Scene revert

[Bruno Ferreiro]

Hi, I'm wanting to use the Scene Revert function on to reverse when I turn on my wah and delay for some solos. I have a mission engineering with a toggle switch that I use to turn on the wah and delay or reverb occasionally for some solos. And the scene revert function does not respond with the external switches connected to Pedal 1-2-3 of my fm9. Only works with internal switches. Is there something I'm not understanding how to configure or is it not possible to use scene revert with external pedals connected to pedal inputs 1-2-3?

 

[Bakerman]

How are you actually assigning those switches to engage/bypass blocks? Scene revert won't apply if there's a bypass modifier, but you could use a Control Switch (or external switch assigned as a stand in for a control switch) as bypass modifiers and put the CS Per Scene to on/off as needed.

 

[Bruno Ferreiro]

How are you actually assigning those switches to engage/bypass blocks? Scene revert won't apply if there's a bypass modifier, but you could use a Control Switch (or external switch assigned as a stand in for a control switch) as bypass modifiers and put the CS Per Scene to on/off as needed.

Maybe what you mention is the problem I have. I'm going to try your way today and reply if I can fix it. I leave a print of how I have it assigned

 

[unix-guy]

Maybe what you mention is the problem I have. I'm going to try your way today and reply if I can fix it. I leave a print of how I have it assigned

It's not the modifier settings, it's the fact that you assigned the switch to the block Bypass and also the Mission has a latching switch.

 

[Bruno Ferreiro]

It's not the modifier settings, it's the fact that you assigned the switch to the block Bypass and also the Mission has a latching switch.

I am assigning the mission switch to bypass block. What would be the correct way to do it so that the scene revert works?

 

[Tremonti]

This is my #1 main wish for the Axe Fx 4....button assignable Scene Revert off/on. I have been told it literally CAN'T be done.

Sometimes I want to plan ahead and turn a couple things on that normally I would not want. Say turn on rotary to go on when you switch to your main scene for lead, for one particular song. Then turn it off and have that not come on when you switch to main scene. SUPER versatile.

 

[Bakerman]

This is my #1 main wish for the Axe Fx 4....button assignable Scene Revert off/on. I have been told it literally CAN'T be done.

This thread isn't about that, but do you have an exact quote or link to something FAS said about it being impossible?

For @Bruno Ferreiro : I think it's been mentioned that external latching switches currently can't work properly as stand-in switches for FCx tap functions, even if you configure the Axe-FX to know it's a latching switch. That would prevent using CS Per Scene states with the switch as a stand-in for a Control Switch. (Maybe @unix-guy can verify this to save you the trouble of doing the next suggestion if it turns out this actually works.)

What could work is to assign the switch to bypass functions of several blocks in the Setup: Midi/Remote: Bypass menu, and "Eff. Bypass Mode" to "Toggle" at the Midi/Remote: General page. Then use the block # from the first step when you want the switch to control it, and a different instance/number of the block when you don't. (The state of block #s you did assign the switch to could also be overridden with a CS as bypass modifier, using the CS Per Scene menu to set the state.)

 

[unix-guy]

This thread isn't about that, but do you have an exact quote or link to something FAS said about it being impossible?

For @Bruno Ferreiro : I think it's been mentioned that external latching switches currently can't work properly as stand-in switches for FCx tap functions, even if you configure the Axe-FX to know it's a latching switch. That would prevent using CS Per Scene states with the switch as a stand-in for a Control Switch. (Maybe @unix-guy can verify this to save you the trouble of doing the next suggestion if it turns out this actually works.)

What could work is to assign the switch to bypass functions of several blocks in the Setup: Midi/Remote: Bypass menu, and "Eff. Bypass Mode" to "Toggle" at the Midi/Remote: General page. Then use the block # from the first step when you want the switch to control it, and a different instance/number of the block when you don't. (The state of block #s you did assign the switch to could also be overridden with a CS as bypass modifier, using the CS Per Scene menu to set the state.)

Maybe important note: I just tried this on the Axe-FX III with a switch at the Pedal 2 jack, and the "Toggle" bypass style doesn't actually work properly. It can only bypass a block, then subsequent presses do nothing. I don't know if the same would happen with external switches and an FMx or FCx.

