Dyna-cab, general consensus is that they're "better" than legacy?

I figure it's an "old-school" thing. :)

I like them both. I like that we didn't lose all our old presets because Legacy was suddenly gone and nothing worked and we had to rebuild our Cabs. (Not like that was going to happen because Fractal "does give a damn" unlike Rhett Butler.) I have some presets that sound great using the Legacy and don't want to be bothered changing them… old-school you know. :) And, as an experiment, when we were testing Dyna-Cabs, I rewired a handful of my presets that I wasn't real happy with and found cabs that sounded much better, including the aforementioned one.

It's a nice tool, all shiny and chromed with no dents or rust. I might use it to pound some nails. :)

I'm curious what the shade you threw at Rhett was about. Honestly, I'm just curious. My opinion of him is very mixed (I'm from Atlanta - we know some of the same people and go to the same shops, never met him though).

Definitely like shiny & chromed tools.

But...I'm also probably weird for a fractal user. I only use one preset. I really just want a simple and straightforward rig that I can shove into my in-ears, and the fractal gives me that better than anything else I've tried. Honestly, the only "upgrade" I'm seriously considering is an FM9T (from an FM3) just to kick the real pedals off my board....and for my specific uses that would depend on figuring out how to turn on the tuner and mute only input 1 (not all inputs) via a single footswitch...which doesn't seem possible unless I just haven't figured it out (because I process my non-guitar IEM feed through my FM3 and want to continue doing so).
 
I'm curious what the shade you threw at Rhett was about. Honestly, I'm just curious. My opinion of him is very mixed (I'm from Atlanta - we know some of the same people and go to the same shops, never met him though).
Heh… "Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn."

Fractal "does give a damn."

But...I'm also probably weird for a fractal user. I only use one preset. I really just want a simple and straightforward rig that I can shove into my in-ears, and the fractal gives me that better than anything else I've tried. Honestly, the only "upgrade" I'm seriously considering is an FM9T (from an FM3) just to kick the real pedals off my board....and for my specific uses that would depend on figuring out how to turn on the tuner and mute only input 1 (not all inputs) via a single footswitch...which doesn't seem possible unless I just haven't figured it out (because I process my non-guitar IEM feed through my FM3 and want to continue doing so).
I tend to use a single preset also, and I treat the amps like they're single channel amps, so it's all between me, the guitar, and the amp, just like I do with my tube amps.
 
I won't go on a limb and say they're "better", but for me, they're definitely much easier to use.

I find most regular IRs to be too bassy because most are close mic'd. So adding heavy low cuts was always a necessity for me. With the Dyna-Cabs, I can control the bass just by pulling the mics back. As a bonus, to me it's sounds better controlling the bass this way rather than with heavy low cuts.
 
I tried them out and while I do dig the Dana Cabs, I still use the Legacy cabs. I like to use greenbacks and V30s with 57/121 so that means I need to run 4 cabs. Now if they eventually release Dana with a dynamic/ribbon blend and I could use 2 cabs that would be great but I don't think that will happen.
 
I tried them out and while I do dig the Dana Cabs, I still use the Legacy cabs. I like to use greenbacks and V30s with 57/121 so that means I need to run 4 cabs. Now if they eventually release Dana with a dynamic/ribbon blend and I could use 2 cabs that would be great but I don't think that will happen.
Blending cabs together with various mics is where Cab-Lab helps. You can create a cab, then push it to your modeler. This helps conserve CPU because it’s a single IR, and, for the FM units it’ll allow them the ability to have four cabs, albeit mixed into a single IR.
 
t’s “auto” for those people who don’t know what the curve does, or who don’t want to bother with it. The goal is to get people into the ballpark quickly so they can adjust the sound at their leisure later.
I don't see it nearly the same way - imo (from looking at what's been implemented) the goal is to provide an accurate and automatically applied SIC curve - one that was measured from the actual cab the IRs were shot from, and therefore the most accurate/authentic SIC curve for that cab in terms of how it will react with any given amp model. One can modify the measured curve to something else, or to a different curve entirely via "auto off" if one likes another sound better, but the "auto" function, combined with the measured curves from the actual DC cabs provides the best authenticity, and provides it automatically. Also, the "auto" feature provides the most realistic practical experience since, irl, when a given cab is connected to a given tube amp, one does not typically consider, or need to be aware of SIC curve - the interaction happens automatically, and many seek the resulting magic of certain specific cab combined with a certain specific amp without ever being aware of what a SIC curve even is - the 'auto-SIC" function with authentic measured SIC provides that realistic practical experience.
 
Last edited:
Blending cabs together with various mics is where Cab-Lab helps. You can create a cab, then push it to your modeler. This helps conserve CPU because it’s a single IR, and, for the FM units it’ll allow them the ability to have four cabs, albeit mixed into a single IR.
Ah did not realize that, thank you
 
I switched to DC for all my presets and prefer them now to the legacy and 3rd party IRs I had been using.

I found the process of finding and blending IRs very time consuming and unreliable. I would spend hrs on a mix of IRs and discover I didn’t love it as much a few days later. I got so frustrated with this that I started relying on legacy and 3rd party IR mixes as the base and added other single mic IRs to improve them. I would still spend a lot of time aligning the IRs and not be as happy as I am now.

I think the DC are much more predictable and easy to get a consistent result. My engineer agrees, he loved the interface and marveled at the predictable results and ease of use made possible by the automatic alignment. He fiddled with the alignment a few times, but most of the time he liked the auto alignment and we got great results that translated in the studio and in my home setup.

I also think the DC preserve more dynamics and I’m less tempted to fiddle with the speaker tab parameters, once the best mic position is found…
 
My point is that there are several significant aspects of DC (specific measured ICs, integration with the speaker page, selection efficiency) which are objectively better than legacy - not chocolate vs vanilla (as in: variations of the same) - better.
That's an opinion. I don't necessarily want the auto SIC, so in that scenario (for me) it's not better - it's the same.

I know I've seen many, many posts from you on this topic. I can tell you're a big fan, and I'm not knocking it, but in this case I would say "better" is still opinion based on a given user's preference.
 
This may be a stupid question.....not sure...lol. I wonder if Cab Lab 4 will make it possible to take a Dyna-Cab mix, with four different mics/positions,
and create a regular Legacy IR of that mix that sounds just like the Dyna-Cab? Does that even make sense?
 
That's an opinion. I don't necessarily want the auto SIC, so in that scenario (for me) it's not better - it's the same.

I know I've seen many, many posts from you on this topic. I can tell you're a big fan, and I'm not knocking it, but in this case I would say "better" is still opinion based on a given user's preference.
I'll try not to take "That's an opinion" as a complete dismissal of of everything I've said above including the substantial effort I put into making sure it was balanced, factual, included key material details and points, thoroughly and clearly explained, and not based solely on just my own "liking" of the feature.

I see many posts on this forum that suggest conclusions but leave out key material details, or express only opinion with nothing really to back it up, or assume accuracy is not needed unless it sounds good, or confuses a difference between two perceived equivalent factors with what really is just a difference between 2 different factors (apples to oranges), or tries to compare a whole bundle of factors with a whole bundle of different factors ... ... I could have picked any number of topics here to be irritating and overly detailed about, but I'm interested in / know a little bit about this one, and I feel like it seems to be getting a bad rep in these frequent repeating "what's better leg or DC" threads, so I'm being a pain in the ass about it for some, but hopefully providing a little sorely absent info to others who might need / want it. Actually, I hope we are not at risk of losing this feature due to lack of interest, because I believe that, as a fact, not opinion, it's one of the features introduced recently that is an advancement in modelling, and in the detail that goes into what makes up an IR and its metadata + resulting in improved accuracy - the graphical IR selection portion of DC is great to have, but it's not new or original to Axefx - the accurate and automated application of SIC IS new and original to Fractal - that's fact (unless there some obscure modeller out there that's doing it that I don't know about) - not opinion, and it's optional so anybody can take it or leave it.

So, no it's not fanboyism (which again if you've read my past posts, you'd know grosses me out🤮). It's a key feature that deserves more credit than it's getting. Even if you don't use auto SIC, I think the feature can be relevant to you, because given the accuracy, it can tell you some of the difference between what you hear given whatever SIC you've selected, and what's native to that amp/DC cab combination which might be relevant if dialling in a tone based on some external reference. I'm not a fan of have limited interest in most tube selection or Max rez IRs vs lower resolution IRs because I hear almost no difference between most of them, nor can I see anything larger than a minuscule difference in variations of those items on meters. I became a fan of interested in the SIC subject way back in its beginning because I could hear and see variations in those curves having a huge impact on the sound of a patch (as have many other users), but I thought the general curves approach was flawed because it required a re-auditioning (for SIC) process on top of an already exhausting IR auditioning process - auto-SIC fixed that. I'm a fan of accuracy because I think the accuracy is what leads us to find the sounds we like, by navigating through accurately represented (modelled) parts/controls of amps/cabs based on references we've heard in the past. The "Just Use Your Ears" method needs accuracy (k, that one's my opinion - I believe substantiation can follow). From what I've seen, the evolution of Axefx has been about steady improvement in modelling accuracy to the amp/cab instances in Fractal's inventory - and what's it yielding for customers? tones they like, and that they can easily dial in on Axfx just by ears if they like (hmm - wonder why that result doesn't apply as much to other modellers whose makers have not pursued accuracy as relentlessly as Fractal does).

