Flattening the headrush curve

[johnnysix]

MARKED
I WILL TRY THIS.

 

[scottp]

Today I spent some time in the studio listening to some CD's through the HR108.
Neal Morse Band (Fractal) Night Ranger, Rush, Focus at 90db.
Turning On/Off the EQ Flattening curve. Wow what a difference! With it Active it is quite harsh!
I ended up dialing in my own EQ curve to try.
I know there are HR haters, but I don't care.
Like someone said in another thread,
by the time you are on stage standing next to a drummer who is pounding the crap out of them...
The experiment continues.

 

[scottp]

It’s like the old adage, “a chain is no stronger than its weakest link.” As long as people go into the purchase with their eyes wide open then it’s fine, they know what they’re getting.

“Caveat emptor” applies to those who don’t know anything about FRFRs, or sound reinforcement or acoustics, who have no idea what it is they’re buying (or possibly no idea what they’re doing). There’s a huge amount of snake oil and marketing-speak full of glittering language and people shilling about this and that in the music industry, and musicians, especially young or new musicians, believe the malarkey that the next purchase will make them be better than they were, that it’s the key to “that sound”, or a magic bullet. That seems to be human nature.

The virus drove people to re-examine their dreams and goals because they were forced indoors and into their basements and bedrooms. Modelers were a great solution for the need to be able to make the sounds that they wanted without the fear of waking the entire neighborhood at 3 AM. The technology is new in comparison with regular ol’ amps so people are still scrambling to try to figure out how it works. The touring and recording pros have already figured it out but their knowledge is too esoteric for the neophytes who just want to make noise, and the costs of the gear shock them. They want the best but shoot their wad on the modeler, instead of spreading it across all the parts of the system to make a consistently strong chain.

@Greg Ferguson and @Andy Eagle What would be your recommendation for a small FRFR, about the same size of the HR108, to be used as a floor monitor in a band situation? Thank you.

 

[Axelman8]

Today I spent some time in the studio listening to some CD's through the HR108.
Neal Morse Band (Fractal) Night Ranger, Rush, Focus at 90db.
Turning On/Off the EQ Flattening curve. Wow what a difference! With it Active it is quite harsh!
I ended up dialing in my own EQ curve to try.
I know there are HR haters, but I don't care.
Like someone said in another thread,
by the time you are on stage standing next to a drummer who is pounding the crap out of them...
The experiment continues.

Hey there

Sometimes (on some presets, usually Fremen presets) my experience is that the EQ curve is quite hars too, but then with my guitar sound, not audio. If you will/can/bother to do, would you share your settings? I also tinkered with the EQ settings, but always end up hating what I created, so restored everytime to the WKSmith settings.

Cheers

 

[Greg Ferguson]

@Greg Ferguson and @Andy Eagle What would be your recommendation for a small FRFR, about the same size of the HR108, to be used as a floor monitor in a band situation? Thank you.

I use, and really like, the EV PXM-12MP, which is a true floor monitor but can be positioned on its sides for varying angles or to fire straight ahead.

The REDSOUND ELIS.8 are small and sound really good and I needed no EQ changes with them. The only problem I had with the ELIS.8 is they're designed to act more as a backline, not as a monitor. I replaced them with the EVs.

I'd also look at the QSC CP8 or K8.2 or maybe the K10.2. I haven't heard them in person, but a friend has a pair of the K12.2 and they sound very good so I'd expect the same from the other QSC.

The REDSOUND cabinets are made in Italy, so they're harder to find over here, though Lyon & Healy are a distributor now, and searching for "redsound" turns up dealers in the U.S., G66 handles them in the EU, or maybe it's only the UK. The EV and QSC cabinets are much easier to find in the U.S.

 

[Andy Eagle]

@Greg Ferguson and @Andy Eagle What would be your recommendation for a small FRFR, about the same size of the HR108, to be used as a floor monitor in a band situation? Thank you.

That's difficult as I have not come across anything this size that I could be happy with.
I would explore mid priced vocal monitors.
I personally prefer a passive wedge monitor ( I use a Xitone passive with F12 X200 speaker) and a good power amp because the class D power in the typical unit is far from a good guitar tone "feel" to play through. I hate the detachment of a monitor that sounds like a backing track .

 

[corsara]

This is about the Headrush FRFR-112. I've been using tube amps for a while, decided to step into the modelling world and got my Fractal FM3 just the other day. Figured I'd use the 2 x Headrush FRFR-112 that I already have. Very underwhelming, to say the least.. Then I found this thread and I actually read all 11 pages. Didn't have much hope when I repeatedly read the 112 is much different than 108, but decided to try it anyway. WOW! This Fractal FM3 came to life! Even the stock presets sound good now! I can't thank @WKSmith enough for this post! Who knows, maybe the 112 needs different EQ to make it sound even better, but 108 settings definitely made a huge difference for my 112s!

 

[WKSmith]

This is about the Headrush FRFR-112. I've been using tube amps for a while, decided to step into the modelling world and got my Fractal FM3 just the other day. Figured I'd use the 2 x Headrush FRFR-112 that I already have. Very underwhelming, to say the least.. Then I found this thread and I actually read all 11 pages. Didn't have much hope when I repeatedly read the 112 is much different than 108, but decided to try it anyway. WOW! This Fractal FM3 came to life! Even the stock presets sound good now! I can't thank @WKSmith enough for this post! Who knows, maybe the 112 needs different EQ to make it sound even better, but 108 settings definitely made a huge difference for my 112s!

The 108 sounds pretty dang good with this eq curve, and with a cranked up 108 volume. They sound much better loud.

 

[Fizz]

This is about the Headrush FRFR-112. I've been using tube amps for a while, decided to step into the modelling world and got my Fractal FM3 just the other day. Figured I'd use the 2 x Headrush FRFR-112 that I already have. Very underwhelming, to say the least.. Then I found this thread and I actually read all 11 pages. Didn't have much hope when I repeatedly read the 112 is much different than 108, but decided to try it anyway. WOW! This Fractal FM3 came to life! Even the stock presets sound good now! I can't thank @WKSmith enough for this post! Who knows, maybe the 112 needs different EQ to make it sound even better, but 108 settings definitely made a huge difference for my 112s!

Good to hear.. I've yet to try this with my 112.

 

[Jtroop]

I too want to thank @WKSmith for sharing this EQ curve. It sounds so much better now. I was planning on getting more expensive FRFRs but now I think I'm going to get another HR108 to go in stereo, it sounds that good.

 

[WKSmith]

I too want to thank @WKSmith for sharing this EQ curve. It sounds so much better now. I was planning on getting more expensive FRFRs but now I think I'm going to get another HR108 to go in stereo, it sounds that good.

You are most welcome!

 

[Sully0556]

So I'm expecting my FM9 next week sometime, I don't want to waste steps so I'm assuming I should "flatten the curve" for my 2 108's before doing anything else?

 

[WKSmith]

So I'm expecting my FM9 next week sometime, I don't want to waste steps so I'm assuming I should "flatten the curve" for my 2 108's before doing anything else?

Definitely ..if you are using the 108s to monitor with while you create or edit presets.

 

[Sully0556]

Definitely ..if you are using the 108s to monitor with while you create or edit presets.

Thanks! I hate to waste time and this will save me.

 

[corsara]

Couple of weeks ago I wrote that I applied the global EQ suggested here to my 2 x headrush frfr112, and was happy with the result. Well, curiosity never ends plus the fact the 108 is much smaller to carry, so I bought 2 x headrush frfr108 a few days ago, with the intention to potentially sell the 112. Gotta say, the two 108 most definitely sound better than the 112 with the EQ applied! YMMV, but this is where I'm at - keeping the 108s. Already sold one of the 112, and the other one I'll just keep for playing backing tracks and drum lines at home when practicing.

 

[Sully0556]

Definitely ..if you are using the 108s to monitor with while you create or edit presets.

Are people using the same "curve" for the FOH send also? My IEM's will come back from the FOH send so I'm not sure if I should set the EQ flat for FOH or EQ it for my IEM's and let the FOH deal with what they get..

 

[WKSmith]

Are people using the same "curve" for the FOH send also? My IEM's will come back from the FOH send so I'm not sure if I should set the EQ flat for FOH or EQ it for my IEM's and let the FOH deal with what they get..

No ... leave FOH flat. The eq curve is just for the out going to the headrush 108s

 

[Greg Ferguson]

Are people using the same "curve" for the FOH send also?

Never send an EQ'd sound to FOH; The odds are good they'd have to unravel your EQ changes to get the sound where they need it. Their needs are different than IEMs or FRFR or amp->cab.

Consider using something like this in your layout…

or

or even


Those are from my FM9, but you can do something similar with the FM3 or FX3. The advantage is each Out block then gets its own feed directly from the Reverb block, and each can be EQd separately so Out 1 can go to FOH, Out 2 can go to your backline or IEM feed, and, Out 3 if you have it, can go to whatever.

You can't do the same thing using the global "Copy … 1 to" functionality because Out 3 on the FM9, and Out 3 and 4 on the FX3, can only get their input from "Input 1".




The FM3, oddly enough, can copy Input 1 or Output 1 to Out 2. I'd like to see that changed for the other two units as it'd be useful flexibility.

 

[Sully0556]

Never send an EQ'd sound to FOH; The odds are good they'd have to unravel your EQ changes to get the sound where they need it. Their needs are different than IEMs or FRFR or amp->cab.

Consider using something like this in your layout…
View attachment 115852
That's from my FM9, but you can do something similar with the FM3 or FX3. The advantage is each Out block then gets its own feed directly from the Reverb block, and each can be EQd separately so Out 1 can go to FOH, Out 2 can go to your backline or IEM feed, and, Out 3 if you have it, can go to whatever.

You can't do the same thing using the global "Copy … 1 to" functionality because Out 3 on the FM9, and Out 3 and 4 on the FX3, can only get their input from "Input 1".

View attachment 115854
View attachment 115858

Thanks for the info! We run a X32 system so my FOH line also runs my IEM's. We always have our own FOH guy running us on any system but I get the reason for sending him a flat EQ and I'll definitely do that. I can EQ my individual guitar in my own monitor mix if needed. You guys are a ton of help and I really appreciate it! I'll be leaning on you all hard for a few weeks to tweak everything before I start gigging with it.

 

[WKSmith]

Thanks for the info! We run a X32 system so my FOH line also runs my IEM's. We always have our own FOH guy running us on any system but I get the reason for sending him a flat EQ and I'll definitely do that. I can EQ my individual guitar in my own monitor mix if needed. You guys are a ton of help and I really appreciate it! I'll be leaning on you all hard for a few weeks to tweak everything before I start gigging with it.

I find that if I send FOH a great tone, with the subs highpassed out and no harsh highs or mids... they are less likely to eq my core tone.

Without fail if they have to highpass the lows any more than pushing a button , they will grab some other eq bands while they are in there and there it will stay all night.

I love it when they compliment the Fractal tech ..and remark that they didn't have to touch anything but gain for it to sound awesome.