I don't know if I have any latching switches anymore.

They are mostly problematic with Fractal stuff unless you want the state to persist across changes (the opposite of this thread).

The simple answer is to replace the latching switch in the Mission pedal with a momentary one and then use the CS and CS Per Scene to handle the rest.

 

[Bakerman]

I don't know if I have any latching switches anymore.

A momentary switch would work for testing; hold it down to simulate latching in the pressed state. I'm wondering whether "Follow hardware" vs. "Virtual Toggle" in the FC Controllers: Remote menu has any influence on how the switch works when used as a stand-in switch. Or, does that only affect how the switch works as a modifier source?

 

[Bruno Ferreiro]

I tried different type of external switches i have, nothing works. It is not a physical problem with the type of switch.
I cant find the way to assign the external pedal 2 to a control switch to control the bypass of delay, wah and reverb to try what Bakerman mentioned.

 

[Bakerman]

1. Go to Setup (push "E" knob while on the Home screen) and enter the I/O menu. Page > to "Pedal" and make sure your switch's Pedal port # is set to "Latching".

2. In Setup: MIDI/Remote: General, set "Eff. Bypass Mode" to "TOGGLE".

3. Page > to MIDI/Remote: Bypass. Choose one block to test. Set its bypass controller to the switch's Pedal port #.

4. Add that block to a preset or choose a preset that already has it. Make sure there's no bypass modifier assigned if you aren't adding the block yourself at this step.

Now the switch should toggle the block state with each press, and scenes will put the block into its saved state when selected, if Scene Revert = ON.

(This works on the Axe-FX III also. I forgot I had the same switch assigned to Scene Increment earlier, which prevented a proper test of the bypass function. Previous post edited.)

 

[unix-guy]

A momentary switch would work for testing; hold it down to simulate latching in the pressed state. I'm wondering whether "Follow hardware" vs. "Virtual Toggle" in the FC Controllers: Remote menu has any influence on how the switch works when used as a stand-in switch. Or, does that only affect how the switch works as a modifier source?

I think it's the latter but I've never tried the Virtual Toggle since I never had a use case.

 

[Bruno Ferreiro]

1. Go to Setup (push "E" knob while on the Home screen) and enter the I/O menu. Page > to "Pedal" and make sure your switch's Pedal port # is set to "Latching".

2. In Setup: MIDI/Remote: General, set "Eff. Bypass Mode" to "TOGGLE".

3. Page > to MIDI/Remote: Bypass. Choose one block to test. Set its bypass controller to the switch's Pedal port #.

4. Add that block to a preset or choose a preset that already has it. Make sure there's no bypass modifier assigned if you aren't adding the block yourself at this step.

Now the switch should toggle the block state with each press, and scenes will put the block into its saved state when selected, if Scene Revert = ON.

(This works on the Axe-FX III also. I forgot I had the same switch assigned to Scene Increment earlier, which prevented a proper test of the bypass function. Previous post edited.)

It works!!! You're a genius! I asked a lot on many pages and no one could give me a clear answer! I am infinitely grateful for your time to help me. Now I have Scene revert working perfectly with my external switches. Thanks!!!!!

 

[Bakerman]

Glad to help. A couple other things that might be good to know:

With additional bypass functions assigned to the same Pedal #, the blocks will toggle together in scenes where their states match, or oppositely in scenes where they're stored in opposite states.

You can exclude all channels or any one* channel of a block in this pedal-bypass group from toggling, using a bypass modifier like before. If you never need the block to be bypassed while on a certain channel, any source that isn't moving will work; otherwise use a Control Switch or Scene Controller and set CS Per Scene or SC values (in the Controllers menu of FM9-Edit, but CS Per Scene is in the FC Per-Preset menu on the hardware) as needed in relevant scenes.

*Two or three channels can be excluded with additional modifiers set for Fast Position autoengage. You can use any parameter like balance with modifier min/max or start/mid/end adjusted so the parameter value isn't affected. Some modifiers use more CPU than others, and balance is a good choice for minimal CPU impact. If you run into the need to set this up and have any questions or want some screenshot examples... just remember this thread and ask.

 

[ggiiaaxx]

This is amazing, thanks!!!

 

[Tremonti]

This thread isn't about that, but do you have an exact quote or link to something FAS said about it being impossible?

For @Bruno Ferreiro : I think it's been mentioned that external latching switches currently can't work properly as stand-in switches for FCx tap functions, even if you configure the Axe-FX to know it's a latching switch. That would prevent using CS Per Scene states with the switch as a stand-in for a Control Switch. (Maybe @unix-guy can verify this to save you the trouble of doing the next suggestion if it turns out this actually works.)

What could work is to assign the switch to bypass functions of several blocks in the Setup: Midi/Remote: Bypass menu, and "Eff. Bypass Mode" to "Toggle" at the Midi/Remote: General page. Then use the block # from the first step when you want the switch to control it, and a different instance/number of the block when you don't. (The state of block #s you did assign the switch to could also be overridden with a CS as bypass modifier, using the CS Per Scene menu to set the state.)

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/thre...turn-this-on-and-off-yet.188768/#post-2341107

 

[Bakerman]

https://forum.fractalaudio.com/thre...turn-this-on-and-off-yet.188768/#post-2341107

I'm pretty sure Matt was just saying it can't be done then/now. I doubt there's something about the hardware that prevents it from being added, if FAS felt it was worth the effort.

 

[Tremonti]

I'm pretty sure Matt was just saying it can't be done then/now. I doubt there's something about the hardware that prevents it from being added, if FAS felt it was worth the effort.

They never say something is "not possible". It typically is ignored, silently work on and released or sometimes they say "we will look into this". Maybe I am wrong...."not possible" is not the norm term typically used.

Plus it seems like such an easy request to accommodate, yet here we are. So that doubles down that it may be tied into something that cannot be reallocated or the such. That is how I took it. Like the IV would have it but not the III.

Again. If I was given 1 singular wish to improve on the III. That would be it. Button assignable scene revert.

 

[Bakerman]

They never say something is "not possible". It typically is ignored, silently work on and released or sometimes they say "we will look into this". Maybe I am wrong...."not possible" is not the norm term typically used.

I don't know about all of that. You said "Is there a way to move the scene revert to within the layouts/preset?" I figured Matt's answer meant there's currently no way for a user to assign scene revert to a switch.

Here's something to think about: The Axe-FX III (and II) can already have Scene Revert enabled, yet not revert a scene when you switch to it with the editor, which presumably still uses short SysEx messages to change scenes.

A capable enough MIDI controller could have a layout toggle switch, with the remaining switches of one layout sending scene select CCs, and switches of the other layout sending SysEx scene select messages. I think this is within the Morningstar MCx controllers' capabilities. An MFC-101 could even do that if you used reveal along with per-preset custom sysex and the underlying IA functions set to scene select CCs and send w/ preset = off for those IAs, but obviously it's limited in other ways as an all-in-one Axe-FX III controller. Control switch MIDI (scene switches in one layout, CS in another) through a MIDI translator program (CC > SysEx) and back to the Axe-FX could even work, but there are only 6 control switches.

Do you think FAS really couldn't figure out how to add a similar FCx toggle function if they felt it was worth the effort?

 

[Tremonti]

I don't know about all of that. You said "Is there a way to move the scene revert to within the layouts/preset?" I figured Matt's answer meant there's currently no way for a user to assign scene revert to a switch.

Here's something to think about: The Axe-FX III (and II) can already have Scene Revert enabled, yet not revert a scene when you switch to it with the editor, which presumably still uses short SysEx messages to change scenes.

A capable enough MIDI controller could have a layout toggle switch, with the remaining switches of one layout sending scene select CCs, and switches of the other layout sending SysEx scene select messages. I think this is within the Morningstar MCx controllers' capabilities. An MFC-101 could even do that if you used reveal along with per-preset custom sysex and the underlying IA functions set to scene select CCs and send w/ preset = off for those IAs, but obviously it's limited in other ways as an all-in-one Axe-FX III controller. Control switch MIDI (scene switches in one layout, CS in another) through a MIDI translator program (CC > SysEx) and back to the Axe-FX could even work, but there are only 6 control switches.

Do you think FAS really couldn't figure out how to add a similar FCx toggle function if they felt it was worth the effort?

Just re-stating what was told....