11 Rack... Is Cliff a law breaker?!?

A lot of emotions over nothing...

One thing worth mentioning is that if we do any significant feature additions.....
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Maybe there won't be any significant additions at all.... I mean it sounds like they didn't even made up their mind about
offering anything other then bug fixes.

:!:
 
I would object to giving Avid a red nickel! I dislike everything about them. Avid video editing is horrendous to work with. They marketed it to death until you had to use Avid or you weren't pro. Then Apple with Final Cut Pro gave it a thorough ass whopin'.

In pro audio Avid marketed pro tools until you had to have it or you weren't pro. Even locked their software customers into using their crappy hardware. Once again trounced by Logic and a few others.

Don't need to mention the situation in the amp modeling realm.

Avid is a poster child for everything that is wrong with the corporate business model. Successful, but not in the slightest bit interested in providing elegant solutions for it's customers.

And by the way, the last I checked Fractal Audio wasn't a public company. If Cliff ever decides to offer an IPO I'll get in line.
 
AndrewSimon said:
A lot of emotions over nothing...

One thing worth mentioning is that if we do any significant feature additions.....
Click to expand...

Maybe there won't be any significant additions at all.... I mean it sounds like they didn't even made up their mind about
offering anything other then bug fixes.

:!:
Click to expand...

Again it just re-enforces what a great purchase the Axe-FX is. I am not sure what 11R would consider significant but I would think that additional amp models might be considered significant. How many new models have we gotten for free?

There were some other quotes about things some of the 11R user base was asking about but hasn't gotten so far... like auto-engage for the wah. That's a killer feature I enjoy today with Axe-FX. It would be a shame if the 11R held out because it was considered significant.

Cliff raised the bar so high you'd need access to the Hubble telescope to find it.
 
shasha said:
I think that the 11R is a fine idea and has potential, but they're just another big company that will lose interest and support once they focus on the next product.
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I have already gotten the feeling that after the demise of the Digidesign brand name AVID lost interest in the "old" Digi products.
AndrewSimon said:
Maybe there won't be any significant additions at all.... I mean it sounds like they didn't even made up their mind about
offering anything other then bug fixes.
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Like with the Eleven Plugin. They were promising updates in the beginning but none have surfaced over the last 3 years.
 
FractalAudio said:
However, this begs a question: if they do a major upgrade and charge money for it will the price of a new one increase accordingly? If no, then they're going to have a lot of angry customers.
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Not so common in the hardware world, in the software world it's a whole different story. Most of the software I use has had updates/upgrades over the years I had to pay for. As an example take something like Reason. I bought it years ago for the same price it still costs now, BUT... there have been upgrades I had to pay for. Someone who buys the new product including the updates now, pays as much as I did when it was on version 1. In the meantime though I paid far more on top of that to stay up to date. Just the way it goes...
 
VegaBaby said:
FractalAudio said:
However, this begs a question: if they do a major upgrade and charge money for it will the price of a new one increase accordingly? If no, then they're going to have a lot of angry customers.
Click to expand...
Not so common in the hardware world, in the software world it's a whole different story. Most of the software I use has had updates/upgrades over the years I had to pay for. As an example take something like Reason. I bought it years ago for the same price it still costs now, BUT... there have been upgrades I had to pay for. Someone who buys the new product including the updates now, pays as much as I did when it was on version 1. In the meantime though I paid far more on top of that to stay up to date. Just the way it goes...
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Exactly the way Quickbooks works. They even 'sunset' Quickbooks past 3 years old, even though it is essentially the same exact app, to essentially force your hand to 'upgrade' when all they do is apply some new GUI and slightly tweak some features every year. And the cost of the 'upgrade' is insane.

Obviously 'public company' law isn't very conducive to Cliff's business model. I think being a slave to the shareholders and board would drive Cliff nuts in fairly short order.
 
