Floyd Post Broke through Schecter! / NGD

Much appreciated everyone. Last night I was figuring out the ranges of tones this thing has through different types of amps, and I was really happy with what it can do.

Although the wiring diagram I had been sent from the company years ago showed a treble bleed, I could hear last night that there isn't one. No big deal; I have the PMT V-Treb plus a load of resistors and caps if I want to make one.

I found myself really getting some great tones with this thing. @Sashman, the presets I'm creating are just four blocks: in, amp, cab, out. The only remotely interesting thing I'm doing, and I'm not sure it's remotely interesting, is taking two mics on the same DynaCab, the Dynamic 1 (SM57) in slot 1 and the Condenser (Soyuz) in slot 2, going to the Align tab on the front panel (for greater fine tuning than the large zoom of Axe-Edit), setting slot 2 to be further back until the pick attack appears to "smear," if you will, to a more midrangey sound, then I move both mics about halfway between cone and cap, adjusting the level of slot 2 between about -3 (less lows, more thick, juicy mids) to -9dB (mid scoop), where I tweak the mic alignment, position, mic 2 level, and amp controls until I get a soft but present attack with all the girth I want without being overbearing.

Sometimes I go crazy with tweaking tone and I realize I'm trying to be an audio engineer instead of a player, so when I realize this I'll go to a YouTube playlist I've created called Ideal Tones, where I collect examples of someone demoing an amp completely dry with a mic'ed sound I think is great, and I'll just tweak my tone until I'm close.

This guitar is so deep in tone while still having presence, it almost has a mid scoop. This is very helpful for versatility, because I can exploit the depth of low end by adding girth at the front end of the amp without a pedal, plus I have neck parallel in addition to bridge inner coil / neck outer coil prewired from the factory if I want brighter and lighter tones, and I can smear the high end with mic alignment as I normally do and coax mid forward Les Paul style smokiness that way.

I found that riding the volume and tone knobs is a great experience with the factory configuration, which is interesting to me, since they use a linear pot for each. Maybe this is more useful for master volume and tone setups, keeping more of the useable rollbacks in a different range of the knobs than log (audio) pots. Since I rewired the first one so soon after I got it, and I always use audio taper for volume and tone, then went through many sets of pickups, I didn't even remember how riding the pots on the original felt!
 
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I found myself really getting some great tones with this thing. @Sashman, the presets I'm creating are just four blocks: in, amp, cab, out. The only remotely interesting thing I'm doing, and I'm not sure it's remotely interesting, is taking two mics on the same DynaCab, the Dynamic 1 (SM57) in slot 1 and the Condenser (Soyuz) in slot 2, going to the Align tab on the front panel (for greater fine tuning than the large zoom of Axe-Edit), setting slot 2 to be further back until the pick attack appears to "smear," if you will, to a more midrangey sound, then I move both mics about halfway between cone and cap, adjusting the level of slot 2 between about -3 (less lows, more thick, juicy mids) to -9dB (mid scoop), where I tweak the mic alignment, position, mic 2 level, and amp controls until I get a soft but present attack with all the girth I want without being overbearing.
This is what I love about the DynaCabs. I know some have not found them useful and I can sort of understand why. I find it the easiest way to dial in the tone especially when dealing with a recording situation. I find it the best way to get the guitar to cut right from the start and not having to rely so heavily on mixing EQ. You’re right, it can get a bit distracting from playing. I always liked the engineering aspect of music production so I don’t mind too much.
I found that riding the volume and tone knobs is a great experience with the factory configuration
This is something as I grew as a player has become important. When I was younger the volume and tone pots were full on and didn’t give it any thought. The volume knob was for turning all the way down when I needed to talk to someone. Anyway, I’m very happy to read your experience so far. Also, I just read through the whole thread and I guess a couple days went by and totally missed the section where you informed that Schecter was replacing the guitar. Some good info in there from @Planta Fantasma & @Andy Eagle.

Don’t want to put any pressure on you, but would love to hear a quick clip of the guitar.
 
Don’t want to put any pressure on you, but would love to hear a quick clip of the guitar.

