone honest. Any discrepancies would be an instant YT review video (AB of amp vs model):
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Again your words
The virtual amp models respond just like the amp though

Imagine if I took fenders word on their TMP 5150 model, I’m just not biased and looking at my collection of gear that’s pretty evident lol. I’ll leave it at that for my past experience with “the knobs react the same” type statements and how things compared with the real amp.

fcs101 said:
Apparently you can't conceive of the need to innovate:

This one just kills me. You're okay eq'ing a subpar profile but yet can't accept a modeling solution.
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What makes it subpar? I was pointing out if you did either use liquid or the existing eq the former is meant to replicate the original, the second isn’t a bad eq by any means.

Does using a tone match block means the original preset is sub par then?




fcs101 said:
You either have tunnel vision or are just a troll. Like I said previously, it's fine to be a fan of profiling. That's not a diss. Just don't expect to be well received on a message board for the world's premier modeler.
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That’s the vibe I’m getting too.
Im just glad I can enjoy a variety of gear.
 
axl-fx said:
That’s the vibe I’m getting too.
Im just glad I can enjoy a variety of gear.
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But for all your words you just can't admit that a profile is by nature more limiting...

As for your questioning the need/ability to compare every model to the real amp, that is just not practical. It's sort of a hodgepodge of personal experience and others' input. Once you are on the board for awhile you receive input from actual amp owners/users who can vouch for some particular model which you may never actually play. That demand is no different than your having to personally verify any profile you purchased. How is that going to happen?!?

Once again, you've failed to add anything to the conversation of profile vs model. Everything as already been stated multiple times on various threads. You're a profiler and that's great for you.

And I'm glad you also get the feeling you may be a troll. Keep pushing that profile button!
 
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The IR 200 is stealing the show for an amp in a box plus reverb and major EQ. You are not going to get a smaller form factor than an FM3. The only thing you would be getting is just a lower price if Fractal did this. You would be losing all the things that made Fractal great to begin with.
The IR 200 is a stripped down GT 1000. It is cheap and you would have to add thousands to a pedalboard to have all the effects the GT 1000 has.

If you are a kid with no money, I do get it. At least you can afford an amp and make some noise.

I actually could do a show in a crunch with the IR 200 and a delay pedal for a small gig if needed. I have a Tone X for pedalboard gigs and can have any amp live with that. Is good as it sounds, I hate it. It has cheap click switches and Leveling is buried and a pain to level. With a midi controller, why not use the FM 9. You have all these influencers on YouTube pushing stuff that is not necessary. They are not giving honest reviews because they are paid. Every new thing that comes out, they are pushing it, good or not.

It is good to have people demo products. It is not good when they overhype it. Musicians are gear whores.
I know, I am one of them. I hate buying stuff and then turn around and sell it because I don't like it.
I have lost hundreds buying and selling.

To me Fractal's best unit is the FM9 with the FC12 Controller. I would love to have the power of the Axe 3. This was the best buy I ever made. The Axe 3 is better for recording, but the FM9 is better live. It just needs the power of the Axe 3.
 
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