Double tracked guitar trick

rsf1977_again

rsf1977_again

Power User
So, I've decided I like this idea, especially in the room. This is basically a Haas trick plus a little extra. It's really simple. Run two different amp blocks with cabs in parallel, and pan one hard right and one hard left. I use a Recto2 OrangeModern and a 5153 Blue. Then before the amps split the signal in two so you have one amp receiving the clean untouched input signal, then add a drive pedal of any kind in front of the second amp, I like the 808Mod mixed at 40%.

Here's why I like this. First, the drive pedal alters your playing dynamics feeding one amp, and at the same time it introduces some latency to the signal, due the extra processing, creating a feel of stereo width. This gets me closer to the feeling of 2 guitars at once without feeling over processed. Give it a go, cheers! :encouragement:
 
I have been using the haas effect in my rig for years. I however only use one amp, and instead i split the L/R signal in the very end by anywhere between 7-14ms using either the stereo delay, or the pitch block. I use it sometimes as an effect, to differentiate between me and the other guitarplaer, or to make way for the vocal during middle8s or choruses... Works like a charm!
 
I have also had a positive experience with using two amps with two different feels. 1 middle distortion and one more crunchy.
Pan hard left and hard right and add a mono delay of 15ms to the second amp.
Then modify the second delay so it varies very slowly between 13ms and 17ms. This gets as close as you can to a double tracked guitar.
 
This a great trick for the studio and live if your only have one guitar in the group. I doulble track all my studio stuff, but while I am writing I use the haas effect to make things sound fuller and more stereo. Its a lot more inspiring while writing than just a mono guitar track is. With the hard panning, latency shouldn't create phase issues. As soon as you start panning toward center you will though.
 
I have found it is hard to keep the Haas effect in tact for the audience in a live situation, the stereo field has a tendency to collapse. It sounds awesome in the in-ears :)
For recording I almost always prefer double tracking. I use 2 amps live a lot. It is not dependent on a stereo field and gives some separation when hard panned left/right, sounds good in mono, and thickens up the sound.
 
Completely by weird coincidence, I was messing with this yesterday. I recorded something random on a Dual amp setup (with one amp having a drive and compressor) and compared it to the mono version.

Here is the stereo:


It falls apart in mono a bit with some phasing and hollowness:


You can hear the latency and slight delay in the stereo version. If I was to record this, I'd probably try some phase correction plugin or record 2 mono tracks and pan them if I cared to keep it mono-compatible.

I think dual amp wide-panned presets sound great and are fun to play through. Also don't seem to need as much tweaking.
 
Yeah, I only use this trick for live purposes. And, it only really helps when I play small gigs with unmiced 4x12s. Very rarely can I convince a sound guy to mic both and our other guitarist. Also, most venues don't run stereo PA setups, so there's that as well.
 
Does anyone know precisely how much latency is introduced by the addition of a drive block in one path of a dual amp set up but not the other? Does it depend on the drive type? I'm using the FET Boost primarily. What value in ms would you have to set on the look ahead on a compressor to compensate? Thanks.
 
What about the Enhancer block?
Or a Stereo Delay at the end of your chain, feedback and delay set as low as possible, mix fairly high
 
Chris Rudolf said:
Does anyone know precisely how much latency is introduced by the addition of a drive block in one path of a dual amp set up but not the other? Does it depend on the drive type? I'm using the FET Boost primarily. What value in ms would you have to set on the look ahead on a compressor to compensate? Thanks.
Click to expand...

One easy way to align the time again is to insert a drive block in the other chain as well with the mix set to zero. It might also work if it's completely bypassed. I can't remember at the moment.
 
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rsf1977_again said:
One easy way to align the time again is to insert a drive block in the other chain as well with the mix set to zero. It might also work if it's completely bypassed. I can't remember at the moment.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the great tip. Yes. I tried it and it works. However, I am trying to conserve CPU. Which uses less CPU, a Drive block or a compressor block? My presets are not that complicated but I seem to choose effect blocks that have pricey CPU costs and I am near the limit.
 
Chris Rudolf said:
Which uses less CPU, a Drive block or a compressor block?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure, but you can find out pretty quickly. Check the CPU usage on your preset. Then add a Drive block and see how much it changes. Repeat the test with a Compressor block.
 
When I first got my Axe, I was pretty into building dual amp presets and added some Haas effect. The problem for me was CPU. YOu can run out of available processing power pretty quick if you build presets with full pedal board setups like I tend to do.

I have found the enhancer block gives me the effect I desire and does a great job or creating that dual amp sound. It's a little different, as you don't have 2 separate tones going, but at the same time if the amp tone is big and great (which it usually is) then I don't need 2 amps anymore.

This thread makes me want to go back and do some new experimenting though... I haven't done 2 amps in FW16...
 
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