The Manual Really Needs To Be Enhanced

[CudBucket]

At the very least, the information regarding the FX Loop and Send/Return blocks needs to be elaborated on. There should be samples on how to lay those blocks out in the grid for say, a standard mono patch, stereo, w/d/w etc. I find the info in the manual regarding these blocks almost useless.

Dave

 

[javajunkie]

At the very least, the information regarding the FX Loop and Send/Return blocks needs to be elaborated on. There should be samples on how to lay those blocks out in the grid for say, a standard mono patch, stereo, w/d/w etc. I find the info in the manual regarding these blocks almost useless.

Dave

There really is not a lot to them

Feedback send and Return:

The Feedback Send and Return blocks allow you to feedback sound from one point in the routing to any other point.

The Send block has no parameters, while the Return block has a basic mixer. Adjust the MIX control to set the ratio of direct and feedback signals.

Best results are achieved when feeding back a pure delayed signal. If any direct signal is fed back the resulting loop will usually be unstable and/or sound strange due to phase cancellation.

Warning: Use caution with the Feedback blocks as you can easily program an unstable loop and cause internal clipping of the signal and/or very high sound levels which can damage your hearing. Always start with the MIX control on zero and slowly bring it up. If you start to hear squealing or other signs of instability return the MIX control to zero and analyze your routing for possible causes of instability.

So what you are doing is taking the signal flow from the send and routing to where ever you put the return. You can use this if you run out of blocks on a row and want to continue adding effects. You can also use this to make a feedback loop. This is useful for placing effects like filters, flange, chorus, etc. in a delay loop.

The effects loop/aux out simply routes the signal to output 2 and takes the input from input 2 and places into the axe-fx matrix at that location.
You can uses this as an effects loop, a separate output, or separate input.

 

[javajunkie]

We created the WIKI for elaborating on these things. It doesn't have everything but it is always growing eveolving.

http://axefxwiki.guitarlogic.org/index. ... op_effects
http://axefxwiki.guitarlogic.org/index. ... op/aux_out

 

[rsf1977]

there probably should be 2 documents

1. Quickstart Guide: covers all the basics for the non tinkering types
2. Owners Manual: covers every detail in the axe-fx more like the wiki for the tweakers

 

[javajunkie]

there probably should be 2 documents

1. Quickstart Guide: covers all the basics for the non tinkering types
2. Owners Manual: covers every detail in the axe-fx more like the wiki for the tweakers

With all the updates the manual gets out of date fast, hence the WIKI. The WIKI can adapt faster, it also used used to go into depth on subjects and incorporate users ideas. For a really in depth manual like you are describing Cliff would have to stop improving the Axe-fx and other projects and work on that for sometime. Something I would not like to see him do. This forum and the WIKI is designed to facilitate more advanced stuff. i would suggest that you post a specific topic on something and get feedback. If it is something not covered in the WIKI, it can be added.

 

[godprobe]

there probably should be 2 documents

1. Quickstart Guide: covers all the basics for the non tinkering types
2. Owners Manual: covers every detail in the axe-fx more like the wiki for the tweakers

:idea:

 

[North]

I got my Ultra in February and so I am a newbie. The manual and the wiki are great sources of information, though having a background from training, my observation is that their objectives are primarily to document and explain features.

My objective when I got my ultra was to create great sounds - from scratch. With a product as deep as the Axe it is easy to get lost. In fact we maybe just lost a compatriot that gave in after 3 weeks and returned his Axe due to this.

There are a lot of threads/posts that offer a lot of experience, advice and information, but I think there could be a shared, highly visible best practice (sorry for the management consulting language) that could be extracted to help “construct great sounds”.

A simple example could be (not that this is right):

1) Start with a blank preset.
2) Add an amp.
3) Add a cab.
4) Tweak parameter x to …
5) Tweak parameter y to …
6) Tweak parameter z to …

At this point one could go into what one would do to e.g. tighten up the bass (e.g. remove bass pre, add back in later), where in the chain effects could be added so people (like me) don’t have to stumble across a given thread to find out that with the Axe one indeed can place an eq after the cab (thanks, Scott!) etc.

The objective is to help at least newbies (and maybe others too) construct great sounds - and we can maybe then more effectively use the manual, the wiki and this site as reference or exchange.

Not necessarily a huge project and maybe perfect for a wiki approach. From being around here more or less daily I think I can see some possible roles - E.g. I would really appreciate if Jay could elaborate on the cabs section for example.

Makes sense? Or does it already exist? If so - sorry.

 

[MisterE]

I've seen some very good and detailed explanations by some and Jay especially.
I've bookmarked them in the past, but since some posts got deleted due to lack of space on the server or something similar, I try to save them in a document now.
It would be good if these tips could be added to the Wiki.

 

[javajunkie]

I got my Ultra in February and so I am a newbie. The manual and the wiki are great sources of information, though having a background from training, my observation is that their objectives are primarily to document and explain features.

My objective when I got my ultra was to create great sounds - from scratch. With a product as deep as the Axe it is easy to get lost. In fact we maybe just lost a compatriot that gave in after 3 weeks and returned his Axe due to this.

There are a lot of threads/posts that offer a lot of experience, advice and information, but I think there could be a shared, highly visible best practice (sorry for the management consulting language) that could be extracted to help “construct great sounds”.

A simple example could be (not that this is right):

1) Start with a blank preset.
2) Add an amp.
3) Add a cab.
4) Tweak parameter x to …
5) Tweak parameter y to …
6) Tweak parameter z to …

At this point one could go into what one would do to e.g. tighten up the bass (e.g. remove bass pre, add back in later), where in the chain effects could be added so people (like me) don’t have to stumble across a given thread to find out that with the Axe one indeed can place an eq after the cab (thanks, Scott!) etc.

The objective is to help at least newbies (and maybe others too) construct great sounds - and we can maybe then more effectively use the manual, the wiki and this site as reference or exchange.

Not necessarily a huge project and maybe perfect for a wiki approach. From being around here more or less daily I think I can see some possible roles - E.g. I would really appreciate if Jay could elaborate on the cabs section for example.

Makes sense? Or does it already exist? If so - sorry.

http://axefxwiki.guitarlogic.org/index. ... for_covers
http://axefxwiki.guitarlogic.org/index. ... s_settings
http://axefxwiki.guitarlogic.org/index. ... =Tutorials
http://axefxwiki.guitarlogic.org/index. ... Simulation
http://axefxwiki.guitarlogic.org/index. ... _imitation

The problem is one persons great sounds is not another. What guitar you are playing, how you are amplifying, picking style, pickup configuration, taste, tone/volume settings, pickups all make a big difference on what may work or not for you. The axechange (once it is back) will give exact settings.

 

[mwd]

@North ~ I understand the desire to create sounds from scratch but don't understand sending a unit back that is capable of dozens and dozens of awesome sounds right out of the box. I got outrageously great sound for 1 1/2 years prior to even started to customize presets. I'd have to chalk that one up to his loss.

 

[Jay Mitchell]

My objective when I got my ultra was to create great sounds - from scratch. With a product as deep as the Axe it is easy to get lost. In fact we maybe just lost a compatriot that gave in after 3 weeks and returned his Axe due to this.

I can name a number of really deep products, all of which have the capability of producing sounds powerful enough to move grown men and women to tears. None of them come with instruction manuals, they all require years of dedication to learn to use well, and a large majority of the people who purchase them eventually give up and sell them or set them aside.

























Here's a partial list:

violin
guitar
piano
flute
trumpet
clarinet
drums
saxophone

As difficult as those products are to learn to use well, I have to say that the burden of doing so lies entirely with the "user." Taken in that context, the Axe-Fx manual, in combination with the Wiki and this forum, constitute a virtual library of information.

 

[MisterE]

That's a great example Jay.
I've never thought of it that way, but you're right.
If we see the Axe-fx as an instrument or tool, we do have to put in an effort to get the most out of it.
And as with any instrument, the longer you work with it, the more you should evolve and the more you get out of it.
But I guess some people are looking for a magical box they can rub and a genie will pop out asking them what sound they want.

 

[Stringtheorist]

If I may borrow Jay's analogy it also follows that many students of a musical instrument absolutely need a teacher to show them how to get the right sounds out of the instrument and correct them when they're going wrong, often for a protracted period of study. Just because some folks have successfully taught themselves it doesn't mean this approach is going to work for others. The Axe-FX doesn't come with a pocket teacher... Fortunately we have this forum and the Wiki to help us but in my experience the Wiki is patchy at best and I rely on the advice of experienced users to train me in getting good sounds which is why it has taken me six months to get a basic handle on the unit. I would expect most guitar students to give up if they made little progress in six months. A manual may not be necessary providing the Wiki covers all the fundamental stuff folks want to know (such as how to tighten the bass up in high-gain presets) but there should have been a comprehensive bank of basic tutorials like this from the off, IMHO. For this reason I'm in general agreement with Mr. North. Much of the user manual reads like a physics book which is why I've never gotten around to using modulated delays, multiband compressors, filters, etc. All I want to know is... do x and y if you want to get z. :|

 

[North]

I could put in the hours for years and years to learn to play the violin by myself. In fact that is how I learned how to play guitar.

Or - I could go to a violin teacher to help me learn better and faster - without taking away any hours.

Hours is not a measurement of results.

Maybe there is specific way to approach the Axe – and put in the hours – more effectively. Or, maybe not.

Personally, I humbly believe the next 10.000 Axe users may benefit from a guide on how to approach it. Yes, they should read the manual, the wiki and this site too but in sum that is a big forrest to get lost in.

With my background from product marketing and technology training I can’t help but think that the next 10.000 could benefit from a somewhat shared, structured approach where the focus is on the process, not the features.

 

[mwd]

I'm on it...

 

[Jay Mitchell]

A manual may not be necessary providing the Wiki covers all the fundamental stuff folks want to know (such as how to tighten the bass up in high-gain presets)

"All the fundamental stuff folks want to know" is highly variable from one individual to another. The Axe-Fx manual arguably covers all the fundamental stuff folks need to know in order to begin using the device.

but there should have been a comprehensive bank of basic tutorials like this from the off, IMHO.

Generating comprehensive instructional materials would have been a huge project. Had such a provision been allowed to delay the introduction of the product - there can be no doubt that it would have taken considerable time to complete - not only would the generation of revenue been put off by that amount of time, those of us who do not need such materials would have been needlessly denied the availability of the Axe-Fx for that period. Not everyone needs a tutorial.

There continue to be finite available resources, and they must therefore be allocated carefully. For a company the size of FAS, generating tutorial materials would necessarily take time away from develping the product. I am confident that far more Axe-Fx users have benefited from continued firmware development than would have benefited from a tutorial book or DVD. Given a choice, I would take the former without hesitation, and I believe that that is the majority view among Axe-Fx owners.

All I want to know is... do x and y if you want to get z. :|

That is where time spent experimening is essential. Everyone who is comfortable using advanced effects has paid their dues in this area, and there is really no substitute. "Do x and y if you want to get z" simply won't work when x, y, z, and any number of other variables interact with each other. If you adjust x, you may find that the effect of adjusting y is now much different than it was before x changed. There may be many ways to achieve a given goal, and only you know what that goal is.

 

[Jay Mitchell]

Or - I could go to a violin teacher to help me learn better and faster - without taking away any hours.

And, by the same logic, you could pay an accomplished studio musician to teach you about the use and configuration of effects devices, inclusing the Axe-Fx. I'm sure there are relatively few such individuals available to teach lessons, but the principle is identical.

Hours is not a measurement of results.

You've identified the difference between a necessary and a sufficient condition. I agree that spending many hours learning to use effects with electric guitar is not sufficient to enable one to achieve success, but I am 100% certain that, just as with mastering a musical instrument, those hours are a necessary part of the process. I know a number of accomplished players, some of whom are also experts in using effects to help them create their sounds. As talented as they are, every one of these individuals has spent and continues to spend hour upon hour perfecting their skills.

Maybe there is specific way to approach the Axe – and put in the hours – more effectively.

There are many ways to make effective use of time spent with the Axe-Fx. Identifying the ones that work for you is the challenge. Doing things the way I do them is satisfactory for my purposes. It is very unlikely to work for someone else.

Personally, I humbly believe the next 10.000 Axe users may benefit from a guide on how to approach it.

Perhaps that could become a profit-maker for some enterprising individual.

 

[GuitarDojo]

I'm on it...

Nice! :lol:

 

[mitch236]

And, by the same logic, you could pay an accomplished studio musician to teach you about the use and configuration of effects devices, inclusing the Axe-Fx. I'm sure there are relatively few such individuals available to teach lessons, but the principle is identical.

You must know how difficult this is. I have a friend who owns a recording studio and he has helped me some but his time is valuable and his knowledge of the Axe is minimal. He would need to learn as we go and that gets expensive fast! But mostly I've found that just modifying existing presets is the most time effective approach for me. I can take a preset and bypass the effects chain and start adding back effects and tweak from there. There's really no need to re-invent the wheel. I don't know why many users preach that you should start with a blank slate. Why not start with something that has promise and tweak it?

 

[Jay Mitchell]

You must know how difficult this is.

Difficult or not, it is the direct equivalent of taking music lessons. If you need a teacher, it behooves you to find one, difficult as that may be.