I know this is a touchy subject but...

J

james...

Experienced
I'm sorry, but some of the effects are just too transparent sometimes. I'm fully aware that this is because they are programmed for "optimum tonality" and I'm cool with that. I wouldn't have bought the unit if I didn't want that sound. But sometimes I just want an effect to sound dirty and colored.

I'm especially talking about the chorus and mod sounds here. The delay gets a break because the drive and cut parameters have (mostly) remedied this problem for me. But I just can't get the chorus and mod effects to sound "analog and old school".

I've come to the conclusion that I need to go ahead and put a 2 space shelf in my rack for pedals. It seems there is no other way.

Comments? Insults? :(
 
i agree... said it before... i have a drawer and a few pedals in there, namely the bbpreamp and evh phase 90. I cant make the axe sound like them, so there they are. The axe cant be everything to everyone, so it's a part of the equasion.
 
Different stokes. I'm a big chorus/flange lover. I really like the Ultras Chorus and flanger - I have quite a few. That being said, I have an A/DA Flanger, and EVH Flanger, phase 90 handwired RI, foxrox octron, and MXR classic 108 fuzz in my rack. I like both analog and digital chorus for different things. I'm not using my choruses on the axe-fx now, because I've been able to get the tones I want out of the Axe-fx for my current needs.

I was able to get pretty darn close to the boss dimension C (all the modes), a couple of other people got a nice tri-chorus emulation going w/ the Ultra quad-chorus. 2 things to get things sounding more vintage. Limit the highs and add a touch of tape drive.

That being said, if you are really looking for a particular flavor, might as well just get that. The EVH falnger is a good example for me. I could probably dial that in on the Axe-fx and get close, but with it all I have to do is press the EVH button and instant unchained flange.

The Axe-fx doesn't have to be in end all be all. I never expected it to be. I think you are not going to find this as touchy of a subject as you think :D
 
Makes me think you're not running the way you want.

-Is your mix at 100%?
-Where do you have it in the chain?
-What have you tried?

Not enough information. Just 'ooh, I don't like it'. It's not a simple pedal you put in there and go 'DONE!'.
 
I'm using a combination of both. Got a CE-2 and MIJ Arion Chorus in my rack for the 'dirty' analog stuff and use the Axe's for the big wide open transparent sound. I think it's a good thing that the Axe's mod stuff is so hi-end sounding. That's what everyone went for in the 80s but couldn't get (with that technology). I don't see a problem in using other units along with my Ultra...

I'm actually even about to incorporate an 80's SPX90 into my rack for the original 'session player chorus sounds' and might even start looking for a 1210. My Ultra can't 100% do those, but they can't do what my Ultra can ;) . Best of both worlds !
 
javajunkie said:
I was able to get pretty darn close to the boss dimension C (all the modes), a couple of other people got a nice tri-chorus emulation going w/ the Ultra quad-chorus. 2 things to get things sounding more vintage. Limit the highs and add a touch of tape drive.
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+1

The FX themselves might be very clean sounding, but if you pair them with other blocks you can start to ugly them up a bit.
 
You know, I've got exactly the opposite take on the whole analog stompbox syndrome. I've had a few over the years, including a CryBaby, Phase 90, a Mu-Tron II, and an ADA flanger. I never could get decent quality sounds out of any of those things. They were noisy, killed dynamics, loaded my guitars' pickups, and muffled the sound (particularly the ADA). I had no choice but to use them to create those sounds, however. Improving on that in live performance would only have been possible if you had studio-quality (read $$$$) line-level gear in the PA rack and a sound man competent enough to use those effects exactly as you wanted. In my experience, if an effect is too clean, there's always a way to screw it up so it sounds crappy. OTOH, there's no way to go in the opposite direction.

It is such a joy to be able to place effects of the very best sonic quality in the exact place in the signal chain I want them, yet still maintain total control over the whole rig, that I could not imagine ever using one of those wall-wart-powered, tone-sucking POS boxes ever again.

Just another POV....
 
If you want that sound, you can get it. If you want to exactly clone a specific pedal's sound, you might not have as much luck, you're probably better off using that pedal. Two things off the top of my head: stick a tape drive block in front of or after the amp and tweak the drive and tone to taste. Also, a lot of those pedals "analog" sound comes from a mid hump. You could roll down the bass and treble (particularly treble) on the chorus block, or you could put an EQ before or after it with a slight hump around, say, 500 or 800 Hz. It's not going to clone any pedal's sound exactly but it will probably get you in the ballpark.

For me though, I very rarely want that sound. But I can understand why somebody would.
 
Yeah i have a hard time getting what i want out of the choruses. I have gotten some relief by adding a very light Rotary.
Seems lately on those patches I have been blending in my VG99 chorus patch if I want that deep Electric Mistress type vibe.
So whatever it takes to get there.... You would think with all the options in there (abundant on Ultra) i could find it.
Elusive for me.... My old L6 AX2 has got the coolest wide chorus in it. I'll keep at it though because the Ultra has solved so many other tone problems for me.


www.duaneramelot.com
 
Jay is spot on: you can always degrade the sound but the converse is usually not possible.

My advice: put the block in parallel with an EQ before or after and possible a drive block too.
 
Some of the sounds I've posted on AxeChange are all about approaching the low(er)fi sound of your pedals. I think the unit can replace all of the mod effects you're describing. The main area I find I still want external gear in is truly flavorful fuzz (new params are *great*, but a slightly broken Superfuzz or fresh Afro is still another planet!).

I recognize that not everyone has the interest in how to "tweak" to match certain tones but for me it's a passion.

I've offered to others -- and extend to you -- an open channel: forum, email, phone, or face-to-face -- if you want to try to use the Axe-FX and get closer to what your ears dream about.

:)
 
haha I might take you up on that phone call Matman. Watch out! :p

And everybody else, thanks. I've got some cool ideas to try tomorrow.
 
I get that tweaking is a passion for some people, and I think the Axe-FX is perfect for those types.

Even though I am an engineer by day, when it comes time to playing guitar I prefer to play and not tweak. For many of the effects, such as the amp modeling, I don't spent time delving into the advanced parameters too much because frankly I don't think its necessary. I feel like I can get great tones from the default settings of most of the amp blocks.

For the effects, I think this presents more of a challenge. I was looking over the Line6 M13 manual yesterday and browsing over the description of each effect I could see how it would be possible to recreate almost all of them in the Axe....but frankly its not that fun for me to sit down and screw around until I've found the settings.

So there are times I wish that each effect block had pre-configured settings (kind of like global amps). The problem is sometimes you need multiple blocks to make up an effect...so I guess I'm thinking something like a "combinator" mode with global combinations would be cool.

I think they are just two different approaches and both are equally legitimate depending upon your personal preference.
 
I love experimenting and tweaking. However, if I know specifically what I'm looking for and a pedal does it in 5 seconds, why reinvent the wheel. More of an issue of time management. Eventually, I get around to trying to emulate this or that, but sometimes it just makes more sense to use the real deal. These are all just tools and sometimes a specific pedal is just the right one for the job. Personally I love the A/DA flanger (as more of a chorus), noise and all.
 
James, no insults from me. ;)

I created a patch yesterday so I could test the Axe in my WDW rig. I put a Chorus and Delay in the preset like this...

RTN -> CHO -> DLY -> FXL -> SND

This chaing goes out Out2 L and R to my wet amp/cab. I felt I could barely hear the Chorus with the default settings. I only played with the rate and depth and could hear the change but only a little. Come to think of it, I'm not sure where the Mix was though (in all fairness).

The dry chain was just OD -> PHS -> AMP -> OUT.
 
AdamCook said:
So there are times I wish that each effect block had pre-configured settings (kind of like global amps).
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Global amps are not "preconfigured," they are user-configured.

This is where the forum, the Wiki, and Axechange come in. My suggestion is to look for settings that others have shared that will enable you to duplicate the desired effects. If you can't find what you want, place a request in the "Share and Request Patches" forum.

I think they are just two different approaches and both are equally legitimate depending upon your personal preference.
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While both approaches are equally legitimate, the end user cannot alter the approach that was taken in the design of a specific processor. It has been made very clear in the Axe-Fx documentation which approach was taken in its design.
 
CudBucket said:
James, no insults from me. ;)

I created a patch yesterday so I could test the Axe in my WDW rig. I put a Chorus and Delay in the preset like this...

RTN -> CHO -> DLY -> FXL -> SND

This chaing goes out Out2 L and R to my wet amp/cab. I felt I could barely hear the Chorus with the default settings.
Click to expand...
Well, that's because the "wet" signal chain needs the "mix" parameter in all effects set to 100%.

Come to think of it, I'm not sure where the Mix was though (in all fairness).
Click to expand...
And that's the whole enchilada.
 
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