Totally Man! Maybe I'll splice together a few seconds with different styles of tones to give an overview. Next time I play I'll give that a shot. I was working a bit on good cleans last night and ended up on the Wrecker Rocket model, which to me is the best tool to get a humbucker to sound like a soulful single coil! For high gain I found the 5150-II Lead Channel was the ticket for meaty low end but with enough definition. I used the Bassman 2x12 Dynacab with the 57 and 1973 for both the Rocket and 5150-II. Now I just have to set up some in betweens, like the Rocket with higher gain settings, then one of the Plexis. I know the SLP 1959 model has the most low end and the 1970 has the most gain, the 6CA7 has the most badass character for me, but I'll just play around and see what fits best. I need to decide on a good Plexi reference tone to keep myself in line haha; I have several on my YouTube playlist.

About riding the knobs, I've decided to change my approach with this guitar for soooo many years I was obsessed with a single line from a Paul Gilbert interview, where he said that at that point he was using only a single channel on his amp (or a single channel amp, I can't remember) and just rolling back his volume knob for the whole range of tones live. I thought that was a laudible and awesome goal, so I went deep into modding every guitar I had with 50s Les Paul wiring, often having to use two dual concentrics, and I'd use low cap values for a wide range of tones. At one point I had four mini switches going on top of that, with series / parallel / north split / south split available for each pickup. And I did find that the most versatile hum free setup was an HS or HSS pickup configuration with noiseless strat pickups, but still I did miss neck humbucker tones. Ideally ZexCoil Tribuckers would work for me, with their noiseless strat tones switchable to hubucker tones, with their truly unique passive pickups. But anyway...

I would always try to get a single channel on an amp to go between a good clean to a good high gain tone with just the knobs and switches on the guitar. I found the best way was with an OCD or some other good overdrive in front of a Plexi, and spending a lot of time dialing in obsessively (which is appropo, given the name of the pedal I favored most), but still, even in the best circumstances, I would have to compromise on the dirty bridge or the clean neck, and I could never quite get the best of all worlds of tone. This was really silly, since I have a fucking Axe-FX III with an FC 12 sitting right in front of me!

But I still love riding the knobs, and I can still do that, in a different and I think maybe a more helpful way for my goals. If I want a high gain tone, I think it will be no problem to set something that I know will be good and versatile with the guitar knobs, maybe using a pedal to shift the basic frequencies hitting the front end of the amp. Same with the Plexi and Fender tones. I think it's a matter of just kind of planning on a less insane range of tones your looking to sweep between with your knobs, and for me I think I'd use it for more subtle expression.

A great example to me is metal rhythm playing. If I play something slow and gargantuan, maybe I keep the knobs dimed, but if I'm playing intricate thrash, maybe I dial each knob back a bit, to get it more articulate. If I want a great blues rock neck humbucker tone, maybe I use a pedal like the Timmy or especially the Bluesbreaker to cut really well, then I can dial back for sweet and mellow, or use either 50s wiring or a treble bleed for more versatility. Now that I think of it, rather that doing my regular two dual concentric 50s LP wiring schtick, I could even do a master volume and tone as they are right now, but with a push pull or push push to go between 50s wiring and a treble bleed; I could even switch between different treble bleeds. Or I could stop brainstorming mods and just fucking play guitar! But anyway, of course with the FC12 you're basically limitless with what you can do on the fly, but I do love just making the kinds of subtle changes while I'm playing that the guitar knobs allow you.
 
Seems riding vol and tone controls comes with maturity on guitar. Still learning here. Doesn't hurt that we have equipment that allows us to find those sweet spots!

Oh Dude, not at all. Maturity is its own thing. I think whether or not you ride the knobs is a superficial preference for where you like to get your tones. One my favorite guitar performances is Joe Satriani's live version of Memories, from the Dreaming #11 EP. That recording influenced my playing a ton, and he's using his volume knob plenty on that. But it doesn't mean anything. You could set up a pedal to control a first order low pass filter and level going into the amp in the Axe-FX III, and it would be similar, or just set switches to find exact spots you like, or different amp settings for similar results. In my book what makes you a mature guitarist is just plain old musicianship. How you use gear is just a preference, and it doesn't mean any more than being attracted to brunettes, blondes, or redheads.
 
