Various presets & tricks

Of course ....

Damping = 109, is that correct? Seems a bit long.
 
It might be possible to lower it but you should check that there isn't any significant amount of fade-in left when the comp bypasses. It's easier to check with a synth into amp instead of holding a note/chord.

It takes about 2x the set damping time to reach the new value and it did need to stay on for around 200 ms on the Axe II. From the scene change it's something like 15 ms fade out, 30 ms gap, 150 ms fade-in.
 
I adjusted the Threshold to around -5 dB. Damping stayed at 109.
You can hear the fades clearly.
 

Attachments

  • AX8.wav.zip
    348.1 KB · Views: 27
Increase comp level by ~3.3 dB. That's the main thing that needs to be carefully matched after any adjustments, including amp level. Scene controller can also adjust level (use low damping value like 10 ms) if it's audibly wrong for one amp state when right for the other. I fixed the second bit as much as possible in DAW here.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/b4q5k6illrud9ig/compmatch.wav

For ideal settings you should play some note/chord with average force, or however you'd normally accent the start of a new sound. This doesn't matter as much with high gain, but with more dynamic tones, notes that already decayed a bit will make the comp too quiet if you match level that way then use it in a more typical playing scenario.
 
Last edited:
Excellent, that does the job.
 

Attachments

  • AX8-v2.wav.zip
    512 KB · Views: 26
Bakerman said:
For ideal settings you should play some note/chord with average force, or however you'd normally accent the start of a new sound. This doesn't matter as much with high gain, but with more dynamic tones, notes that already decayed a bit will make the comp too quiet if you match level that way then use it in a more typical playing scenario.
Click to expand...

@Bakerman , @yek - thank you very much for all the work and remarks on the comp switcher. This could be a game changing method of gapless switching for AX8 users. However - fine tuning it might be difficult, especially for people who are not keen on tweaking in-depth controllers' parameters or compressor settings, like me :(

Please kindly have a look on attached preset and let me know, where to start looking at, if dirty to clean amp scene switching results in all too evident volume fade-out after the compressor does its work and disengages.

The other way around - when changing clean to dirty - it seems to be almost ok. I tried to add some compression in the clean amp's amp block, so the fade out would be less pronounced, but I was just guessing and it didn't work like expected. Levels are probably where they should be.

Thanks in advance for any help!
 

Attachments

  • Comp switcher D test.syx
    12.6 KB · Views: 28
Ghost_of_Cain said:
Please kindly have a look on attached preset and let me know, where to start looking at, if dirty to clean amp scene switching results in all too evident volume fade-out after the compressor does its work and disengages.
Click to expand...

That's when you'd have to adjust comp level between amp states. The same scene controller could be used, or on AX8 switch comp to Y and maybe lower ratio for clean.

Assigning envelope to comp level helps when one of the sounds is pretty clean/dynamic. If you expand its output to approximate the non-comp signal the levels will match better throughout the possible dynamic range of your playing.

If using the envelope technique when one tone has more gain, you'll probably want the scene controller to increase envelope gain on those scenes. Then it can hit maximum comp level easier and better match the amp's output, which starts to distort/compress rather than produce louder output with higher input levels. See how this one works on scenes 1 & 2.
 

Attachments

  • Comp switch env.syx
    6.3 KB · Views: 31
Bakerman said:
That's when you'd have to adjust comp level between amp states. The same scene controller could be used, or on AX8 switch comp to Y and maybe lower ratio for clean.

Assigning envelope to comp level helps when one of the sounds is pretty clean/dynamic. If you expand its output to approximate the non-comp signal the levels will match better throughout the possible dynamic range of your playing.

If using the envelope technique when one tone has more gain, you'll probably want the scene controller to increase envelope gain on those scenes. Then it can hit maximum comp level easier and better match the amp's output, which starts to distort/compress rather than produce louder output with higher input levels. See how this one works on scenes 1 & 2.
Click to expand...

Thank you, much appreciated!

I need to rethink this, and try to adapt the idea to my style of picking / specific song setting. It appears no envelope scene controll and very low damping on the bypass modifier work best for me. Dunno why, but I will find out.

I understand there are many variables here, and this could not be an easy thing to implement, but if only FAS team could look into this issue, and try to create that kind of compression-based gap filling solution inside the system... This would be great.

Thank you again!
 
8. Improved (again) amp XY and preset switching

Before trying the compressor I considered something like this, but wasn't sure if the right volume curve would be easy to set up. Instead of compression, level is controlled post-amp with a volume block. This works better than the compressor, correcting the fade with any amp level/tone/dynamics.

Scene controller is set like before, 0/100 for the different amp XY states. Volume block is engaged temporarily as needed like the compressor was. When that happens, the scene controller also runs LFO 2, square type with B output assigned to volume block level & volume. The LFO acts as a delayed switch that goes from 100 to 0 after any scene controller change. This brings the volume block level down from 12.3 to 0 dB with damping while the fade is moving through its final 12.3 dB or so. Another modifier on volume parameter fixes a bump caused by the level modifier.

Sequencer on level also works pretty well if you need both LFOs for something else.

Using these on AX8 would require some modifier adjustment due to the faster fade. Reducing damping times might be all that's needed, but I'm not sure about that.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/nvwb79k7m3y5pb2/lfofade.mp3
 

Attachments

  • vol switcher LFO.syx
    6.3 KB · Views: 57
  • vol switcher SEQ.syx
    6.3 KB · Views: 47
Last edited:
Bakerman said:
8. Improved (again) amp XY and preset switching

Before trying the compressor I considered something like this, but wasn't sure if the right volume curve would be easy to set up. Instead of compression, level is controlled post-amp with a volume block. This works better than the compressor, correcting the fade with any amp level/tone/dynamics.

