Asking for your TRUTH

I agree with all of these posts. I played the axe through a matrix gt800fx and nice evm thiele cab. That ev speaker has enough hi end to play with cab blocks or without (to my ears anyway). It sounds good either way and will flap your pant legs too! Just be sure to turn it up. I also used a pair of Xitone cabs for a bit that were even better FRFR, now I use CLR, which are stellar. Just use an amp and a cab. Turn off all the effects and turn off the input gate. You need to play it a little loud too. It always sounds better if you turn it up.
 
Like others have said and just to reitterate, if you want to push air with the axe, you need to play it through speakers that can push air. To be totally honest, I was pretty disappointed when if first got mine. I sold a Bogner XTC to pay for it and my Krk 5s just weren't doing it for me at all. Fast forward a bit and add an Atomic CLR to the mix and my patches get singing harmonics, push air like a 412 and shake the walls on chugs. The magic that was missing for me was the physical experience of an amp. Once I changed the medium that I was getting my sound through, everything clicked and I get a big stupid grin on my face every time I fire it up and play my first chord.
 
Yzaviv said:
but that 5% was missing, especially for a guy like me who plays at home and want to feel "amp in the room" .

I really really really like NOT to sell my axe II , but I would like you guys to help me, especially those of you that have the experience with real tube amp , and I love to hear your TRUTH about this and help me decided which way to go . Thanks.
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I have a lot of experience towards real amps (since they're a part of my daytime job for the last 15 yrs). My "TRUTH" (if there is any needed*) is simple - I found my tone inside the Axefx II. So what? I came to the point were I don't care about % in tone, it feel real, it sounds real, it inspires me to play more music, yeah...it's challenging me constantly - like any good amp would do. And I can say that even to my long term customers which trust me for years and all the other amp geeks, builders, engineers etc. I met..... ;)

*: It's all about what you do with the stuff....music is most important (if there need to be a "TRUTH")
 
The truth is, the unit is FAR from plug and play. If you give it enough of your time and patients it will come around. It's just unfortunate that for the most part in a live situation you have/need to buy extra gear to make it sound really great! As a recording device it is hard to beat as is.
 
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MaxTwang said:
The feel is there in the Axe but FRFR/headphones might sound/feel funny when you're used to a guitar cab.
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Yes this! I was used to play my Axe fx/Matrix GT1000 going to two mesa Thiele cabs for gigs and rehearsals. Was quit happy with my sound so far. But last rehearsal I decided to leave my cabs at home and play with my Axe fx over the PA system of the rehearsal room. I was really uncomfortable and disappointed with my sound. So next time I will bring my cabs again.

At home I like my sound when going directly to my studio monitors but for gigs and rehearsals I don't like the direct sound.
 
Satch4u3 said:
The truth is, the unit is FAR from plug and play. If you give it enough of your time and patients it will come around. It's just unfortunate that for the most part in a live situation you have/need to buy extra gear to make it sound really great!

that's a Little Far from the truth. When thinking about the additional Gear You Need, to make your Tube Amp work...like A speaker Cab, Microphone(s) Fx-Units, a Tuner, spare Parts for your beloved Tube Amp, (which can be Alone more expensive then your whole Axe-Rig, including a fat FRFR or similar...) Stompboxes, Switcher, Looper.....etc....

My whole Live-Rig ,including the Axe, Active Monitor, Floorboard and Guitar suits on One small Trolley and it's weight is similar to One 4x12 Cab without Amp and it's needed additional Gear....sorry...I forget the Guitar picks, iI Need thousands of them live....ok, that's additional 2 kg....:)
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TheGoatLord said:
In the room vs close mic. It took me a while to get used to hearing my guitar through a close micd IR but once it clicked,
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why?

You are basically telling the OP that he should get used to a representation of a representation of his guitar tone.


