Help with a EQ curve for the QSC K12

[Rivertownrocker]

Hi All

I've been using a simple PEQ block with high and low blocking seen in my picture but am wondering has any one else come up with a better curve? I use a single coil Strat

Still hoping to make these Q12's capable of sounding great as a FRFR solution and not ditching them for the freeman or matrix.

Thanks

 

[brokenvail]

I always did My hi, low cutting in the cab block. I did around 120 low and between 6 and 7k hi. Also make sure if you are using it on the floor as a edge town on the sub ext switch it helps with keeping the bass from getting too out of hand

 

[RoshRoslin]

I low cut at 100 and hi cut a 7000 in the cab block.

I also use the ext sub dsp switch in the back and 'flat'

 

[Rivertownrocker]

I always did My hi, low cutting in the cab block. I did around 120 low and between 6 and 7k hi. Also make sure if you are using it on the floor as a edge town on the sub ext switch it helps with keeping the bass from getting too out of hand

Yes thats exactly my set up but still feel somethings off I have a blues jr next to it and im setting up the ax the same and trying to EQ the QSC as I play both the axe and blues jr and cant find that sweet spot freq?

 

[Rain]

Can someone Post a Screen shot, using AXE Edit, of the Low Cuts and High Cuts in the Cab Block ?

 

[scorch]

I have K12's and I put a 4" square of gaffers tape, double thick, over the tweeter. Helps cut the 'glare' of the tweeter aimed right at you. Plenty of highs get around the tape.

The lows just have to be cut somewhere. Either in the amp eq or an eq block. I cut all amps at 100 hz and further roll off lows in the amp eq. -4 db in the bass and roll off the treble gradually and more subtly.

I use K12's and CLR's together and it sounds great.

 

[dpeterson]

Experiment with how it's positioned, I prefer mine vertical on the floor. Run it in flat, normal mode.

 

[papaflann]

I'd do your cuts in the cab block pretty aggressively. May want to take the Hicut to around 6500? For some that is too much, but I think it works. Also instead of using the PEQ block to make your cuts, try just boosting around 770 or 800 about 4db. So the curve would be flat except for that spike in that range. That's been a trick other guys have used (Yek, Tyler Grund). Again, this would be the last block in your grid. Cheers.

 

[brokenvail]

I always did My hi, low cutting in the cab block. I did around 120 low and between 6 and 7k hi. Also make sure if you are using it on the floor as a edge town on the sub ext switch it helps with keeping the bass from getting too out of hand

IR makes a huge difference bid the it isn't right you can't always fit it some where else

 

[RoshRoslin]

Yes thats exactly my set up but still feel somethings off I have a blues jr next to it and im setting up the ax the same and trying to EQ the QSC as I play both the axe and blues jr and cant find that sweet spot freq?

This has been addressed many times and is a very common misconception about the AxeFx.

The AxeFx running into a powered FRFR speaker, powered wedge, studio monitors, etc will NOT sound like an amp in the room.

Remember. The IR you are using in your preset is the guitar tone of a speaker with a microphone on it. This will NOT sound the same as plugging into a guitar amp. The guitar tone reproduced is what a guitar tone on a record sounds like or your amp with a microphone up against the speaker and amplified through a FRFR speaker.

Listen and YouTube "isolated guitar tracks" to hear what guitar actually sounds like when used on a record. That's also the same tone you'll hear live.

 

[pauly]

G'day Rocker,

Why don't you try another approach?
(Just my opinion here - so if you think I'm wrong - Fine) The key to effectively utilising the AxeFX is understanding that the more neutral the speaker(s) used, the more accurate it's modelling capabilities will be. That's why the thing sounds so good through expensive studio monitors - because they sound how they should. If you are creating eq curves using a guitar and one amp block, you're EQing to mach that specific setup sound good, rather than EQing to make the monitoring accurate.

Instead, try playing a few tracks that you know really well (and are recorded really well) from your PC through the AXE FX - Create an EQ curve that makes them sound as accurate (natural) as possible and save the curve.

Use _that_ curve globally when using those speakers, and you will be able to enjoy all the different amp models and effects how they are supposed to be enjoyed. Warning - this may be significantly different to what you are used to so your patches may need some overhaul. It is however a good way to ensure you aren't clouding your pallette.

Thanks
Pauly.

Hi All

I've been using a simple PEQ block with high and low blocking seen in my picture but am wondering has any one else come up with a better curve? I use a single coil Strat

Still hoping to make these Q12's capable of sounding great as a FRFR solution and not ditching them for the freeman or matrix.

Thanks

 

[Rivertownrocker]

G'day Rocker,

Why don't you try another approach?
(Just my opinion here - so if you think I'm wrong - Fine) The key to effectively utilising the AxeFX is understanding that the more neutral the speaker(s) used, the more accurate it's modelling capabilities will be. That's why the thing sounds so good through expensive studio monitors - because they sound how they should. If you are creating eq curves using a guitar and one amp block, you're EQing to mach that specific setup sound good, rather than EQing to make the monitoring accurate.

Instead, try playing a few tracks that you know really well (and are recorded really well) from your PC through the AXE FX - Create an EQ curve that makes them sound as accurate (natural) as possible and save the curve.

Use _that_ curve globally when using those speakers, and you will be able to enjoy all the different amp models and effects how they are supposed to be enjoyed. Warning - this may be significantly different to what you are used to so your patches may need some overhaul. It is however a good way to ensure you aren't clouding your pallette.

Thanks
Pauly.

You are right on the Mark of what I have been seeking. Which is an EQ block already set up to delete the unwanted frequencies that a FRFR speaker can reproduce and a guitarist does not want to hear? That can be applied to all presets.

I have applied tape to my QSC' k12s I have laid them in different positions and have always applied a low high pass PEQ before amp block, some one said try after Cab block and now that is what I do.

That said I want to feel that after i get these to sound good I wont be playing on other monitors at a gig on the weekend and they are way off.

On the forum I just keep reading how FRFR are producing un wanted frequencies and guitarist are not used to hearing them?

So here goes after a high low pass what are theses Freq's and why is there no PEQ block that has these already dialed out so us FRFR guys can apply and rest assured when we run through a PA it sounds more guitar like?

 

[Rivertownrocker]

This has been addressed many times and is a very common misconception about the AxeFx.

The AxeFx running into a powered FRFR speaker, powered wedge, studio monitors, etc will NOT sound like an amp in the room.

Remember. The IR you are using in your preset is the guitar tone of a speaker with a microphone on it. This will NOT sound the same as plugging into a guitar amp. The guitar tone reproduced is what a guitar tone on a record sounds like or your amp with a microphone up against the speaker and amplified through a FRFR speaker.

Listen and YouTube "isolated guitar tracks" to hear what guitar actually sounds like when used on a record. That's also the same tone you'll hear live.

Thanks I understand that no amp in the room is possible with the axe but my band has played for twenty year in 100 person rooms and the only thing to ever come out of a PA main (FRFR) was the vocals. We always get complements on the sound and in most cases we have lined up the mains along with amps and drums behind us with no monitors need.

I still believe I can get the QSC K12 pleasing enough that I can use it as the only thing my guitar is coming through at a club but it sure is taking long and I'm not to good at finding crapy EQ frequencies and dialing them out.

 

[RoshRoslin]

Thanks I understand that no amp in the room is possible with the axe but my band has played for twenty year in 100 person rooms and the only thing to ever come out of a PA main (FRFR) was the vocals. We always get complements on the sound and in most cases we have lined up the mains along with amps and drums behind us with no monitors need.

I still believe I can get the QSC K12 pleasing enough that I can use it as the only thing my guitar is coming through at a club but it sure is taking long and I'm not to good at finding crapy EQ frequencies and dialing them out.

I believe you're missing my point. And the point I was trying to address. So let me take another attempt at this.

The AxeFx duplicates a **recorded** guitar tone when you're using a FRFR speaker such as the Qsc. You're attempting to recreate the **amp in the room** sound by comparing the Qsc speaker vs your Blues Jr.

This is an apples to oranges comparison and you're missing the crucial step to understanding this.

Take your blues Jr. Put it in an adjacent, soundproof room, stick a microphone up the the speaker and then cable that back to the Qsc speaker and then you can begin to have a comparison in sound.

This is what the AxeFx is doing, recreating a studio quality guitar tone of an amplifier, miked up, through a nice microphone preamp and then amplified through studio monitors.

Bring your blues Jr to any recording studio and sit in the control room and listen to your guitar tone as your amp sits in the adjacent room and I guarantee it will "sound different" than what you're hearing when you're just plugging your guitar into the amp itself.

Again, your perception of how the amp sounds and what a microphone is actually picking up will be vastly different and that's what the AxeFx will recreate.

Here's an easy way to adjust your perception: plug your guitar into your blues Jr and stick your ear up the speaker. Sounds different than sitting next to the amp right? That's what a microphone is picking up.

 

[REDD]

I just got Friedman asm-12's but before I got them I was running QSC K12's and with them on speaker stands and set flat I got some pretty good tones out of them not cutting anything and using my own IR's. They did have a little harshness in the highs but I would just back down the high or presence controlls and they worked fine. I wouldn't worry too much, just set them where they sound good and play.

 

[Rex]

FRFR, in general, improves the audience's experience compared to a guitar cab. The frequency response and volume are more uniform (and more controllable) across a wider portion of the audience.

The guitarist listens to his tone by turning his back to loudspeakers that are aimed at his legs. He hears a sound that has less high-frequency content and stronger room reflections than what the audience hears, because they're directly facing the speakers.

Listen to recorded music while you're facing your stereo speakers/studio monitors/whatever. Now turn around so you're facing away from the speakers. Listen to how much high end is lost. Now climb four feet up a ladder, and hear how much more high end is lost. That difference is even bigger with traditional cabs; they have a shrill "cone of death" when you're looking straight down the barrel. FRFR gives you a more even frequency response across more seats.

If you dial in your tone with your K12's at gig volume and with a full mix behind you—and use an IR that works well in that situation (use your ears)—life will be good.


Also, a slight low-Q boost around 800 Hz, as mentioned by others, won't hurt.

 

[TieDyedDevil]

My music-room PA uses a pair of K10s and a Ksub. I have a 31-band EQ that's set as the approximate inverse of K10's published frequency response curve, adjusted by ear in the lower frequencies (along with judicious setting of the Ksub volume) to fit the room.

 

[GotMetalBoy]

I know the preset you're showing doesn't have any FX but If you decide to add some like delay or reverb, try putting them before the cab block. I actually put my cab block at the very end of the grid.

The first time I played thru FRFR was the first time I recorded direct. I noticed a lot of FX sounded hi-fi or hyped compared to my traditional guitar setup. Then I realized in a traditional guitar setup, the last device is the speaker cab. I moved the cab block to the end of the grid and then my tone sounded more familiar.

You could also try doing a tone match of your real amp using a reference microphone that is used for spectrum analyzers.

I'm not sure if it's already available in the Axe-Fx II but if not, FAS should release a cab pack called Amps In The Room that sound like cabs without a mic, so noobs can feel more comfortable with the Axe-Fx II and then transition to what a recorded guitar is supposed to sound like.

Kind of how a lot of noob bedroom players remove all mids but then get lost in the mix when playing with a band. I remember the first time I tried to record an amp with a mic, I thought it sounded horrible because I had the classic V EQ, so the treble was ear piercing and the bass from the proximity effect was flub.