Scene controller is set like before, 0/100 for the different amp XY states. Volume block is engaged temporarily as needed like the compressor was. When that happens, the scene controller also runs LFO 2, square type with B output assigned to volume block level & volume. The LFO acts as a delayed switch that goes from 100 to 0 after any scene controller change. This brings the volume block level down from 12.3 to 0 dB with damping while the fade is moving through its final 12.3 dB or so. Another modifier on volume parameter fixes a bump caused by the level modifier.

Sequencer on level also works pretty well if you need both LFOs for something else.

Using these on AX8 would require some modifier adjustment due to the faster fade. Reducing damping times might be all that's needed, but I'm not sure about that.
Click to expand...

Amazing work, sir. Let's check! For me, lowering damping on Vol/Pan's volume LFO 2B does the trick (out of the box - it was pretty unusable). Now it's quite good (tried with 25 - 11 ms), yet needs to be tested at rehearsal volume / setting, with full preset glory and stuff.

Fellow AX8 users - try the low damp version and let us know if it's just me, or this solution is even better than a.m. comp switcher!

@Bakerman - don't know how to express my gratitude! Thanks!
 

Attachments

  • vol switch LFO lowdamp.syx
    12.6 KB · Views: 51
9. Synth bass drone learn/hold & tracking switch

A global scale with all notes shifted to A (A# -1, B -2, etc.) makes the pitch block shift any input note to the current tonic/keynote. Using a pitch "learn" modifier the key can be changed so a constant synth note is shifted to the learned note.

This preset was set up with Ext Ctrl 3 as the learn control. Momentary action is ideal for setting new drones quickly, but latching can also work. Set up global scale #10 as follows, or use another and adjust pitch "voice 1 scale" parameter. (Starting at top of list, A) 0 -1 -2 -3 -4 -5 -6 -7 +4 +3 +2 +1

Engage synth to get the bass drone. Hold Ext Ctrl 3 and learn is activated while pitch mix goes to 0% and synth tracking parameter changes from "off" to "pitch & env". Now the synth tracks your notes, 2 octaves lower (octave can be adjusted via shift parameter if desired). Switch Ext Ctrl 3 off and "learn" deactivates just before synth tracking returns to "off" and pitch mix goes back to 100%. The bass drone will be shifted to the new learned note.

The pitch block has a pitch source modifier, switching from local to global when Ext Ctrl 3 is held. This is because the drone needs local tracking to sound correct, but local won't learn lower bass notes (below G1) reliably with the tracking synth as input. There are other solutions like routing the normal guitar sound to pitch block when learn = on, but this preset keeps the routing as simple as possible.

The exact synth note and shift values will determine the range of notes available from the drone setting. For example, D is the lowest possible drone note here. To move it up an octave you can either increase synth frequency from ~220 Hz (A) to ~233 Hz (Bb), or change the global scale's "E" shift from -7 to +5. Also if you change synth "shift" from -24 to -12 for 1-octave-down tracking, you may want to drop Voice 1 Freq. to 110 to keep the same drone octave.

More options:

Reverse Ext Ctrl 3 or modifier values for drone when switch is held, normal tracking otherwise.

Enable envelope tracking (adjust synth voice 1 track modifier) to have drone notes match your rhythm. Envelope as voice level modifier could give more subtle pulsing, ducking the synth note on the loudest attacks.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/6urq09x5ew92udr/synthhold.mp3
 

Attachments

  • Bass drone catch.syx
    6.3 KB · Views: 52
Last edited:
10. Global block recall via sysex

Remote global block actions use 2-word sysex messages. For example, "load without linking" Amp 1 Global #1 command for Mark I/II:

F0 00 01 74 03 1B 6A 00 00 02 75 F7
F0 00 01 74 03 01 6A 00 6D F7

This is the format. Monitor Axe-Edit's output to get other commands without looking up block IDs or calculating checksums.

znr8INf.png


The 6th byte in each word (0x1B, 0x01) is a function ID that won't change.

This is as seamless/instant as XY switching: no gaps except for amp block. With a capable enough controller you could have several favorite settings for one or more blocks available in any preset, or do more in one preset with DAW control.

Both words together are more than the 16-byte custom message limit on the MFC-101, but could be set as on/off messages for a momentary or auto-off IA. Or you can keep normal IA functions and set bank size to 17, configuring one or more "rig builder" banks/songs. Make the preset switches send only custom sysex (no PCs), then use reveal mode to access IAs. Since a preset switch won't send anything on release, the second word would have to be sent some other way.

The second word is constant for a given block instance, and other sysex or CCs can occur between words without affecting the result. Call the words "select' and "enter" for now. Working with the MFC-101 message limit, you could put pairs of "select" commands for a block on some IAs, then have just one "enter" IA. A second block's "enter" command could be the other state of that (momentary/auto-off) IA.

With the bank/preset approach you could set up IAs to send all necessary "enter" commands on any selection, or keep a separate "enter" preset that sends them (adding IA custom messages as needed). With the separate enter switch you can make multiple choices then switch to them all at once. Adding CCs to these IAs shouldn't affect the global selection as mentioned above, so they can still work as Ext Ctrls for other things in reveal mode.
 
Whoa. So this enables recalling any instance of a global block through a single command, allowing access at will to all stores types?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom