FM3 USB Latency Update

YamenFahham

YamenFahham

Member
I bought my new FM3 a few days ago and was surprised by the USB recording latency issue, especially considering this is a very expensive pro-grade gear, and this shouldn’t be happening. The issue was fixed in 2022 for both the Axe-Fx III and the FM9, but surprisingly, not for the FM3! I’m aware of the workaround of offsetting the samples in my DAW, but I wouldn’t expect to have to do this after paying such a high price—aside from being really inconvenient, as I have to adjust it every time I change my buffer size. I’m wondering why this still hasn’t been fixed in the FM3 after 4 years of being reported. Are there any updates on this?
 
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I find this issue frustrating in my work flow as well, but I'm able to measure and correct it quickly. I don't really ever have to change it unless something changes in my setup (like I just built this new PC). Even if I can functionally work around it, I do wonder why it can't be fixed.
 
DoctorJones said:
I find this issue frustrating in my work flow as well, but I'm able to measure and correct it quickly. I don't really ever have to change it unless something changes in my setup (like I just built this new PC). Even if I can functionally work around it, I do wonder why it can't be fixed.
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For me I have to change my buffer size since I do mixing as well. I need the lower buffer size for tracking midi instruments and the higher buffer size for mixing.
I hope @FractalAudio or @amandio can update us on this.
 
So, what exactly is the latency issue? Not saying it doesn’t exist, just wondering how it’s happening. I use Mixcraft 10, the fm3 as an interface, and record one mono channel for guitar and on mono channel for DI. I’ve never seen a latency or a delay issue. 🤷🏻‍♂️
 
I will quote the problem from the original thread by @GlennO: "There is an inevitable latency that comes with computer audio. This latency will be present when you record your guitar into your DAW. However, all DAWs are smart enough to deal with this and apply a latency compensation so your guitar audio is aligned properly with tracks you are listening to, for example drums, while recording. Unfortunately, the amount of compensation that is applied when recording an Axe-FX is incorrect. The result is your recorded guitar audio will be delayed in relation to other tracks in your project. This lag is substantial, often in the 10-20 millisecond range (far greater than the internal processing latency). That is enough of a lag to make any recording sound sloppy. This problem does not occur with other audio interfaces, only the Axe-FX."
 
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YamenFahham said:
I will quote the problem from the original thread: "There is an inevitable latency that comes with computer audio. This latency will be present when you record your guitar into your DAW. However, all DAWs are smart enough to deal with this and apply a latency compensation so your guitar audio is aligned properly with tracks you are listening to, for example drums, while recording. Unfortunately, the amount of compensation that is applied when recording an Axe-FX is incorrect. The result is your recorded guitar audio will be delayed in relation to other tracks in your project. This lag is substantial, often in the 10-20 millisecond range (far greater than the internal processing latency). That is enough of a lag to make any recording sound sloppy. This problem does not occur with other audio interfaces, only the Axe-FX."
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Did you mean only with the FM3 ?
 
Justinl21 said:
I see. But, it’s not a guaranteed thing that will happen to everyone?
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Yes, it's a universal consequence of the way the FM3 usb audio interface works.

Note that there is a global I/O setting for the usb buffer size that you can turn down to the minimum value to get the lag a bit under 10 msec. (Note this is not the buffer size setting in your DAW. That setting is unrelated to this issue). Most people would consider that to still be a large lag, so the manual compensation workaround is probably a good idea for most FM3 users who are recording via usb.

Other workarounds include using a separate audio interface, but that leads to other issues, including making re-amping more complicated and, obviously, requiring another piece of gear.

I will mention that it isn't quite true that FAS hasn't done anything about this. The factory default value for the buffer size was turned down a while back. Before that, the lag people were getting when plugging in their new FM3 and recording was enormous. Now it's less, but still quite large compared to other modelers and audio interfaces.

In any case, as I've said before, IMHO the biggest issue here is the way a new FM3 user will be left in the dark about this. They will just notice that their recordings don't sound right, and, unless they hunt for obscure posts deep in this forum, won't learn about the problem or the existence of effective workarounds.
 
Justinl21 said:
it’s not a guaranteed thing that will happen to everyone?
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You wouldn't notice it if you have your buffer size is low. You would start noticing it with higher buffer sizes or even with low buffer sizes when you are reamping and blending the reamped signal with the original one where you start hearing phasing.
 
duzie said:
Did you mean only with the FM3 ?
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He was quoting me, from a post several years ago, prior to the problem being fixed on the Axe-FX. (and yes, I was referring to the fact that modelers and audio interfaces from other companies don't have this problem). The problem has since been fixed on the Axe-FX and FM9, but remains on the FM3. (Although, strictly speaking, even though the symptoms are the same, the underlying problem is somewhat different on the FM3 than it was on the Axe-FX).
 
If you have an existing interface I would recommend running via XLR. I did a back to back comparison between USB recording and XLR --> 1/4 into the interface and there was 0 discernable difference through either my monitors or phones.

I use the last set of 1/4" line inputs on our interface. Sounds great, no latency, no fiddling with usb devices in the DAW.
 
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GlennO said:
He was quoting me, from a post several years ago, prior to the problem being fixed on the Axe-FX. (and yes, I was referring to the fact that modelers and audio interfaces from other companies don't have this problem). The problem has since been fixed on the Axe-FX and FM9, but remains on the FM3. (Although, strictly speaking, even though the symptoms are the same, the underlying problem is somewhat different on the FM3 than it was on the Axe-FX).
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Oops lol
Thanks for pointing that out 👍
 
Greg Ferguson said:
Would using SPDIF between the FM3 and the computer reduce the lag? It'd sidestep the USB conversion.
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Using an audio interface would avoid the problem. Using an audio interface introduces its own issues though, for example making re-amping more difficult. Using manual offset compensation in the DAW is probably a better workaround to this problem. In other words, there are situations where it's helpful to use an audio interface with an FM3, but working around this latency compensation problem isn't one of them.
 
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