Noise Gate needs upgrade

6

60mm

Member
When I switched from my tube amp I got rid of my ISP Decimator as well thinking the FX Ultra would handle that job just as good and was really disappointed. I'm not saying it's bad at all, in fact it's good. But it's definitely no Decimator. It would be really nice to see an improved noise gate, perhaps modeled after the way the Decimator works, anyone that owns or has owned a Decimator can tell you that thing is the bottom line for noise reduction. I'm saving for another Decimator myself, but I would love to have something that competes with it in my Ultra. I'm sure a lot of the people here who don't live on extreme gain don't have any complaints with the noise gate but I can't be the only one who thinks it could be vastly improved.
 
Are you using the Ultra's Gate block or the one on the layout? There could be an important difference.

I'm not knowledgable on it, but from a quote:

- Radley, 4/2009: These settings work well for me (UltraFX) for hi gain stuff: Threshold around -60db / 1.70 Ratio / 1000ms Release (no weirdness during fadeout).
>> javajunkie: The Ultra has the fully fledged noise gate w/ side chain ability (like Decimator). If you didn't know, there is a global noise gate. If you are using the Ultra's or don't want it engaged, go to the layout menu, you will see it there.

- javajunkie, 6/2009: If you have an Ultra, you can do an ISP Decimator gate. That is what the SC [sidechain] select is for. / Place the gate after the amp block. on a blank row run shunts from the input until one block before the gate. connect the shunt to the gate. Set the SC select of the gate to the shunt row. Set you gate parameters as normal. Using this method the gate detection occurs at the input but it applied after the amp. You can really lower the threshold this way but still get strong gating going on. It is the same concept the ISP descimator uses. Another thing you can do to fine tune the gate is set the hipass and lowpass filter on the gate. This lets you fine tune the type of noise (hi-freq, lo-freq) that will trigger the gate. This applies to the compressor as well.
>> Fikealox: It works perfectly. Much better than global gate [is not global], and much better than the Decimator G-string I used to own. I honestly don't know how what more anyone could want from a noise gate.
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I have the Axe Standard and the ISP Decimator. Decimator is, without a doubt, the best noise reduction in pedal format, but the noise gate from Axe works incredibly well. I just adjust the threshold, and that's it. Never had a problem with sustain, but I must say I don't use extreme high gain.
 
Hey 60mm - can you post back your findings. I also have a ISP decimator G String that I was running before my Fractal that I have come to loooove. However, would love to know if this will work on the Fractal. (I actually sold my fractal yesterday - haha) - we all know why, so now I can't test the gate side-chain.

I am working through what my rack is going to look like with the Shiny new Axe FX II in it and if I need to leave a space for the DECIMATOR!!!!!

Keep in mind there is 2 versions of the Decimator (1 is the G String, 1 is not). The G string has the loop on it (4 1/4" connectors) that is pure magic. My friend had a normal Decimator and although it's good, it doesn't compare to the Decimator G String. So, if the fractal can do a similar noise reduction to the G String with that side chain, that would be incredible!

Thanks in advance.
 
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Recently Javajunkie added that the sidechained-gate should go BEFORE the amp block. That's different fromt the quote above.
 
yek said:
Recently Javajunkie added that the sidechained-gate should go BEFORE the amp block. That's different fromt the quote above.
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When the search gets rocking again, I'll try to find the post where cliff states because the amp block makes no self noise it can be placed before the amp block and remain quiet. There was a reason he said it was a little better that way. I forget why. But you really do want the gate being triggered from the input. You can keep settings much lower with the same effect that way. It is why the decimator does that.

What the axe-fx gate doesn't have is the dynamically controlled low-pass filtering that the prorack-g has (stops pickup squeeling and such). I tried to mimic that part and didn't do so well.

there should be no reason you can't emulate the pedal version with the gate block.
 
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javajunkie said:
What the axe-fx gate doesn't have is the dynamically controlled low-pass filtering that the prorack-g has (stops pickup squeeling and such). I tried to mimic that part and didn't do so well.
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That's what i want, it's no fault of the axe just my noisy house but i am sure it would be useful for gigging muso's that play in clubs with sub par wiring.
It would be a huge plus for me.
 
I gonna try out the gate before the amp style today, but I use mainly high gain amps and I find the stock gate works really well, and I used to own a isp prorack g for years. But I just use the axe now and I don't get any feedbacking or hiss, I do use emg pups that probably helps.

send from Droid
 
Tried the gate before the amp and it worked but gave my sound kinda a slight nasaly sound not as sharp. Oh well I just use the built it gate it works for me

send from Droid
 
kevrock said:
Tried the gate before the amp and it worked but gave my sound kinda a slight nasaly sound not as sharp. Oh well I just use the built it gate it works for me

send from Droid
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If it is altering the tone you have something set wrong.
 
javajunkie said:
If it is altering the tone you have something set wrong.
Click to expand...

I just put the gate/expander right under my drive pedal and shunted it from the input and then up to the amp block and set the sidechain to input 1 and turned the threshold down

send from Droid
 
kevrock said:
I just put the gate/expander right under my drive pedal and shunted it from the input and then up to the amp block and set the sidechain to input 1 and turned the threshold down

send from Droid
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You can't put it in parallel!!!!!
 
Parallel will blend (gated) clean signal with drive sound at the amp input. The gate has to actually be in the path you want to gate--move blocks to make room if there isn't already a shunt where you want to use it.
 
Ok I will try it that way thanks so it should be the first thing in the chain correct

send from Droid
 
Ok, so I tested out the sidechain tip and it's definitely better but still no Decimator G and for one reason. Pup squealing, which has been my number one enemy with the FX Ultra. I've got it now so that I only get quick peeps of squeal on staccato stuff but it's still there for sure unless I roll back my guitar's volume some but then my distortion softens up which I don't like.

Here's the settings I found that work best for me right now. Keep in mind I use a "Das Metall" and an "Energyball" in stereo, with the first having the bright switch on and my guitar has uses a Lundgren M8 so there is an abundance of gain going on.

Thresh -55.1db
Attack 2.48ms
Hold 23.45ms
Release 10ms
Ratio 2.99

It had to be a bit heavy handed to cut the squealing off to a reasonable length and I don't have problems with sustain because I already have so much gain. On the upside my threshold went from something like -48db to -55db with the sidechaining. I tried using the hi cut to help out but it softened up my sound too much, I like some hi frequency edge. It's better than before but it would still be nice to see an update someday that helped deal with pup squeals. If not, I'll just go back to the Decimator G sometime later this year.

Edit: Thought I'd mention that I use to use a 5150 with the Decimator G and my staccatos sounded like the amp was instantly turning on/off, it was crazy. Like you really couldn't tell the amp was on with the pre/post at 5/5. If I set up the FX Ulltra to basically the same as my old rig it cuts out all the noise nicely but the squeal comes marching in to stab my ears to death :-/
 
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What is the advantage of using a gate block rather than the in-built noise gate? They both seem to react pretty much the same (at least to my ears). Is this more for people who use super hi-gain patches? Do people tend to prefer one to the other?
 
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