Tips for direct out sound, in ear monitors...

Been using IEM's at church w/ Aviom's for some time.
Tried to go there with the band, but.. well.. it's a challenge unless all buy into it.
I have a Presonus mixer running two DB25 cables into ch1-8 and 9-16 (respectively) on a Behringer P-16I.
From there CAT5 - direct to the first P-16M station, then daisy-chained to other P-16M's.
I get 16-channels, full stereo pan mix control, EQ, on each channel with master limiter and volume on each unit.
FULL 16-CH mix for each.
From there I go stereo to my wireless unit.
Simple to setup. Efficient. When not mixing from the stage, I have 250ft CAT5 on a roller to go from FOH to stage.
I need to upgrade my IEM's (planning on going with 1964-V3 IEM's) but I'm between gigs right now and no spare change!

Total cost for the monitoring gear was about $600 (last yr) for me, and $299 (plus cat5) for each user. Then + ears. Drummers can use the earphone jack on back and be wired.. as I guess can anyone. Keeps stage noise down and folks tend to play much quieter.
GOOD FOR THE EARS too!!
 
Right off the bat I did get custom molds from an audiologist for my ue7's. The fit and finish is great. I think I am just really picky...I am curious how that first gig with them will sound. I have a little time between now and then so I hope I can tune into some good IR settings. I certainly have a bunch to choose from.
 
The "Air ' and "Room" settings in the Cab seem to open the sound out a lot, I'll be experimenting with those myself! Oh and reverb too.
 
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axme said:
I agree about the importance of the molds. My first pair were done by an audiologist for $80.00 and they never sealed perfectly. I used a bite block because I sing and they told me that my jaw needed to be slightly open for comfort.....wrong.

My next pair I did myself with the mold kit from Alien Ears http://www.alienears.com/p/299/custom-molded-triple-driver-monitor except this time I didnt use a bite block and stayed perfectly still without even swallowing while the molds set. The difference between the two was astounding and the seal I get is air tight with complete isolation.

Tried the ear buds and was happy until I went custom and all I can say is night and day.
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I was the opposite. I had mine done with my mouth open until they dried. That's the way Jhaudios instructed my audiologist to perform the mold and mine are perfect. I think a lot has to do with the quality of the build though. Not just the ear impression.
But when I had my lower end molds done they were done with the mouth closed. This never fit right for me since I sing as well. Whenever I opened my mouth the mold moves around too much breaking the seal.
 
Some excellent points being made and additional food for thought :) (sorry King Tone, I don't mean to hijack your thread, but it's a useful general discussion too! :encouragement:)

It's good that many seem to be saying, "Ah, if you think it's good now, then wait until you hear what it could be like!" - I'm all for that, but the thing is, there are two completely opposing experiences being expressed with regard to custom fits & singers etc and that's a worry when dropping bigger money on it... I'm the singer too and don't struggle with seals being broken on either the £40 CX275s or those £20 buds! :?
 
Cover'd said:
Some excellent points being made and additional food for thought :) (sorry King Tone, I don't mean to hijack your thread, but it's a useful general discussion too! :encouragement:)

It's good that many seem to be saying, "Ah, if you think it's good now, then wait until you hear what it could be like!" - I'm all for that, but the thing is, there are two completely opposing experiences being expressed with regard to custom fits & singers etc and that's a worry when dropping bigger money on it... I'm the singer too and don't struggle with seals being broken on either the £40 CX275s or those £20 buds! :?
Click to expand...
I'm using triple driver Alien Ears custom moulds, and they are just fantastic. I've tried generic fit dual drivers as well as a multitude of others , and these "Alien Ears" are in a league of their own. I was telling my bassist to get them for ages, he was uming an ahing ( I think they cost around $350), I even went as far as saying I guarantee you will love them". He got them and he loves them. too!
 
Alien Ears triples and Sennheiser rf for the past 5 years for me. At first it was strange, it lacked the dynamic stage sound. Before going to iem I knew where the sweet spot was for my sound, after iem it was disorienting because no matter how you turned or where you stood, the sound was the same. It took a little tweaking, but now no matter where I am on stage I'm always in the sweet spot. It didn't take long to get the entire band to go to iem.
When you use wedges and speaker cabs, you hafta deal with stage acoutics and you make adjustments to your sound to compensate. With iem, stage acoustic anomolies are eliminated for you and foh will take care of the house.
 
boltrecords said:
I was the opposite. I had mine done with my mouth open until they dried. That's the way Jhaudios instructed my audiologist to perform the mold and mine are perfect. I think a lot has to do with the quality of the build though. Not just the ear impression.
But when I had my lower end molds done they were done with the mouth closed. This never fit right for me since I sing as well. Whenever I opened my mouth the mold moves around too much breaking the seal.
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+1

I specify a bite block when getting molds.

I sing and the IEM's will break seal if I don't get the molds made using a bite block.

Richard
 
Just FYI.
I have been offering advice based on my iem experience as a singer but first and foremost a guitarist who is an absolute tone junkie.

Back when I first started using In ears i would basically use one for vocals and my other ear would be facing my amp. That's the wrong way. But I was always able to hear my vocals loud and clear. My point here is that I think it's fairly easy to get a decent vocal monitor from in ears. Getting a solid and accurate guitar tone is much more difficult and in depth. Many variables to consider as you probably noticed.

