Volume Boost and Tone Changing

J

Jipps0525

Power User
I typically use a 5dB volume boost for my solos and lead stuff when playing live or
Practicing. I think I’ve begun to notice some tonal changes that occur when I hit that volume boost. I perceive these as negative. More so when I practice at lower volumes. Is this just the fletcher munson curve in play here and highlighting the negative frequencies that weren’t so obvious with 5dB less of volume? Would a 2.5dB boost + a PEQ be better for this?
 
elvis said:
Probably. 5dB is a LOT of boost, and likely indicates that you're not cutting through the mix. Setting a more mid-focused tone will help a lot. You should be able to be heard on a lead with no boost, and be way out front with 2-3dB boost.
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Thanks. For my last gig, I lowered my volume boost by almost half and used the PEQ block from the Yngwie Fury preset and added a couple dB to that and I think it was smoother overall
 
In my last band, I had a great tone, but couldn't cut through the mix regardless of boost, while the other guitarist was always audible. I learned a lot about having tone that is minimally compressed with lots of upper-mid content.
 
elvis said:
In my last band, I had a great tone, but couldn't cut through the mix regardless of boost, while the other guitarist was always audible. I learned a lot about having tone that is minimally compressed with lots of upper-mid content.
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Totally understand that but I’m the only guitarist in a 4 piece so I cut through fine. It’s more so a matter of when I hit my volume boost, instead of being louder and liking my tone more, I get louder and like it a little less which can affect my playing. It almost seems like it dulled out with the pure volume boost instead of becoming more alive lol.
 
Jipps0525 said:
Totally understand that but I’m the only guitarist in a 4 piece so I cut through fine. It’s more so a matter of when I hit my volume boost, instead of being louder and liking my tone more, I get louder and like it a little less which can affect my playing. It almost seems like it dulled out with the pure volume boost instead of becoming more alive lol.
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If you’re plying at gig volume, and a straight volume boost sounds duller, you’re probably clipping something.
 
Rex said:
If you’re plying at gig volume, and a straight volume boost sounds duller, you’re probably clipping something.
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That’s what I’m thinking. Is there any chance you’d be able to tell me what the PEQ is supposed to be doing on scene 4 of the YNGWIE Fury factory preset? Is it supposed to be the typical eq for cutting through with solos? Or is there something else going on there?
 
Jipps0525 said:
That’s what I’m thinking. Is there any chance you’d be able to tell me what the PEQ is supposed to be doing on scene 4 of the YNGWIE Fury factory preset? Is it supposed to be the typical eq for cutting through with solos? Or is there something else going on there?
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Don’t know. I haven’t dug into that preset, and won’t for the rest of the day. But “What is the EQ doing?” won’t answer the question “Is something clipping?”
 
Rex said:
Don’t know. I haven’t dug into that preset, and won’t for the rest of the day. But “What is the EQ doing?” won’t answer the question “Is something clipping?”
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I don’t think anything is clipping. My input meter is still in a good spot and nothing sounds overly harsh or unpleasant. Rather, the tone with volume boost just loses a bit of its edge. Is that still considered clipping?
 
Jipps0525 said:
I don’t think anything is clipping. My input meter is still in a good spot and nothing sounds overly harsh or unpleasant. Rather, the tone with volume boost just loses a bit of its edge. Is that still considered clipping?
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Can be. What are you monitoring with? What is the output level from the FM9 to that monitor?
 
Jipps0525 said:
I don’t think anything is clipping. My input meter is still in a good spot and nothing sounds overly harsh or unpleasant.
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The input is only one thing that could be clipping. There’s the output, the input to whatever you’re monitoring with, the output of whatever you’re monitoring with...

So, nothing overly harsh and unpleasant. Just slightly unpleasant? ;)
 
Rex said:
The input is only one thing that could be clipping. There’s the output, the input to whatever you’re monitoring with, the output of whatever you’re monitoring with...

So, nothing overly harsh and unpleasant. Just slightly unpleasant? ;)
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Yes just only slightly. And I wouldn’t even say unpleasant. It just loses a little something it had at the lower volume
 
elvis said:
Can be. What are you monitoring with? What is the output level from the FM9 to that monitor?
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DT770 headphones
Shure se535 iems
iLoud micro monitors
Band PA which I believe is QSC speakers for the PA. But I mostly hear this through my headphones when playing or iems
 
Jipps0525 said:
DT770 headphones
Shure se535 iems
iLoud micro monitors
Band PA which I believe is QSC speakers for the PA. But I mostly hear this through my headphones when playing or iems
Click to expand...
DT770 or IEM? How is the level? Any chance of clipping or loss of headroom?
 
5dB boost is a LOT of boost at home. I always practice with a backing track and I would find that unpleasant just being that much louder and that would certainly affect my playing. My solution has stayed the same for the last 10 years or so and that's attaching an expression knob to the lead volume boost. Currently I'm using one of these: https://elgaratge.com/product/expression-knob/. If you're using a PEQ as a lead volume boost, you'd attach the expression knob value to the level of the PEQ. I set the sweep of mine between 0 and 8dB boost which means that at 12 o'clock I'm at my starting level of 4dB boost. I've played with a few different bands and if the band plays softer I would turn the lead volume to about 2-3dB. One band I played had keys and another guitar player and in rehearsal I turned it up to about 5.5dB or so to get to a good level with the rest of the band. At home I turn it all the way off so no lead volume boost when I'm practicing. I find this solution works great for me and enables me to quickly match what the rest of the band is doing in different scenarios.
 
If you have delay or reverb in series with the signal and crank either (or both) for leads, you should also remember that you are lowering the dry signal, which would require additional boost to accommodate. These effects also take the edge off by comb-filtering the dry signal.
 
I typically do both with a Filter block after the Amp/Cab and before any Delays/Reverbs.

And a Drive block, or PEQ block, or Boost function in the Amp block engaged to boost the gain. The extra gain will typically add some more highs, fizz, 'hair'.

Post Cab Filter block.. Low Cut around 100Hz, High Cut 7 to 10 kHz (depending on the Cab block High Cut, IR, and Drive block settings and how much 'hair' is introduced), Peaking type with a 1 to 3 dB boost at 650 to 1200 Hz to taste, 'Level' set to 1.5 to 3 dB to taste, depending on how much mid boost is added.
 
My two cents……I agree with Moke above.…..but Jipps0525…..and maybe I missed it…..did you say how you are volume boosting? If you are boosting before or in the amp, then yes you will have a tone change. If you add a Filter block as the last block right before the output and set as a 2 to 3 db boost, then you won’t have a tone change.
(PS: I always lower and save all my presets at least 3 db lower than hitting the red in preset leveling so I won’t go into the red when I add the solo volume boost).
 
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Master of Nothing said:
My two cents……I agree with Moke above.…..but Jipps0525…..and maybe I missed it…..did you say how you are volume boosting? If you are boosting before or in the amp, then yes you will have a tone change. If you add a Filter block as the last block right before the output and set as a 2 to 3 db boost, then you won’t have a tone change.
(PS: I always lower and save all my presets at least 3 db lower than hitting the red in preset leveling so I won’t go into the red when I add the solo volume boost).
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You’re right my bad for not including. I just use a volume block after the cab set for a boost. On my latest preset, it worked much better with the Yngwie fury factory preset PEQ block and then just the post cab volume block but only around 2 or 3 dB. One thing I noticed was the Yngwie factory PEQ block was set for like -2dB. But I set it for +2dB for my new preset. Tbis was better. But I made this post because I was curious since I thought a volume boost would just be a pure volume boost, aside from any drives or eq or anything else
 
Moke said:
I typically do both with a Filter block after the Amp/Cab and before any Delays/Reverbs.

And a Drive block, or PEQ block, or Boost function in the Amp block engaged to boost the gain. The extra gain will typically add some more highs, fizz, 'hair'.

Post Cab Filter block.. Low Cut around 100Hz, High Cut 7 to 10 kHz (depending on the Cab block High Cut, IR, and Drive block settings and how much 'hair' is introduced), Peaking type with a 1 to 3 dB boost at 650 to 1200 Hz to taste, 'Level' set to 1.5 to 3 dB to taste, depending on how much mid boost is added.
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You use Both a filter and a PEQ? And you’re doing all above to increase volume AND cut through better for a solo or just to cut through better (which may give the aural appearance of being louder)?

Edit: Moke, are you offering this with your presets? https://mokeamerica.com/

😂😂😂🤣😎
 
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