1. IR (which is a representation of a cab)
2. Fed through a monitor (output of which is a representation of a cab being miked)

If you like and enjoy the "in-room" experience Why not cut to the chase and play through a real cab with an amp driving it?

for recording and large stages (PA) I can see it, but for home or small stages I don't see why a person should have to "get used to" and accept something different than what sounds and feels best to them.
 
For the OP, I think power amp -> guitar cab or using the fx loop return of Mesa is the way to go, guitar -> AxeFx II -> Mesa fx loop return.

The AxeFx sounds killer this way!

I use my studio monitors and CLR's too and love the AxeFx like this.

I personally hesitate to recommend more tweaks or different monitors and all that to someone who is already frustrated trying IR's and FRFR.

Turn off the cab block. Plug in. And have some fun!!!

You can always come back to IR's and FRFR later after you have some joy under your belt.
 
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Satch4u3 said:
The truth is, the unit is FAR from plug and play. If you give it enough of your time and patients it will come around. It's just unfortunate that for the most part in a live situation you have/need to buy extra gear to make it sound really great!
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I have to disagree with you on this.. I honestly think it depends on ones needs and objectives. While it may be true for you, it's not for me.
For some time, I've gigged with Factory presets only and done that with Beta firmware releases too, sometime loading up the firmware just hours ahead of a gig. Some of those Factory presets have been tweaked a little (drive,level), but most are stock. I play thru an Atomic amp (via OUT2) for stage monitoring and run OUT1 to FOH. Put a little in my stage wedge and voila!
Works fine in my "variety" cover band that plays from ABBA (not really) to ZZ Top.
 
funkstation777 said:
Satch4u3 said:
The truth is, the unit is FAR from plug and play. If you give it enough of your time and patients it will come around. It's just unfortunate that for the most part in a live situation you have/need to buy extra gear to make it sound really great!

that's a Little Far from the truth. When thinking about the additional Gear You Need, to make your Tube Amp work...like A speaker Cab, Microphone(s) Fx-Units, a Tuner, spare Parts for your beloved Tube Amp, (which can be Alone more expensive then your whole Axe-Rig, including a fat FRFR or similar...) Stompboxes, Switcher, Looper.....etc....

My whole Live-Rig ,including the Axe, Active Monitor, Floorboard and Guitar suits on One small Trolley and it's weight is similar to One 4x12 Cab without Amp and it's needed additional Gear....sorry...I forget the Guitar picks, iI Need thousands of them live....ok, that's additional 2 kg....:)
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Can't forget the pics! :) By the time you have what you need to get that great in the room feel of using a speaker and power amp, it's almost $4000. Obviosuly that number varies slightly but most people are not spending that on an amp.

Don't get me wrong, I love my axe fx 2 but it definetly has its hard pros and cons. Just depends on how much patients and funds you have. :)
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Yzaviv said:
So you probably ran into this topic a million time before, but for god sake I had to try and ask this one for my self and for the other guys feeling the same. When I first heard about the axe i could wait for day that I will have it, the thought I can own those bunch of amps and cabs in a single black box , I will pay what it takes to have it all in one.

Well guess what, I did it, bought it, and now I'm in the process of struggling to sound like my mesa boogie mark v. Well I found my self sitting for a few days not playing but tweaking again and again . After I got some nice tones that I liked, I switched over to my mark v and suddenly it fet much more right , true, rich and fully tone. Again I was so disappointed after all the time I invested in tweaking the axe, it's all wrong again.

Now I know some of you will say, hey that's not the point to see if the axe can sound like your amp, the point is it can sound much better, well first I respect any opinion you guys say, but before we talk in terms of the next level of my amp tone , let's talk about THE level of my amp tone.

I have to say I watched some videos on YouTube that compare the axe to real amp, I found most of the videos if not all come close to the tone at almost 95%, but that 5% was missing, especially for a guy like me who plays at home and want to feel "amp in the room" .