It's really a very difficult process since there really is no way to audition any of the ear buds before buying them. That's part of the reason why I went with Jh16's. I had previously upgraded two other times and still wasn't happy with the sound I was getting. So I decided to just go with the best I could find. The 16's might have been overkill from say the 11's but for the little extra money I spent, at least I wasn't left wondering if I should have gotten the 16's. the way I see it is if I have the highest quality buds I can find and the sound still isn't there, it must be a different variable that is lacking. The buds did make a huge difference which is why I'm now tweaking in other areas little by little.
 
Cover'd said:
Some excellent points being made and additional food for thought :) (sorry King Tone, I don't mean to hijack your thread, but it's a useful general discussion too! :encouragement:)

It's good that many seem to be saying, "Ah, if you think it's good now, then wait until you hear what it could be like!" - I'm all for that, but the thing is, there are two completely opposing experiences being expressed with regard to custom fits & singers etc and that's a worry when dropping bigger money on it... I'm the singer too and don't struggle with seals being broken on either the £40 CX275s or those £20 buds! :?
Click to expand...

The King approves wholeheartedly!

I am glad this thread could go somewhere. There really is not that much to read about as far as in ear monitor use, especially with the axe fx and guitar tone in general on the net, so this is helpful.
 
Cover'd said:
I'm the singer too and don't struggle with seals being broken on either the £40 CX275s or those £20 buds! :?
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I sing - some lead, but mostly backing vox - and I have the exact opposite experience with cheap buds... I can't find anything - even tho' my $30 Sony EX buds sound great - that will stay sealed. As soon as I "warm up" on stage and get a little sweaty... POP! seal gone. Or... the more common issue, as soon as I started to sing.. POP! seal gone!
This is not so bad when playing guitar, but when I have bass gigs, it's a total disaster!
I am waiting to get more gig $$ to upgrade to custom molds (as mentioned in an earlier post above) but use semi-custom molds on Westone UM-1's for now. Those don't lose the seal like the generics, but I still have the same issue.
 
s0c9 said:
I sing - some lead, but mostly backing vox - and I have the exact opposite experience with cheap buds... I can't find anything - even tho' my $30 Sony EX buds sound great - that will stay sealed. As soon as I "warm up" on stage and get a little sweaty... POP! seal gone. Or... the more common issue, as soon as I started to sing.. POP! seal gone!
This is not so bad when playing guitar, but when I have bass gigs, it's a total disaster!
I am waiting to get more gig $$ to upgrade to custom molds (as mentioned in an earlier post above) but use semi-custom molds on Westone UM-1's for now. Those don't lose the seal like the generics, but I still have the same issue.
Click to expand...

I played an entire set on bass with no backline amp, singing bkg vox with no ears... smiling on the outside but stressin' on the inside!

If I pick those foam surrounds big enough, feel way too big before the gig, they will pretty much stay put.

But nothing beats custom molds if done right. Righteous bass and no seal issues.
 
barhrecords said:
I played an entire set on bass with no backline amp, singing bkg vox with no ears... smiling on the outside but stressin' on the inside!

If I pick those foam surrounds big enough, feel way too big before the gig, they will pretty much stay put.

But nothing beats custom molds if done right. Righteous bass and no seal issues.
Click to expand...

+1.
Amazing how the low end leaks out with the slightest break in the seal. When I spoke with jhaudio about my needs as a guitar player, they even advised against getting a ambient vent since that too drastically effects the low end.
 
I've heard the same about the vents. Avoid them if you are playing keys, bass or guitar. Unless you don't mind the bass roll off.

I have thought about sensaphonics, the ears with built-in mics for ambience. I've never sprung the $$ for them though.

Fixed mics on stage for ambience are a little disorienting too, you turn backwards to talk the drummer or a stage hand or what not, and the left becomes right and right becomes left... a little odd.
 
I use two stage mics that we place on top of the two guitar amps facing the crowd. This helps add a little space/room in my ears. Just a small amount of them blended in seems perfect. Plus the band can communicate through these too. I recently went from using my amp/miced to direct out from axe with output 2 to cabs. I actually was surprised by how much I thought it sounded better through my ears. I think its because of the way I eq'ed after the cab. rolled off highs and lows. Sounded great. Might help ya...

I've also been curious about the sensaphonics ones with ambient mics as well.
 
barhrecords said:
I've heard the same about the vents. Avoid them if you are playing keys, bass or guitar. Unless you don't mind the bass roll off.
Click to expand...

That applies to balanced armature based in-ear designs. Dynamic driver based designs are a different animal. Dynamic drivers are large physically (virually as big as the in-ear enclosure) and they leverage a vent, much like a tuned port in a traditional speaker design, to increase and fine tune their bass response. Opening the vent increases the bass and to some degree, changes it's character ("tighter" vs "looser"). It's pretty cool to be able to dial this in.

My Aurisonics AS2 is a dynamic driver in-ear monitor. It has an adjustable bass port AND an adjustable ambient port. I have the bass port open a bit and it provides a very balanced, full and tight bass. I keep the ambient port closed because I like all the isolation I can get. However, if I wanted some stage sound I could open it up to taste, independent of the bass.

Terry.
 
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