Budget coaxial active cabs-new contestant

[lauke-lux]

Thanks a lot for having done this video Scott, yeah the difference is quite obvious. BTW If you could speak up a bit more loud it would be great for having less dynamics ;-), I explain : I had to turn up all the volumes on my PC to well understand what you said and then...... just waked up the family when you started playing....
Keep on rocking !
Another solution might be to clean my ears ?...
And to close, just for my culture, what does YMMV mean ?

 

[Scott Peterson]

Thanks a lot for having done this video Scott, yeah the difference is quite obvious. BTW If you could speak up a bit more loud it would be great for having less dynamics ;-), I explain : I had to turn up all the volumes on my PC to well understand what you said and then...... just waked up the family when you started playing....
Keep on rocking !
Another solution might be to clean my ears ?...
And to close, just for my culture, what does YMMV mean ?

Yea, I have to get my 'making videos' process sussed out more, trust me. LOL.

YMMV = Your Mileage May Vary. Which is basically saying, these are my opinions and you might feel otherwise.

Thanks for watching!

 

[MisterE]

YMMV = VKPV = Votre kilométrage peut varier LOL

Nice review Scott.
Kinda surprised to here your voice.
I would have expected the eloquent Mr. Peterson to speak with an Oxford accent

Anyhoo, I still had my doubts what to go for.
I had the Atomics but these have gone to my son.
I had a pair of LEM coaxials which sounded great but weren't very reliable.
So these RCF's seem to fit the bill. Good monitors and they can be used as PA speakers.

Thanks again.

 

[Scott Peterson]

YMMV = VKPV = Votre kilométrage peut varier LOL

Nice review Scott.
Kinda surprised to here your voice.
I would have expected the eloquent Mr. Peterson to speak with an Oxford accent

Anyhoo, I still had my doubts what to go for.
I had the Atomics but these have gone to my son.
I had a pair of LEM coaxials which sounded great but weren't very reliable.
So these RCF's seem to fit the bill. Good monitors and they can be used as PA speakers.

Thanks again.

Born in Detroit, raised and live in the Midwest of the US. Just a normal guy.

I would not deem the RCF a budget level product though. They are over the $1000+ range I'd call 'entry level professional'. IMHO, YMMV.

 

[MisterE]

Just a normal guy

Nothing normal about you.
I like your writing and moderation style.
And I enjoyed all your tips.
Every forum should have a Scott

I know the RCF's aren't budget speakers. I've been following the NX 12 SMA thread as well.
The LEM's were €750 not exactly cheap either. After 2 years they both failed. Tweeters cutting out. I had to turn it off and on all the time.
They've been in for repairs but no use. And now LEM is out of business
The RCF's are €1100. Not cheap. But I'm relying on RCF's reputation and I hope these will last a bit longer.
The TT's are propably better, as are the passive D&B max 12's but these are way over my budget.
So I guess the Nx 12SMA's are the ones.

 

[brain21]

I'm also using the RCF ;-) even before Scott.
Tried the K10, the Verve12mA and the LD Systems before. The LD was thew best of that bunch IMO.

But LD systems has GOT to have the worst marketing team EVER! They are selling PA speakers, so whats in the pics? A hot blonde with a scowl on her face, pointing a GUN at you!!! WTF??!?! Are you serious? Thats worse than the Guitar World Guitar buyers guide with the gratuitous babes holding the cheesy guitars. I mean, hot checks toting guns to sell PA systems!

Oh, and then there are the giant-sized lillies in there as well. Why?????

 

[Dutch]

But LD systems has GOT to have the worst marketing team EVER! They are selling PA speakers, so whats in the pics? A hot blonde with a scowl on her face, pointing a GUN at you!!! WTF??!?! Are you serious? Thats worse than the Guitar World Guitar buyers guide with the gratuitous babes holding the cheesy guitars. I mean, hot checks toting guns to sell PA systems!

Oh, and then there are the giant-sized lillies in there as well. Why?????

Dude! She's hot! Who cares!

 

[rednebb]

I own and use a RCF NX 12SMA for a powered cab/wedge to run FRFR for my gigs and preference.
Got the Alto Professional SXM112A Tourmax in here; give it a go. Following is IMHO, YMMV.

Short version: It's good value for the money; but really pales in comparison to the RCF in terms of performance.

Longer version:

Pluses:

• Nice size, nice weight.
• Good quality materials and build for the money.
• It worked when I turned it on.

Minuses:

• Flubby bottom end no matter what you set the 'preset' knob too.
• Stuffy midrange. Nasal and boxy sounding.
• Dull high end. Made the top end of tones sound indistinct; clarity was obscured.
• Output sound pressure levels are not very high. I was getting maybe 110db about a meter away cranked up, didn't sound good at all when I did that.
• All the controls and connections are on the back, which would face the audience. That's a disaster waiting to happen, or at the very least a unprofessional looking solution for stage work

Compared and contrasted to the RCF NX 12SMA - like comparing a high school baseball player to an All-Star major league player. The Alto is about 60% of the size of the RCF - that's great! - but there is no serious way to compare the two in any realistic manner. It's just not a fair fight.

Conclusion: Do not know if I'd be happy with this personally; but I'm a spoiled boy now. This is a value box though; for the money - a $200 speaker from HelloMusic - this is a grand slam though.

IMHO, YMMV.

I did a video shoot out; quick and down-n-dirty, but you can get a frame of reference from it.

Ok, this was very interesting, although in a negative way, since I was the one starting this thread, hoping that these cabs would do the trick both for me and others on a budget.. But after reading, seeing and hearing this revealing review (although maybe it's not fair to compare them to the RCF which cost A LOT more..), I realize that I probably wouldn't be happy with them either.. Fortunately, dv247.de, which I ordered my pair of Alto SXM112As from two weeks ago, had messed up my order and hadn't shipped them yet, so I cancelled my order and asked for a refund. But I can't afford buying even one RCF NX10SMA right now anyway.. By the way, has anyone compared the RCF NX12SMA and 10SMA side by side and can the 10 hold its own against the 12? I want to have two for stereo, and if I ever can afford two RCFs at all, I'm thinking two of the 12's will be maybe a bit too big and heavy, while two 10's would be more compact and light of course (and a tad less expensive..)

 

[merlin17]

The 10s are fine and not too different from the 12s.

 

[paulmapp8306]

rednebb - if your tight on budged (I am too - would love to try the RCF but dont think I can stretch), have a look at the LDs on Thomanns site. Merlin has had some and has said that while not as good as the RCFs, they were better than the QSC K12s and the Verve 12mas. Similar price to the Alto's. the only potential issue as far as Ican see is the volume. 100db isnt LOUD - but if your using them as monitors rather than backline it should be enough.

LD SYSTEMS MON 121A - Thomann UK Cyberstore

 

[rednebb]

The 10s are fine and not too different from the 12s.

Ok, so you don't think I would miss any bass, headroom or "oomph" (or anything else) with a pair of NX10SMA's compared to 12SMA's? And do you think just one 10 would work fine also, at least on a temporarily basis..? (Or one of each maybe?) An A/B comparison video or sound demo of the two would be excellent, but I guess maybe nobody has both..?

 

[rednebb]

rednebb - if your tight on budged (I am too - would love to try the RCF but dont think I can stretch), have a look at the LDs on Thomanns site. Merlin has had some and has said that while not as good as the RCFs, they were better than the QSC K12s and the Verve 12mas. Similar price to the Alto's. the only potential issue as far as Ican see is the volume. 100db isnt LOUD - but if your using them as monitors rather than backline it should be enough.

LD SYSTEMS MON 121A - Thomann UK Cyberstore

Yeah, I've looked at these before, and merlin recommended them to me, but the reason I didn't go for these, was that they are actually 17kg, not 12,8 like it says on Thomann (I got this info from LD systems support people), and they don't have speaker stand mounts (I want my speakers to have that option too, when I'm need for a small PA system). But for the record, it would be nicee to hear how Merlin would compare the LD MON121A to the Alto SXM112A (if he hasn't done so already, in that case I might have missed that post..)

By the way; you're saying "100db isnt LOUD - but if your using them as monitors rather than backline it should be enough" Maybe I'm stupid here, but does it matter where they are situated; as regular monitors in front (or on the side) of you, or behind you, like a regular backline/guitar amp? The volume is still the same anyway? I'm kind of surprised to see from pictures that most Axe-Fx players using FR systems have their powered cabs placed in front of them and not behind them, especially since everyone's talking about trying to get the same "feel" out of playing an FR system as from playing a regular guitar amp. Then it would make sense to place the cabs behind you like you would with a guitar amp then, wouldn't it? I have actually seen a guitarist who had his guitar amp placed in front of him on stage, but I guess 99% of all guitarists have their amps right behind them, so why don't Axe-Fx/FR system players do this also..?

 

[paulmapp8306]

What I mean, is that if your using them as wedges its likely that the main sound is going to a desk and a dedicated PA. The wedges are for personal monitoring - which doesnt have to be that loud and shouldnt be pushing sound towards the audience. If your using them as backline then the speaker needs to face the audience and has to carry the room as well - so need to be louder than for just onstage monitoring purposes.

Its why Im looking at them. I use and amp/cab route for most gigs as I do have to carry the room (too small venues to mic up really - and a poor band PA) BUT for the odd occasion where on stage volume needs to be lower and all the sound goes via a desk (functions primarily) them Im after a suitable lower volume stage monitoring system.

 

[merlin17]

Ok, so you don't think I would miss any bass, headroom or "oomph" (or anything else) with a pair of NX10SMA's compared to 12SMA's? And do you think just one 10 would work fine also, at least on a temporarily basis..? (Or one of each maybe?) An A/B comparison video or sound demo of the two would be excellent, but I guess maybe nobody has both..?

The 10 sounds a little bit "smaller" than the 12, but not much - I'd still say they are more FRFR than any other brand I know below 1500,- Euro, much better than the Verve 12mA and the K10 and a "hair" away from the 12SMA. And it has a bit less headroom (it's lower wattage...), but it still is loud. I have two 12's and two friends of mine have a 10 each (one guitarist with an Axe Standard and one keyboard player). They're as happy with them as I am with the 12's. They're great. Try them. Two of them for stereo? That would kill (as do my two 12's). Even for a very nice and small PA.

 

[rednebb]

What I mean, is that if your using them as wedges its likely that the main sound is going to a desk and a dedicated PA. The wedges are for personal monitoring - which doesnt have to be that loud and shouldnt be pushing sound towards the audience. If your using them as backline then the speaker needs to face the audience and has to carry the room as well - so need to be louder than for just onstage monitoring purposes.

Its why Im looking at them. I use and amp/cab route for most gigs as I do have to carry the room (too small venues to mic up really - and a poor band PA) BUT for the odd occasion where on stage volume needs to be lower and all the sound goes via a desk (functions primarily) them Im after a suitable lower volume stage monitoring system.

Ok, so you meant using them as personal monitors when going to PA, as opposed to using them as the only source for your guitar sound out to the audience (not using PA). 99,9% of the time when I'm playing gigs, the sound goes to PA, direct from the Axe-Fx when I'm using that, or miking up my regular amp. So I'm talking about personal monitoring purpose anyway. But my point is that most all guitarists are used to have their guitar amps (which in a PA situation also works as "personal monitors") behind them and not in front of them, so why are apparently so many FR users placing their personal monitors/powered cabs in front of them? To me, it would make more sense to have my guitar sound/"personal guitar monitors" behind me like I'm used to, and have the rest of the regular monitoring of the band in front of me, like usual. And of course it's also a space issue; if you use stereo cabs and want to have them on the floor right in front of you, there's no room for the regular band mix monitor there, meaning this must then be placed further out on the side, resulting that you won't hear this very well, and also that you might be interfering with the bass player's space.. And on a small stage there might not even be room to have that many monitors on the floor in front of you at all. And even if the cabs/monitors are wedged, this shouldn't necessarily mean that they "must" be placed in front of you. Like with regular amps; some like to have their amp(s) straight on the floor, others will stack it on top of a case or something, and others again will want to wedge it, like the old Fender amps which had built-in "legs" for this purpose. Maybe we should make this a poll: How many of you FR users place your cab(s) in front of you like a regular PA monitor, and how many place them behind you like a regular guitar amp..?

 

[merlin17]

I used to put my guitar monitors in the back (like my former amps) because I couldn't stand their sound hitting me from the front. That was with the Verve, the K10 and the LD. Not so with the RCF - that works fine from the front as it is not harsh like the others. On bigger gigs I'm putting one RCF on the right in front of me and the second on the right of my back. That sounds and feels like a wall of 4 4x12's on my side. Not kidding ;-)

 

[rednebb]

The 10 sounds a little bit "smaller" than the 12, but not much - I'd still say they are more FRFR than any other brand I know below 1500,- Euro, much better than the Verve 12mA and the K10 and a "hair" away from the 12SMA. And it has a bit less headroom (it's lower wattage...), but it still is loud. I have two 12's and two friends of mine have a 10 each (one guitarist with an Axe Standard and one keyboard player). They're as happy with them as I am with the 12's. They're great. Try them. Two of them for stereo? That would kill (as do my two 12's). Even for a very nice and small PA.

Ok, cool! So, I'm thinking; since you have two friends that have one NX10SMA each, it would be actually technically possible to meet up with them bringing their 10's, you bringing your 12's, and do a real A/B "shoot-out" between the NX12SMA's and the NX-10SMA's, in both mono and stereo setups, and maybe even record audio and/or video of it..? That would be aboslutely awesome.. ;-)

 

[merlin17]

Technically yes. I've compared the 10 to the 12 already (as the guitar player friend came to me to exactly do this). What I wrote above are my findings and recommendations. You wouldn't hear the difference between the two in a video anyway. They sound almost identical. You HAVE TO try them yourself. And I'm sure you WILL like them.

 

[rednebb]

Technically yes. I've compared the 10 to the 12 already (as the guitar player friend came to me to exactly do this). What I wrote above are my findings and recommendations. You wouldn't hear the difference between the two in a video anyway. They sound almost identical. You HAVE TO try them yourself. And I'm sure you WILL like them.

Ok, thanks! Hm.., I feel GAS coming on here, anyone want to sell their NX10SMA's dirt cheap..? ;-)

 

[mrpollack]

Merlin's thread about the RCF is what got my notice and piqued up my interested in the RCF NX 12-SMA. He's been an invaluable source of information and answered all my questions.

I greatly trust his opinion(s) given how closely my experience matched his.

Do you think is it worth to buy pair of RCF NX 10-SMA instead of 12" ? Do you think the sound deference would be big..especially in the bass response department ?
Thanks,
jacek

Ok I just've found Peter's response for my question