Anyway - I can't say much more really - so I'll stop being a pita and shut up about it now.
 
Last edited:
This may be a stupid question.....not sure...lol. I wonder if Cab Lab 4 will make it possible to take a Dyna-Cab mix, with four different mics/positions,
and create a regular Legacy IR of that mix that sounds just like the Dyna-Cab? Does that even make sense?
It makes sense. That’s the whole point.

IRs are basically filters and they can be mixed together and the resulting curve can be saved. Fun huh!
 
I'll try not to take "That's an opinion" as a complete dismissal of of everything I've said above including the substantial effort I put into making sure it was balanced, factual, included key material details and points, thoroughly and clearly explained, and not based solely on just my own "liking" of the feature.

I see many posts on this forum that suggest conclusions but leave out key material details, or express only opinion with nothing really to back it up, or assume accuracy is not needed unless it sounds good, or confuses one of two perceived equivalent factors with what really is just a difference between 2 different factors (apples to oranges), or tries to compare a whole bundle of factors with a whole bundle of different factors ... ... I could have picked any number of topics here to be irritating and overly detailed about, but I'm interested in / know a little bit about this one, and I feel like it seems to be getting a bad rep in these frequent repeating "what's better leg or DC" threads, so I'm being a pain in the ass about it for some, but hopefully providing a little sorely absent info to others who might need / want it. Actually, I hope we are not at risk of losing this feature due to lack of interest, because I believe that, as a fact, not opinion, it's one of the features introduced recently that is an advancement in modelling, and in the detail that goes into what makes up an IR and its metadata + resulting in improved accuracy - the graphical IR selection portion of DC is great to have, but it's not new or original to Axefx - the accurate and automated application of SIC IS new and original to Fractal - that's fact (unless there some obscure modeller out there that's doing it that I don't know about) - not opinion, and it's optional so anybody can take it or leave it.

So, no it's not fanboyism (which again if you've read my past posts, you'd know grosses me out🤮). It's a key feature that deserves more credit than it's getting. Even if you don't use auto SIC, I think the feature can be relevant to you, because given the accuracy, it can tell you some of the difference between what you hear given whatever SIC you've selected, and what's native to that amp/DC cab combination which might be relevant if dialling in a tone based on some external reference. I'm not a fan of have limited interest in most tube selection or Max rez IRs vs lower resolution IRs because I hear almost no difference between most of them, nor can I see anything larger than a minuscule difference in variations of those items on meters. I became a fan of interested in the SIC subject way back in its beginning because I could hear and see variations in those curves having a huge impact on the sound of a patch (as have many other users), but I thought the general curves approach was flawed because it required a re-auditioning (for SIC) process on top of an already exhausting IR auditioning process - auto-SIC fixed that. I'm a fan of accuracy because I think the accuracy is what leads us to find the sounds we like, by navigating through accurately represented (modelled) parts/controls of amps/cabs based on references we've heard in the past. The "Just Use Your Ears" method needs accuracy (k, that one's my opinion - I believe substantiation can follow). From what I've seen, the evolution of Axefx has been about steady improvement in modelling accuracy to the amp/cab instances in Fractal's inventory - and what's it yielding for customers? tones they like, and that they can easily dial in on Axfx just by ears if they like (hmm - wonder why that result doesn't apply as much to other modellers whose makers have not pursued accuracy as relentlessly as Fractal does).

Anyway - I can't say much more really - so I'll stop being a pita and shut up about it now.
I was in no way dismissing what you said, nor did I say anything about you being a fanboy (I did say you are obviously a fan of auto SIC, I don't think you'd disagree with that, would you?).

I also didn't say that the auto SIC was not an advancement.

What I said is specifically, for my use case (and for others that may not care about auto SIC) that it's not better than the legacy IRs (in my opinion).

Yes, the whole Fractal paradigm is built on accuracy, and it's excellent at that... But not everyone cares about that. I've never played most of the amps, cabinets, effects, etc in the box. What I care about is can I get a sound and a feel that I like.

I feel like maybe you're taking my previous post personally, which was not my intent. My apologies if that is the case...
 
Auto SIC is a first for the industry AFAIK, and awesome with regards to sonic accuracy.

Being able to defeat Auto SIC is also awesome, as the only thing that matters is getting the sound one desires, so...

...nothing to argue about, as Auto SIC is simply, "totally awesome" LOL!
 
you are obviously a fan of auto SIC, I don't think you'd disagree with that, would you?
I'm not a "fan" - I just recognize a significance to it that, on or off, outweighs many other aspects to even my limited range ears.

I feel like maybe you're taking my previous post personally, which was not my intent.
No offense taken - was just trying to highlight that my posts contained more than just opinion.
 
Back
Top Bottom