I really really really like NOT to sell my axe II , but I would like you guys to help me, especially those of you that have the experience with real tube amp , and I love to hear your TRUTH about this and help me decided which way to go . Thanks.
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In May 2012, floydian80 created a bank of Tone Match patches of all the the channels, modes in his Mark V. Not sure how these would translate in V. 12, but certainly at the time, they sounded very close to my Mark V. Worth a try, here is the link to the thread:

http://forum.fractalaudio.com/axe-fx-ii-tone-match/52546-mark-v-amp-match-all-channels-modes.html

and a link to his bank file:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1701683/Mark V.syx
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The crux of the problem is that most people have never heard a mic'd guitar amp in isolation and it's quite a shock when you first do.

I challenge anybody to go to the studio with me, mic up an amp in isolation and then A/B that with the Axe-Fx and tell me which is which. We consistently fool producers and engineers and when they do hear a difference it's usually "the Axe-Fx sounds better".
 
And, what can and does happen when a guy attempts to do this test himself, is, he tries to put the cab in another room and insulate it, but he's still in his house or apartment and he can hear and feel the little bass chug when he plays, or even when he palm mutes the strings at the end of the phrase. And that is not TOTAL isolation. It's still giving you that cabinet feedback/response. Sort of like those devices that drummers attach to their thrones that vibrate when they play the kit if they are using in-ear monitors.

You have to completely isolate and sterilize your mesa cabinet and mic it, and then listen to the mic'd sound in a control room or in a mix. The Axe sounds like that sound.

Listening to the Axe through computer monitors or studio monitors, and then playing your amp through a 4x12, is not an A/B test of how closely the Axe impersonates an amp.
 
Satch4u3 said:
funkstation777 said:
Can't forget the pics! :) By the time you have what you need to get that great in the room feel of using a speaker and power amp, it's almost $4000. Obviosuly that number varies slightly but most people are not spending that on an amp.

. :)
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My current Active Monitor is a db Flexsys FM12 Coax Monitor (Price about 600 $) the Price for my Last Real Tube Amp, a Marshall 6100 Anniversary,including a 1960 4x12 Guitar Cab, Morley Bad Horsie, Sennheiser Mic, and a Rocktron FX-Unit, a Korg Tuner including Rack , exceeded the Price of my current Setup for more than a few Bucks....

But if your'e into Basic like a small Combo, a lil' Tube screamer+ Crybaby (which isn't Bad at all!) You're right, then the Axe would be Overkill ...
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s0c9 said:
I have to disagree with you on this.. I honestly think it depends on ones needs and objectives. While it may be true for you, it's not for me.
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Agree with you 100%. I went into it with no preconceived notions or that "this thing HAS to sound like x amp". I just wanted to get the sound in my head to my ears through my guitar. The Axe FX II has done that for me in spades. Mostly just with what I get from the Axe Exchange and very slight tweaking on my part. Mostly treble, mid and bass and adding effects from other presets I prefer (like delay, chorus from other factory and user created presets). I run my sound through an active XiTone 1x12 wedge and am amazed every time I power everything up. KISS principle works for me BIG TIME.
 
FractalAudio said:
The crux of the problem is that most people have never heard a mic'd guitar amp in isolation and it's quite a shock when you first do.

I challenge anybody to go to the studio with me, mic up an amp in isolation and then A/B that with the Axe-Fx and tell me which is which. We consistently fool producers and engineers and when they do hear a difference it's usually "the Axe-Fx sounds better".
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I totally agree.
The sound of a mic'd up cab and a well recorded IR of that same signal path are indistinguishable.

If only some technology existed to successfully duplicate the "amp-in-the-room" sound and feel (especially that of an open-back cab) into a typical hi-end FRFR monitoring system the last modelling challenge will have been met. IMO.

I know folks are going to jump in here and start talking up far-field IRs, but in my experience, thus far anyway, they always fall way short of the mark.

PS
I have not read this thread.
I'm only responding to Cliff's quoted comment above.
If my comments are OT I apologize.
 
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