Exactly that. I started with the first ADA Mp1 when it came out, easy set patches up at different levels. Once I seen Andy Timmons in the 90's up close. I learned a little. I perform some Metheny now and that tone control set just right, gets me there. EJ leads, back it off a bit. I only need 2 pickups now. Humbucker bridge, EMG SA on the neck. Its a journey
 
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I'll just start by asking, is the Floyd BR2 nut that comes with the 1500 system in fact a non-standard nut?

The guitar came from the factory in tune with itself, but off from concert pitch, so today I unlocked the nut for the first time in order to set it up in tune. To my surprise, two out of three nut lock screws didn't want to come out at all. The asshole screwing them in at the factory would've had to have forced them in to get the nut to lock. I had to work way way way too hard to remove them, and upon further inspection, the threading inside the nut lock thread holes was stripped toward the bottom! Man, that's something to let go in QC. I owned a Korean made Schecter years ago that had a weird Floyd nut problem too, where it was installed just off center. Anyway, I removed this nut altogether to see about ordering a new one. It turns out it's a BR2; that's what's stamped at the bottom. I could find very little about this BR2 nut online, because I couldn't tell if a standard R2 would fit in its place. Then I found this thread:

https://online-discussion.com/Suhr/viewtopic.php?p=50774

According to this guy, a standard R2 will not fit in its place! So I considered this for a moment. About a month ago my wife and I installed a new ceiling fan, and in the process I learned what a tap and die set is, a tool set that allows you to rethread holes! To me that was an awesome discovery, and exceedingly helpful today. So I went to Ace Hardware and bought this 4MM x .7 plug tap, which is the same threading as the Floyd nut screw thread:

Plug Tap.jpg

I screwed that slowly into the two holes that were stripped at the bottom, and it worked! I was able to get the screws to go in and out without any problems. Had I not known about this tool, I would not have been able to lock the nut.

In the process I finally removed the plastic film (revealing the awesome looking ridged pickguard), put nut sauce on the knife edges of the baseplate as well as the indention on the stud insert posts where the knife edge contacts the posts, and I'll tell you, this guitar is incredible. First of all, the intonation from the factory, from what I can tell from hitting fourths and fifths in adjacent and skipped strings all over, is fantastic. The tuning stability is incredible, from bending, trem diving, and pulling up with the trem. I'm thinking now that my first one may have had worn out springs by the end, because it wasn't as solid as this guitar is now. It's a reminder to me that if I ever find this guitar not quite returning to zero, I should first check the springs.

When I set up the guitar today, it was a piece of cake. I inserted a stack of business cards cut in half to stabilize the trem, set the fine tuners to the halfway point, put on new strings, tuned, stretched, locked the nut, removed the business cards, then unscrewed the spring claw screws until it was in tune just right. Man, so easy. What an experience. It was shockingly as easy as the most stable Floyded guitar I've had, the Washburn Steve Salas with the Floyd Speedloader.

In doing so, I found I must've accidentally moved the Floyd posts up a tad, because the action was now higher. No big deal, I just removed the bridge with the nut still locked, unscrewed the posts by hand to lower the action, and replaced the bridge. I got that action so low, and I found no fret problems. The guitar was nearly playing itself. It was really something else. It actually makes me wonder if World Musical Instruments is using PLEK machines at their factory, and that's why so many guitars these days come with exceptional fretwork.

I just found that playing the guitar today was easier than ever. It was a blast.

I'll post some pictures with the film off soon, with some recorded clips.
 
I'll just start by asking, is the Floyd BR2 nut that comes with the 1500 system in fact a non-standard nut?

The guitar came from the factory in tune with itself, but off from concert pitch, so today I unlocked the nut for the first time in order to set it up in tune. To my surprise, two out of three nut lock screws didn't want to come out at all. The asshole screwing them in at the factory would've had to have forced them in to get the nut to lock. I had to work way way way too hard to remove them, and upon further inspection, the threading inside the nut lock thread holes was stripped toward the bottom! Man, that's something to let go in QC. I owned a Korean made Schecter years ago that had a weird Floyd nut problem too, where it was installed just off center. Anyway, I removed this nut altogether to see about ordering a new one. It turns out it's a BR2; that's what's stamped at the bottom. I could find very little about this BR2 nut online, because I couldn't tell if a standard R2 would fit in its place. Then I found this thread:

https://online-discussion.com/Suhr/viewtopic.php?p=50774

According to this guy, a standard R2 will not fit in its place! So I considered this for a moment. About a month ago my wife and I installed a new ceiling fan, and in the process I learned what a tap and die set is, a tool set that allows you to rethread holes! To me that was an awesome discovery, and exceedingly helpful today. So I went to Ace Hardware and bought this 4MM x .7 plug tap, which is the same threading as the Floyd nut screw thread:

View attachment 136279

I screwed that slowly into the two holes that were stripped at the bottom, and it worked! I was able to get the screws to go in and out without any problems. Had I not known about this tool, I would not have been able to lock the nut.

In the process I finally removed the plastic film (revealing the awesome looking ridged pickguard), put nut sauce on the knife edges of the baseplate as well as the indention on the stud insert posts where the knife edge contacts the posts, and I'll tell you, this guitar is incredible. First of all, the intonation from the factory, from what I can tell from hitting fourths and fifths in adjacent and skipped strings all over, is fantastic. The tuning stability is incredible, from bending, trem diving, and pulling up with the trem. I'm thinking now that my first one may have had worn out springs by the end, because it wasn't as solid as this guitar is now. It's a reminder to me that if I ever find this guitar not quite returning to zero, I should first check the springs.

When I set up the guitar today, it was a piece of cake. I inserted a stack of business cards cut in half to stabilize the trem, set the fine tuners to the halfway point, put on new strings, tuned, stretched, locked the nut, removed the business cards, then unscrewed the spring claw screws until it was in tune just right. Man, so easy. What an experience. It was shockingly as easy as the most stable Floyded guitar I've had, the Washburn Steve Salas with the Floyd Speedloader.

In doing so, I found I must've accidentally moved the Floyd posts up a tad, because the action was now higher. No big deal, I just removed the bridge with the nut still locked, unscrewed the posts by hand to lower the action, and replaced the bridge. I got that action so low, and I found no fret problems. The guitar was nearly playing itself. It was really something else. It actually makes me wonder if World Musical Instruments is using PLEK machines at their factory, and that's why so many guitars these days come with exceptional fretwork.

I just found that playing the guitar today was easier than ever. It was a blast.

I'll post some pictures with the film off soon, with some recorded clips.
Running a tap through is exactly what I was going to suggest. World Music don't have a plek but an old school good piece of wood with a good level works too . Plek really helps if something is not quite perfect then it can compensate automatically. I love what plek can do but a neck that works perfectly without it is probably going to be better in the long run.
 
Oh and the BR2 is supposed to be the same size as the R2 and IME it is within the margins of error that I find in the regular R2. They are both similar quality neither particularly good . The R3 and BR3 have different radiuses but the "B" prefix FRT1000 nuts are mostly fine. Things like the exact machining to smooth out the surfaces can make the mount hole vary minutely in relative to one side position (PITA). The Gotoh is massively harder and I have never seen one fail or have any issues but it is a slightly different mount hole position or I would use it on everything with a floyd. FYI the Gotoh 1996 /1988 nut and the Ibanez Edge/low pro/ pro are the same nut.
 
The guy who sent it to me had the pick guard off to put an EMG Mav 5 in, so I know he seen it before listing. sucks....
Kinda looks like a fresh crack? :p
Couldn't it have happened ("unknowingly") after he installed that or during transport?
 
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Guess what I found on my 2020 Super shredder that arrived today. Not sure if i am sending back. The guy who sent it to me had the pick guard off to put an EMG Mav 5 in, so I know he seen it before listing. sucks....

Did you buy it through a channel with buyer protection, or at least where you can leave a review? Dude, I'm sorry. That's bullshit.
 
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