Steel guitar simulator for electric guitar with FM3?

Brian Dean-O

Brian Dean-O

Inspired
Just wondering if anyone's ever tried to find out if it can be done because I'd like to check it out if so.

On a side note what about other stringed instruments like violins and cellos and ukuleles and whatnot?
 
The modeler is not a synthesizer. Typically imitating the sound of other instruments is beyond a modeler's abilities, especially when you get into polyphonic sounds. Forum member @hippietim is using multiple FX3 units with a hex-pickup on his guitar to do some crazy stuff, but it's way beyond what a single FM3 could do.

Steel sounds are mostly playing technique to imitate the effect of the knee levers and pedals, the modeler won't do that for you. It can replicate a pedalboard and amp used with a steel easily though and play a steel through it and it'll sound great; There are some forum members using their modelers for this.

Bowed strings have a sawtooth waveform, and the Synth block can generate that. There are factory presets demonstrating the effect, so search the Wiki's page for "synth" and you'll find them. The Synth block is a 3-voice monophonic synthesizer and playing technique is important to avoid mistracking. Again, playing a violin or cello through the modeler and skipping the Synth block would work better. The FM3 doesn't have the horsepower to do what the FX3 can, and I don't remember exactly what the FM3's version of the preset does.

Ukulele is more than a pitch shift, because it won't sustain like a guitar, so maybe controlling the envelope and pitch would get close, if you want the sound of an electric ukulele because the pickups sound much different than an acoustic instrument.
 
Brian Dean-O said:
Just wondering if anyone's ever tried to find out if it can be done because I'd like to check it out if so.

On a side note what about other stringed instruments like violins and cellos and ukuleles and whatnot?
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People get a lot of non-guitar sounds out of the Axe. There are great discussions on bagpipes and even a trumpet sound and a variety of synth type sounds. Not sure if they will work with the FM3 but worth looking at for ideas. In terms of stringed instruments, guitar to bass and electric guitar to acoustic guitar type simulations which with some ingenuity could maybe be reworked to other acoustic stringed type instruments or even new unique sounds. Good luck and have fun!
 
WKSmith said:
This may help get you started with violins and cellos.
https://forum.fractalaudio.com/thre...some-free-irs-and-a-sloppy-rush-cover.191451/

I started trying to create a preset for steel guitar using 2 pitch shifters for the a&b pedals. But the pitch shifters sounded less than optimal for that application, at least until I get my hands on an AxeFxIII.
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Cool thanks!
I actually just today for the first time went to send some IRs to the unit and try 'em out but realized some of them are already on here. I had just discovered the Gift of Tone series last night is how it started but I think it looks like the person I bought my FM3 from knew about it and sent at least some of that stuff over to the device and it retained the IRs which is cool I just wish I knew which ones he chose to download and which he didn't so I don't have a bunch of duplicates (cause I downloaded most if not all of them lol) but that's okay. I've never actually got to get into the IRs before on anything, not quite sure how to logically approach it but I'm sure it's going to be fun I realize IRs are huge in modeling and I've watched a lot of videos where it was a topic or being tried out but not hands on as of yet so it's up there on my list of things to try to get in to keep finding great tone and with this thing.
 
iaresee said:
The unit isn't able to to act on only one string if you play many strings.

That said, you can still kinda sorta do some interesting bends with the whammy.



But you're bending all the notes at once.
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Pretty cool! Thank you.
Man, I've been saying I really need an expression pedal!
I've been having GAS for an expression pedal and a power amp as well so I can get it setup for a speaker cabinet too.
 
Brian Dean-O said:
Cool thanks!
I actually just today for the first time went to send some IRs to the unit and try 'em out but realized some of them are already on here. I had just discovered the Gift of Tone series last night is how it started but I think it looks like the person I bought my FM3 from knew about it and sent at least some of that stuff over to the device and it retained the IRs which is cool I just wish I knew which ones he chose to download and which he didn't so I don't have a bunch of duplicates (cause I downloaded most if not all of them lol) but that's okay. I've never actually got to get into the IRs before on anything, not quite sure how to logically approach it but I'm sure it's going to be fun I realize IRs are huge in modeling and I've watched a lot of videos where it was a topic or being tried out but not hands on as of yet so it's up there on my list of things to try to get in to keep finding great tone and with this thing.
Click to expand...

The “problem” with a used unit is you have no idea how it’s configured in relation to the new-from-the-factory settings unless you’re already really familiar with the system. In addition, we have a hard time helping you because we don’t know what changes have been made, resulting in a lot of backtracking to figure out what’s going on if there’s a problem.

I’d highly recommend starting from the factory default system using Fractal-Bot to run a full backup first, then reset to factory settings:
  1. In Edit go to Tools > Fractal-Bot then follow the instructions on p. 103 in the manual. That will provide you with a full backup of the system, presets and user cabs for later if you need them, but for now you need a clean slate.
  2. Jump to p. 102 and follow the directions under “Utilities: Reset Page”. That will wipe the previous owner’s changes.
  3. Install the latest release firmware to Firmware v6.02 “Cygnus X2” and the factory presets, following the directions in the .zip archives. That will return the unit to the standard from-the-factory system.
Later, if you want, you can reload what was on the system when you received it.
 
This is going to be long winded. Sorry.

A steel guitar is an electric guitar played with a slide bar - typically made of steel (hence the name). There's nothing particularly special about that - just play your guitar with a heavy steel slide. So I'm assuming what you're really after is the string bending that you control with your foot pedals and knee levers. That is not doable if you're processing all of the strings together - IOW, the normal way a guitar signal is processed. There's all sorts of effect processors and pedals that will enable you to do pitch shifting - including the various Fractal units. Even though the Fractal and other pitch shifters do know how to do polyphonic shifting, they couldn't possibly know which note to shift when you want to bend a particular string since there are so many strings you could a given note on.

The only way to pull this off is to process each string individually. If you want to bend a particular string, no problem you configure your pitch shifter to bend the range you want for just that string. So I've got a guitar with custom electronics that allows me to process each string individually. I run the 6 individual outputs into 3 Axe-Fx IIIs - each unit has two independent paths that process a single string. This rig can do what you ask and plenty more. It is not what I would call gig-friendly.

There are a number of Roland guitar processors that support the GK-3 pickup (sometimes called a MIDI pickup) that can do what you want. Because the GK-3 is not a MIDI pickup. It's just 6 little analog pickups similar to what I described above. It is up to the unit that you plug into to decide what to do with those 6 pickup signals. Early on, these were just used for doing MIDI synth stuff. Later Roland introduced the VG-8 and a slew of similar products. These things actual process the 6 string signals individually just like any other guitar processor. I don't if all of the VG series support doing pitch bending but I know the VG-99 does and so does the current SY-1000. In fact, the VG-99 has a factory preset that's a Tele with a B-bender. If you want to bend more strings, you'd need multiple pedals.
 
The tricky part about doing a ukulele is getting the right filter/eq to give you the sound of nylon strings. Other than that, the pitch block in virtual capo mode will get you something close - although just using a real capo and playing up higher will actually sound better. Maybe stick a piece of foam under the strings at the bridge to reduce sustain.
 
Greg Ferguson said:
The “problem” with a used unit is you have no idea how it’s configured in relation to the new-from-the-factory settings unless you’re already really familiar with the system. In addition, we have a hard time helping you because we don’t know what changes have been made, resulting in a lot of backtracking to figure out what’s going on if there’s a problem.

I’d highly recommend starting from the factory default system using Fractal-Bot to run a full backup first, then reset to factory settings:
  1. In Edit go to Tools > Fractal-Bot then follow the instructions on p. 103 in the manual. That will provide you with a full backup of the system, presets and user cabs for later if you need them, but for now you need a clean slate.
  2. Jump to p. 102 and follow the directions under “Utilities: Reset Page”. That will wipe the previous owner’s changes.
  3. Install the latest release firmware to Firmware v6.02 “Cygnus X2” and the factory presets, following the directions in the .zip archives. That will return the unit to the standard from-the-factory system.
Later, if you want, you can reload what was on the system when you received it.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the tips, that is actually exactly what I did when I bought it which I think was a few months back now (except I didn't back up his stuff I wanted to start fresh and figure it out on my own at first).
I've been playing with factory presets and tweaking them some and a few that I created, trying out the different blocks and learn how to do some things I found on YouTube and the forums here so far until now.
Yesterday evening I got all the gift of tone downloads and installed everything so I have those now too, I'm super psyched about some of those they're really fun. I've started experimenting with dropping different IRs in some presets and experimenting with the DynaCabs in beta. All very cool.
Anyways good lookin' out thanks again.
 
hippietim said:
The tricky part about doing a ukulele is getting the right filter/eq to give you the sound of nylon strings. Other than that, the pitch block in virtual capo mode will get you something close - although just using a real capo and playing up higher will actually sound better. Maybe stick a piece of foam under the strings at the bridge to reduce sustain.
Click to expand...
hippietim said:
This is going to be long winded. Sorry.

A steel guitar is an electric guitar played with a slide bar - typically made of steel (hence the name). There's nothing particularly special about that - just play your guitar with a heavy steel slide. So I'm assuming what you're really after is the string bending that you control with your foot pedals and knee levers. That is not doable if you're processing all of the strings together - IOW, the normal way a guitar signal is processed. There's all sorts of effect processors and pedals that will enable you to do pitch shifting - including the various Fractal units. Even though the Fractal and other pitch shifters do know how to do polyphonic shifting, they couldn't possibly know which note to shift when you want to bend a particular string since there are so many strings you could a given note on.

The only way to pull this off is to process each string individually. If you want to bend a particular string, no problem you configure your pitch shifter to bend the range you want for just that string. So I've got a guitar with custom electronics that allows me to process each string individually. I run the 6 individual outputs into 3 Axe-Fx IIIs - each unit has two independent paths that process a single string. This rig can do what you ask and plenty more. It is not what I would call gig-friendly.

There are a number of Roland guitar processors that support the GK-3 pickup (sometimes called a MIDI pickup) that can do what you want. Because the GK-3 is not a MIDI pickup. It's just 6 little analog pickups similar to what I described above. It is up to the unit that you plug into to decide what to do with those 6 pickup signals. Early on, these were just used for doing MIDI synth stuff. Later Roland introduced the VG-8 and a slew of similar products. These things actual process the 6 string signals individually just like any other guitar processor. I don't if all of the VG series support doing pitch bending but I know the VG-99 does and so does the current SY-1000. In fact, the VG-99 has a factory preset that's a Tele with a B-bender. If you want to bend more strings, you'd need multiple pedals.
Click to expand...
Dude, your rig sounds badass. Very cool! Thanks for sharing that information, great rundown of it all.
 
Brian Dean-O said:
Just wondering if anyone's ever tried to find out if it can be done because I'd like to check it out if so.

On a side note what about other stringed instruments like violins and cellos and ukuleles and whatnot?
Click to expand...
You can use this preset with the FM3 and it sounds okay.

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/thre...some-free-irs-and-a-sloppy-rush-cover.191451/

Neosound has done some really impressive string work, but it is beyond the FM3 capability. Check out this thread: https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/axe-fx-iii-violin.138531/

I have a GR-55 I use for other instruments and that, or something similar, is probably a good investment if you do much of this sort of thing.
 
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