Yikes! We switched to in-ears, and my FM9 sound is horrible...

iamdave

iamdave

Member
My $1500 pedal sounds worse than a $49 pedal. Holy smokes. Tons of fiz, no tone at all. Like a horrible phone call. What tips might you give me?

I'm using a nice quality Audio-Technica ATW-3255 in-ear system with their in-ears. Dual drivers. The keyboard (Yamaha CK88 sounds like butt also. Same thing, a cheap, bad phone call.
 
If this is your first time using in-ears, I would wager you are just not used to how things sound being blasted directly into your ear holes vs the sound in the room coming out of a speaker.

There are a lot of variables but it's amazing how much a difference the buds themselves can make, not to mention the way you perceive sounds in different contexts.

Some degree of compromise is necessary at first while you adjust to how things sound going "direct". You might find you adjust your presets differently and that's not a bad thing
 
iamdave said:
My $1500 pedal sounds worse than a $49 pedal. Holy smokes. Tons of fiz, no tone at all. Like a horrible phone call. What tips might you give me?

I'm using a nice quality Audio-Technica ATW-3255 in-ear system with their in-ears. Dual drivers. The keyboard (Yamaha CK88 sounds like butt also. Same thing, a cheap, bad phone call.
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This sounds like you don’t have a good fit. Without a solid air seal there’s no bass response. Make sure they’re pushed in sufficiently to seal outside sound out, and retain the bass.
 
Comply foam tips are great. I'm not sure which model AT iem wireless my Bass player had, but it sounded very bad compared to my Sennheiser. Due to an issue at a gig he tried mine and stopped using his AT. Unfortunately, every IEM (not system) sounds different. It might take some trial and error to find one you like.
 
  1. Do the IEMs sound ok when plugged into the FM9’s headphone out?
  2. Are you running the IEMs stereo i.e. stereo aux sends from the mixer into your IEM transmitter?
  3. Is the receiver set to stereo and flat EQ?
  4. Do you have the two FM9 channels and the two keyboard channels both hard panned on the mixer? i.e. a ping pong delay should bounce back and forth just like when the IEMs are connected directly to the FM9.
 
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Give it a little time, once you know you've created good tones it will be better. And like mentioned previously, you have to get as close of a seal as you can get in your ears. I started with Shure 425's. I used the large foam ear pieces to get a descent seal but low end drums and bass were underwhelming. But I could hear everything better. I also added a Friedman FRFR cab behind me to move some air and compliment the low end of my sound. I spent a lot of time adjusting my sounds on my monitors. Then I would check them with headphones. Give it a day, so your ears can reset. Then go back and see how you're doing. Also make sure you adjust your output levels the same too. It also helps to use the same IR if possible from amp patch to amp patch that you intend to use at the same show. I would finally EQ my Friedman ASC12 FRFR with the output EQ of out 2 on the Fractal, to make it sound more amp like without adjusting the tone to my ears or FOH. I would switch from Monitors, to FRFR, to headphones slowly eq'ing the cab. Then finally my in ears were just the way they were, because I knew I had good consistent tones from good sources. My ears never sounded like I could use just the IEM's and be comfortable, they were really a compromise, but it lowered the stage volume and give me the clarity to sing and hear my guitar. So my cab ended up helping the most. All that being said, about a year ago I upgraded to the Shure SE846 IEM's and they are absolutely fantastic. After 8 years of the 425's I wish I would have done it sooner. Everything is better, Vocals are fuller, cleaner on top, drums sound great, you can hear bass in your ears. Obviously all of the mid world of guitar sounds great. I feel spoiled now. And I do not need my cab on stage, but I still bring it, the IEM's are so much more fuller, I don't feel uncomfortable in any way. And as the show goes on and people pour in, the house system gets louder and the ambience just adds to it and the ears are the perfect clarity. Hope this helps. Good luck! Don't give up, your ears will thank you once you get it dialed in.
 
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When switching to InEars i made the same experience: I thought that 500,- InEars would at least sound as good as 150,- overear headphones - and that's a total illusion:)
Espacially overdriven guitar sounds are really complex and they sound as playing without cab sim if you don't have good and the right amount of drivers in the InEars.
My experience was that you have to spend at least 800-1000,- for the Headphones alone to get a sound that brings you at least close to what you would hear out of decent studio monitors.
This for example is a nice non-fitted one with 4 drivers, that sounds okay-ish with guitar: https://www.thomann.de/de/inear_stagediver_sd_4.htm
 
Is the objective a silent stage, a quiet(er) stage or merely to eliminate wedges?

And is the drummer doing his bit by going e-drums?

I conceded from start that IEMs weren't going to produce speaker-like tones or ambience. Can I do a gig with no backline? Yes. Do I choose that option when given a choice? No.

Our compromise was a FRFR at a reduced volume but audible alongside the IEM mix. No ear seal is going to be perfect and/or last the evening without lots of twisting and turning during and between songs. So the liability of the earphones becomes a strength of sorts ie I can hear the speaker also but it's not at volume-wars level.
 
I tested maybe 10 cheapish in ears and hated every single one of them.
Customer eq curves (cutting a lot in the 1-2k 4k range helps with the harshness)
Them I order custom molded 64 audio A6T.
Now my guitar sounds exactly like it should.
Every single instrument sounds awesome.
 
iamdave said:
My $1500 pedal sounds worse than a $49 pedal. Holy smokes. Tons of fiz, no tone at all. Like a horrible phone call. What tips might you give me?

I'm using a nice quality Audio-Technica ATW-3255 in-ear system with their in-ears. Dual drivers. The keyboard (Yamaha CK88 sounds like butt also. Same thing, a cheap, bad phone call.
Click to expand...
The best real amp guitar rig in the world mic'd with the best mics in the world handled by the best sound engineer will sound like crap through basic entry level dual driver in-ear pieces. You might not like this answer but you will need high quality custom molded ear pieces, quad driver minimum.
 
I don't think it's about the quantity of drivers. It's about the quality.
Well design 2 drivers IEM systems sound massively better than the cheap ones flying around with 10 different drivers.
Drums and bass can sound ok.
But top mid heavy instruments like guitar will absolutely expose bad quality IEMs.
I really can't emphasize enough the difference I felt between, maybe 10 or so <100$ IEM and 64 audio stuff
 
its a rabbit hole chasing what will make it sound better. But id start with plugging your in ears directly into your fm9 and seeing if that sounds good or better. If it does, then somewhere along the line to you is giving you EQ changes (mixer most likely). For me...i have alot of carving to the IEM eq to my ears to make it feel more appealing. I also prefer a stronger hi cut in my ears than i send out front.
 
@iamdave You don't have to have 100 driver custom molds (no matter what anyone on this thread tells you). Muse who you can make any number of statements about from a musical point of view, but we can all agree they have some money and can afford nice gear, use Westone generic fit - it's not sound advice to just throw money at the problem and hope it changes.

Simple step, plug your ear buds you are using into the headphone out of a computer or your phone and listen to music on it. Does it sound bad, if so figure out if it is how you have them in your ears or the buds themselves. If you want to replace them with something very servicable and not crazy expensive or custom go to Amazon and order something like the KZ AS10s, you may want to eq the buds themselves a bit, but I know plenty of semi-pro musicians gigging with these and they are significantly better than anything that will come with the systems.

When you are happy with IEMs in general and make the committment to stick with using them, custom molds often make sense. Even something lower end in the custom arena like JH Audio or Ultimate ears 3 driver systems are pretty damn good (I've used both in professional settings and know many many pros using them who prefer the lower driver count). More drivers doesn't automatically mean better, although it can. I have 12 driver JH units and surprisingly I don't really like them any more than my 3 and 4 driver units.
 
sprada said:
I don't think it's about the quantity of drivers. It's about the quality.
Well design 2 drivers IEM systems sound massively better than the cheap ones flying around with 10 different drivers.
Drums and bass can sound ok.
But top mid heavy instruments like guitar will absolutely expose bad quality IEMs.
I really can't emphasize enough the difference I felt between, maybe 10 or so <100$ IEM and 64 audio stuff
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Imho, you need both good quality and more drivers. I agree with high end, pro quality dual drivers will sound better than entry level cheap in-ear pieces no matter how many drivers, but will a high quality in-ear piece be enough for you? I might be, it might not...

It's a hard fact/realization to face when you switch to in-ears. Spending big money in in-ears system, then spending more big money in high quality, custom molded ear pieces to go with is not as fun as spending that money on a guitar.
 
I used some in ears for a while that never sounded good to me, way too much treble and no low end. On top of that when I was singing they would just work their way out of my ears and sound worse as a song progressed. One day I swapped the standard rubber tips for some foam ones and just like that it was a totally different experience, great tone, really balanced sounding and stayed in when I was doing vocals as well. A good fit goes a long way!
 
Try the in ears directly to the FM9 or an audio interface and try the FM9 signal. Then try it with the transmitter and see if it's different.

I always try all my sounds with the shure se215 I use on stage before using them with the transmitter. To fine tune the FOH signal I use proper overear headphones.
 
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