Jed said:
I'll be headed down to the Fractal Tone Factory once my MFC is ready (still patiently waiting my turn). I'd happily bring the crew some beer. Some one has to find out what they like though.

cheers,
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No, no, we don't want to give them beer - that will slow down their productivity. Bring them coffee and keep them working on whatever the next great thing is they have planned.
 
Programmers require a sustained healthy diet of potato chips, ramen noodles, cheetos, Jolt Cola (or alternatively, Mountain Dew) and pr0n in order to survive. Without either of these, their brain cannot function optimally, which results in a lower quality of code. The cola is particularly needed because of its caffeine content.

http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Programmer
 
Scott Peterson said:
I think being a slave to the shareholders... would drive Cliff nuts in fairly short order.
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Not that I would characterize Cliff as a slave but you could make an argument that all of us with an Axe-FX are like shareholders... and I am certain at one point or another we've driven him nuts! :D

And nobody can beat Cliff's track record of paying dividends.
 
The difference between Fractal Audio and Avid Audio is that Avid's sole purpose is to make money whereas I believe that Cliff has taken pride in his products and the quality of the devices represent that.
 
Digidesign ( now Avid ) has for YEARS charged for "upgrades", every time I turned around... "You want to upgrade ? That will be $6500 to upgrade... AND you have to return your old cards... Oh yeah, and by the way, the Interfaces that you JUST bought LAST YEAR for $2500 (EACH !!) are INCOMPATIBLE with the NEW system, so you will have to buy SIX of them to replace your old ones..." !!!!????!!!
WTH !!??

Sad, but true.... I have been using Digi stuff since they first came out with "Sound Tools" in the early 90's... got tired of them acting like the alcoholic friend or relative always asking for money and ditched the hardware dependent system and went with the firewire interface, and a MOTU rig as well...

Law MY @$$ !!

Cliff, as everyone knows. is "THE MAN !!"... he does business the way everyone SHOULD do business... he will always have customers from the way he conducts his business like a true professional...
 
flyingfadr said:
Digidesign ( now Avid ) has for YEARS charged for "upgrades", every time I turned around... "You want to upgrade ? That will be $6500 to upgrade... AND you have to return your old cards... Oh yeah, and by the way, the Interfaces that you JUST bought LAST YEAR for $2500 (EACH !!) are INCOMPATIBLE with the NEW system, so you will have to buy SIX of them to replace your old ones..." !!!!????!!!
WTH !!??

Sad, but true.... I have been using Digi stuff since they first came out with "Sound Tools" in the early 90's... got tired of them acting like the alcoholic friend or relative always asking for money and ditched the hardware dependent system and went with the firewire interface, and a MOTU rig as well...

Law MY @$$ !!

Cliff, as everyone knows. is "THE MAN !!"... he does business the way everyone SHOULD do business... he will always have customers from the way he conducts his business like a true professional...
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Yeah...they could do that sort of thing with PT when computers were still slow and dependant on their system which actually was great at that time. Those times have really changed since then. I know a lot of studios who ditched their PT systems for your exact reasons, went Nuendo or Logic with some good converters. Unfortunately there are still some great plugins on that platform (which only work there) and some studios just need the name ProTools in their gearlist.....
 
Yeah, Vegas... unfortunately, they STILL do it !.... we have multiple ProTools HD3 systems in our facility... they STILL want $6500 +, as I said before...
At HOME, I went away from the card based stuff... just not enough performance per dollar for home use.... use killer mic pre's, good converters, and the firewire stuff will sound every bit as good as all the albums we grew up loving...
 
AdamCook said:
It's amusing that according to this website only 7% of Avid employees approve of the job their CEO is doing:
http://www.glassdoor.com/Reviews/avid-r ... _KE0,4.htm
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Not surprising.

I had a few co-workers who left to work for Avid a while back. They moved up through the ranks pretty quickly and were making anywhere from a decent to a very good living. They ended up leaving after a relatively short time.

And the sad part is that these guys weren't anything special; I was never impressed with their work ethic to be honest. If they made that kind of impression and did that well with Avid....and they didn't like the way things were done in the company that's pretty damning IMHO.
 
FWIW, if Fractal used the Line6 model (bug fixes free, pay for additional amp and fx models), it wouldn't bother me a bit. For a while it actually helped the Pod resale value, because you could get more for a Pod with the model packs loaded. The only problem I had with the Line6 model was the model packs forced you to buy too many amps you didn't really need just to get the one you wanted. Just like cable TV.

Of course, regular model upgrades is a big selling feature for the Axe. It definitely adds some sugar to the KoolAde ...

JWW
 
Software upgrades... I'm surprised nobody brought up the biggest shtick of them all. The Micro$oft bugfix for Vista that they slapped some new skin on it and call it a new OS! 7 my ass. Vista SP2 would have been more appropriate. Unfortunately my laptop still lacked some steam under Vista so I reluctantly bought Win7 anyway. Now it works better and I quite like Win7, but I hate Micro$oft's for pulling this stunt.

And whats more: why is price for the upgrade higher than an OEM version? "Oh, you already shelled out big time for Vista? Great. We'll make you pay even more for 7 than someone else who didn't."

I'm so p'ed off about it I could spit.

Another thing. In Holland they have special program for people in education. I think the USA has that too. Both students and people that work for schools get special price. The odd thing is a Student gets a pretty nice discount. But the people working in education get a whopping unbelievable laughable price to pay! a Student (usually not the richest demographic) can get a €299 Ultimate Upgrade for about €75. But the janitor that mows the lawn at some high school can get a full blown Win7 Ultimate Upgrade for a whopping €17,-. That's so out of proportion it hurts. I have to pay 6 times that for Home Premium! Ultimate is almost 20 times that for anyone not in education!! I get that MS wants their hooks into students so they stay with MS throughout their subsequent careers, so they sponsor their educators, but this is ridiculous and maddening!

I like Win7, but I still feel I'm paying through the nose for a bug fix with a new skin.
 
Dutch said:
And whats more: why is price for the upgrade higher than an OEM version? "Oh, you already shelled out big time for Vista? Great. We'll make you pay even more for 7 than someone else who didn't."

I'm so p'ed off about it I could spit.
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That's just another reason why I moved to the Mac.

MS has totally lost it, 70% of US college freshman buy Macs (2010 survey), these are the business people of tomorrow.
 
I know, OT. But this is the lounge and the Avid stuff was OT too.

Can't afford a Mac at this time. I actually quite like Win7. I like Reaper. I like all the other stuff I have working on it. It works stable and pretty sleek and better than Vista on my laptop.

But it's so obvious! And I can't believe hardly anyone else is mad about it! Win7 is a bugfix with full sticker price!
They take 7 years or more to develop Vista, introduce it with the whole Marching Band marketing tactics, alienating a whole slew of legacy programs and hardware that doesn't work with Vista anymore. A mountain of bitching about Vista not performing and the whole legacy software thing, not to mention UAC and suddenly, within two years, they introduce the next thing that is Win7 and you have to pay for it all over again! And 7 is only slightly different from Vista in that it works a bit sleeker and looks a tiny bit different.

It's so blatantly obvious it's screaming and I don't see anyone bitching about it!

Correction I found one!
http://www.examiner.com/x-15082-Denver- ... hat-a-scam
 
Avid has turned into the worst company in the universe. The support guys do what they can, but management..... They have the worst attitude towards customers, they are money grubbing bast@rd$, they would throw their mothers under the bus to make a dollar, they are scum of the earth. My hate for Avid has been building for over 10 years of dealing with them. I have seen them put a good friend of mine out of business by demanding he purchase a $200,000 editing system as a demo to keep his dealership status.. Then, less than a week later, they announce a new product at NAB that puts the value of the demo system he just bought at $15,000. Nothing comes from Avid for free. Lol, "Its the Law"?!?! They are liars.
 
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