Axe FX II + Roland VG-99 = Axe FX III

Jerry K. said:
Another great thing about the VG-99 is its two distinct signal paths. One of the features I really like is the ability to morph between two sounds (clean and distortion). You can do it on the Axe II but in my experience, you overload the CPU pretty quick with a loaded up patch.

As others have said, the Axe II's modeling blows the VG-99 away but the merging of the two technologies could be pretty incredible!
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I use the GR-55 and the Axe together. The blend is fantastic as the GR-55 gives you tremendous synth capabilities and the ability to change tunings on the fly. I don't use it for any electric or acoustic sounds as the Axe does that hands down better.

Here's a clip of both. Acoustic sounds are Axe and horns and piano are GR55. The combination of the two for a three piece opens up worlds of possibilities.

Does Anybody Really Know - YouTube
 
Kruegmeister said:
My Gibson Dark Fire (Robot II) does 5 second turnings, has Piezo for Acoustic.
Had to do a lot of reading, but after I disabled the EQ BS, set all Pickup Switching to "Les Paul mode" and learned my Tunings all to the Main Blue Bank. Now it works perfect for Live performances. Drop C to Standard to Eb to Drop Db all in seconds!
Plus I have a Les Paul sounding Les Paul along with all of that.
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hope it never breaks down. That guitar (actually several of them) was a nightmare for me. The last time it broke down Gibson couldnt get parts (tuner) to fix it even after 4 months. Finally, they gave up and gave me a new Les Paul Standard Plus Top.
Nice concept, too many moving parts and the company doesn't keep extras.
 
Just to chime in here,

I got really enthused about Midi guitar and the possibility of playing other synth modules etc. I went out and got a bunch of midi guitar gear - starting with the Axon 100, then a Roland GR-33. I drove them with a GK-2A on a Strat. I wasn't happy with any of it, but the promise of the technology kept me interested. I bought a Roland Ready Strat (NOT a good guitar BTW - for some reason they chose to throw that technology into MIM Strats that are really closer to Squires. Every fret was sharp as hell on the ends and the normal guitar sounds were very cheesy. Even the GK didnt track particularly well, despite tons of adjustment.)

Then they came out with the GK-55, and both Wechter and Godin had some higher end 15 pin guitars with piezo/midi pups in the bridges. And Graph-Tech came out with the Ghost Saddles that are Piezo and Midi. Yes I bought them all. The GK-55 is a real improvement. It is much closer to where I thought they would be, despite one of the worst user interfaces I have ever encountered. The Godin and the Wechter are similar guitars, both play nicely, are useable electrics if you want humbucker tone, and the midi pickups track reasonably well. But - you really need to work with them - they are VERY playing style sensitive and you need to adjust your playing for the patch. Some patches track much better than others. Some require you to damp to quiet muted strings, and some just dont track right at all. I wanted to play the Cake song "Short Skirt, Long Jacket" in a quick cover thing I did last summer, and figured I would use the GR-55 for the trumpet parts. I did it - it came across OK, but I had to focus so much on picking and making sure each note was demonstrative. Hammer ons and pull offs are not always read correctly - (and yes I have it set up correctly).

So yes these devices have improved. But they still have a way to go before I would play them on a stage in a GB band or a cover band and try to rely on them as a keys replacement. Some synth pads maybe. I was hoping for a B3 sound that worked - not so much. And as far as 3rd party plugins or synth modules go, their voices are not designed to be used with a Midi guitar. The velocity and sustain are hard to capture. How do you keep a synth pad going after the guitar tone dies? Yes you can tell the synth to hold it with a pedal, but its not the same.

However, to the user who implied MIDI was dead, and then pointed out Keith MacMillan's company among others. Ironically, Keith McMillan makes the leading Midi aftermarket pedal, the SoftStep. They are trying other protocols, but MIDI isn't going away. I have the current Yamaha Motif XF8, their flagship synthesizer, and they have a full MIDI implementation and are developing new products in IOS to use Midi, etc. Midi is alive and well and frankly a pretty robust protocol in many ways. Mini_Amp Gizmos are very cool little devices to switch channels on a non-midi amp. I have them for a couple of Mesa amps I have and they work great.

I understand the OP was just saying that the VG-99 and the Axe II are a great match. In a controlled, one track at a time situation I agree wholeheartedly. It is just my humble opinion that the technology isn't really ready for primetime playing yet. Playing live with those devices would be rough. Maybe I am just old and set in my ways, but I would love to actually see someone using a VG-99 or a GR-55 fluidly in a live show. Just my $.02

Joe
 
joe1871 said:
I would love to actually see someone using a VG-99 or a GR-55 fluidly in a live show. Just my $.02
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I've been playing with the VG8, VG88 and VG99 (guitar modellers) and the Axon AX100 MkII with synts (guitar-to-midi converter converter) on stage for many years. No fluidity problems.


Anyway, the GR-55 and the VG-99 are different animals. The VG99 is not a Guitar-to-MIDI converter (although it has that function); it is a guitar modeller (in exactly the same sense as the Axe-FX is an Amplifier modeller). It shapes the original wave from the guitar; no midi conversion, therefore no tracking errors at all.
 
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I definitely think it would be worth looking into implementing at least some of these features, but if they can't be done it's not a problem, the AxeFX II is an amazing unit as it is, and I don't think us mere mortals are meant to have the power of MIDI in it as well. :D
 
I've got a GR55 and an Axe Fx II. I think they're both great but in TOTALLY different ways. Kinda like comparing a super car to a jet plane.

I love the "realness" of the Axe for vintage tube feel stuff
I love the GR55 just for the pure fun of messing around. Things like having a double bass on the lower 2 strings and an open banjo on the top 4! Crazy stuff like that. It's just a fun toy and the only limit is your imagination. I would only use the sounds like keyboard / Piano etc for looping and practising over (The looper on the GR55, although short, is well implemented I feel...)

YMMV, IMHO etc., and all the other acronyms.....
 
I have a godin LGX SA and i have a GR1 and i used that all the time live i used it for horn parts strings and synth parts. We played stuff like jungle boogie all the way to judas priest alot of the horn parts i just blended a little guitar in there, they sounded just fine and synth and string parts with a screaming axefx2 sounds very FAT. The guitzr synth is what it is but it don't touch the Axefx2 even the ax can get some synth parts
 
I played around with a VG-99 a few times in a music store and my impression was that it's the most useful of the tools (vs. a GR-55) from an expressive point of view. I could play synth tones without altering my style and it worked nicely. It cleanly responded to bends, vibrato, slides, etc. since it's modifying the waveform, rather than triggering a sound generator. I quite liked it.

Terry.
 
I felt this could fit here. Just started into Midi guitar in november. Bought a Motif rack ES, GR-55 and Axon ax50. Also just bought a godin LGX SA. I think it just takes a lot of time and being realistic on what will work live. Probably going to get rid of the GR-55 as I don't need much guitar modeling. The yamaha sounds are so much more lush to my ears.

I'm getting close to having the axon and motif with Godin gig ready. I could never do this unless I had a keyboard player. Here's some lush background strings. Not sure I'll ever use it for piano though. Organ is rocking tho just fine. Axe fx, axon, motif, and kswitcher all being controlled from my Liquid Foot Pro too.

 
At the music schools they should teach the difference between a Midi Guitar and a Guitar Modeller, the same as they teach the difference between an Violin and a Mandoline. Both concepts get too easily mixed and confused :)
 
I remember when I first got the VG-99 messing around with the guitar to midi...
oh jeez I pissed away hours.....
I was using the VG to trigger my korg triton...

shredding lead guitar and harpsichord at the same time was nuts...
loved messing with the cathedral organ and synths too

you do have to adapt your technique, but I think it's less about the guitar to midi and more about the timbe that you're actually using
 
Love the GR. I see it, as Scott puts it, as another tool. I was never happy with the single note stuff I was doing with the axe. Now I use the GR55, and don't need single note. Actually having a hard time remembering I can play more than one. Still new to the mix. About 4 gigs into it and still tweaking. I use it for something on about 16 songs. One song, it's all I use(flute/piano/sax). Just found some more B3 patches yesterday that are very cool. Now the axe is my amp sim(and drop tuner for 1 song) and I love using it as that. I figure in about 4-6 months the pair will feel completely natural. Tweaking the midi pickup is KEY. One or two values on one or two settings can take you from great to horrible from a playing perspective. Either you will get crossnotes you dont want, or have to hit the string so hard you get frustrated. Probably the coolest thing I use it for-locomotive breath intro. I detune the E and A strings so I can hit the low notes. Also pretty fond of the harmonica. The dual note thing is key here.

Other cool things I am just starting to mess with...
1) Different instruments on different strings. I have one patch with cello on the lower three strings and a strings section on the upper three. Because of octave settings, they are in the same register.
2) Drums, hey-it's fun to freak out the drummer, though I need to work on the picking pattern.
3) Mixing-it sounds huge when you use both units. My axe goes through a matrix 1K to a 2x12 orange cab. The GR goes to either a K8 or K12. Mixing a clean amp into a dirty sound or two clean but different sounds-huge on stage. Two dirty sounds, maybe one as a lead boost, still playing with that.

Of course, you can use the mag pickups through the GR. I have a few settings in case I need a backup. Other than that-don't use them. Pretty much a PCM1/PCM2 kinda use for me.

The only negative...the floor gets a little crowded ;)
 
Carydad,
Yes, this thread has made me dust off my GR55 again, and use it together with the Axe.
Very cool.
How do you use both?
A separate instrument cable from the Mag PU of guitar into Axe and the midi cable from the GK3 into GR55?
Or as Dominik does, do you route your GR55 into the back of the Axe ?
 
I would prefer Fractal Audio to offer a separate "virtual guitar" unit so that Std/Ultra/II owners could use it.
 
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