Speaker Drive and Thump appreciation thread!

yyz67 said:
Yep you can do that in Axe-Edit. I was talking about on the front panel if not using the editor.
Click to expand...
WOW!
Meanwhile, I realized!
I entered the editing not in AX Edit, but on the front panel of the device!
And indeed!!! - the basic setting is entered with the press of a button!
Thank you for drawing attention to this.
Because I've edited everything on the computer so far!
That's why this forum is so good!
 
GuitarGuy316 said:
When you say reset the amp block, couldn't just double click on those 3 settings in Axe Edit to set them to the new defaults rather than resetting the whole block and changing your gain/b/m/t, etc. back to what you had?
Click to expand...
The setting you get when you double-click in Axe-Edit can be different from the actual default values in the hardware.
 
Rex said:
The setting you get when you double-click in Axe-Edit can be different from the actual default values in the hardware.
Click to expand...
Can you say any particular cases where that's true?
Do you think those are bugs?
Do you know if Fractal thinks there are?
 
Dave Merrill said:
Can you say any particular cases where that's true?
Do you think those are bugs?
Do you know if Fractal thinks there are?
Click to expand...
Not at my gear at the moment, but if you play around a bit, you’ll find parameters where that’s the case. It’s been like that for years.

Fractal is aware of this. Turns out it’s not simple to make the Ax-Edit defaults match the hardware defaults.
 
Rex said:
Fractal is aware of this. Turns out it’s not simple to make the Ax-Edit defaults match the hardware defaults.
Click to expand...
I imagine the issue is for defaults that vary by model, like presence and depth.

For defaults that are consistent or universal (like speaker thump), AE should be able to match them (more easily) in principle.
 
Last edited:
yyz67 said:
I imagine the issue is for defaults that vary by model, like presence and depth.

For defaults that are consistent or universal (like speaker thump), AE should be able to match them (more easily) in principle.
Click to expand...
I see. Which do we think is "right"?
 
Dave Merrill said:
I see. Which do we think is "right"?
Click to expand...

I would think that resetting any block (including amps) sets every parameter to their true defaults (ground truth according to CC).

I imagine any other way to get defaults (eg via AE) is for convenience.

But I am no authority in these matters.
 
Last edited:
FractalAudio said:
Speaker Thump was a revelation after analyzing the Volterra kernels of guitar speakers driven near their power limits. I can't really say much more than that without giving away proprietary information.

For me it's a must when using FRFR. It evokes that feeling of standing in front of a cranked 4x12.
Click to expand...

Have you been able to measure a difference in 'compression'/'drive' between ceramic and alnico speakers? Should speaker drive be set differently for alnico speakers? I've always thought that the idea of alnico speakers compressing differently that ceramic speakers was a pile of BS, but it would be interesting to know if the measurements confirm or deny that.
 
jeffffff said:
Have you been able to measure a difference in 'compression'/'drive' between ceramic and alnico speakers? Should speaker drive be set differently for alnico speakers? I've always thought that the idea of alnico speakers compressing differently that ceramic speakers was a pile of BS, but it would be interesting to know if the measurements confirm or deny that.
Click to expand...
I would think that measuring that would require multiple sweeps of every speaker, driven at different levels (say, 3dB apart), using an RTA reference mic, to show the change in output relative to the change in input. Otherwise, you are just guessing with the drive/compression settings....
 
Joe Bfstplk said:
I would think that measuring that would require multiple sweeps of every speaker, driven at different levels (say, 3dB apart), using an RTA reference mic, to show the change in output relative to the change in input. Otherwise, you are just guessing with the drive/compression settings....
Click to expand...

I would assume that @FractalAudio did exactly that for a variety of speakers when creating this parameter, so I was wondering if they have any guidance as to how speaker type influences this effect (if at all). Like you said, without the data, you are just guessing, and they are probably the only ones that have the data to be able to answer this.
 
Sorry to be dense, but my default is still at 0 for ST. I’m reading there may be issues setting it one way or the other.

Thinking about the highlight shift right click method to set all at once.

What is the default value I should set to, or is a better method recommended?

Thanks in advance.
 
Guitarzan69 said:
Sorry to be dense, but my default is still at 0 for ST. I’m reading there may be issues setting it one way or the other.

Thinking about the highlight shift right click method to set all at once.

What is the default value I should set to, or is a better method recommended?

Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...
From 20.01 beta release: "Added Speaker Thump control to Amp block. Speaker Thump models the dynamic, nonlinear behavior of a guitar speaker. A value of 5.0 roughly corresponds to an amplifier running into a speaker rated at the same power as the amplifier, i.e., a 100W amplifier running into a 100W speaker. The reset value is a conservative 2.5 which represents, i.e., a 50W amp running into a 100W speaker. Note that the majority of the response is in the subsonic region and the effect is primarily tactile. Existing presets are not affected and the value will be zero.
 
I'm curious, say if I was using a Vox AC30 (30w) with a lnico Blue speaker (15w), would I add these together and then x by 5?

Meaning my thump setting should be 2.25? o_O
 
To find the total wattage of the cab for the purposes of calculating Speaker Thump, is it always calculated just by adding the individual wattage of each speaker? For the Chieftain amp with Chieftain DynaCab, if I wanted to match the Speaker Thump accurately, is this the right way to think about it?:

The amp is 40W, and the speakers are each 75W, so the cab is 150W. So it's 40 / 150 * 5 for a Speaker Thump of 1.33.

Seems simple, but I don't know if for some reason you'd need not simply to add the wattage of each individual speaker wattage in a cab, if there's more to it than that.

Also, I've just assumed from Cliff's examples that (Amp wattage / speaker wattage) x5 is the right calculation, but I just don't know for sure.
 
Watching this thread because really looking for developments on formulas for set-and-forget "accurate" values. I've already got enough knobs to twiddle endlessly...
 
sumitagarwal said:
Watching this thread because really looking for developments on formulas for set-and-forget "accurate" values. I've already got enough knobs to twiddle endlessly...
Click to expand...

The accuracy becomes more difficult with Dyna-Cabs, because, in my research, I couldn't tell for sure what version of the speaker(s) in some of those cabs might be.
 
sumitagarwal said:
Watching this thread because really looking for developments on formulas for set-and-forget "accurate" values. I've already got enough knobs to twiddle endlessly...
Click to expand...
Was in a similar boat as you. Was tweaking the speaker controls endlessly trying to figure out some sort of connection or equation for them without any luck.

I don't think there are equations that anyone can provide that will get the correct setting as every amp and speaker is going to be different even if it's the exact same model and most of the values you would need to calculate aren't readily available. The speaker thump you can use the calculation in the post above, but even then the wattage of the speaker has tolerance and the wattage of the amp can have massive tolerance ie) a 100W Marshall is typically almost 150W. So you can get in the ballpark, but you will need to use your ears to decide what feels/sounds best.

I'm not at my Axe Fx right now, but I believe I set the speaker comp to 0 now to avoid tweaking, speaker drive to 0-1 and thump I use the equation and then go up and down to find where I want it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom