Question re: Multiple Coaxial Speaker Rig

M

Mack

Member
I'm an AFX2 owner and, like many others, am waiting for the new FRFR products from Atomic and Matrix.

It's been suggested a couple of times on this forum (eg: Rex on the "Matrix FRFR 1x12 Coaxial Solution!" thread) that the reason you don't typically see coaxial drivers in a 2x12" or 4x12" configuration is because that would be counter-productive with respect to directivity (dispersion). My questions:

1. If this is true, does that mean that putting two 1x12" coaxial cabs or wedges side by side would be a bad idea? (Given that two 1x12" cabs side by side essentially become a 2x12", at least from the front baffle perpective)

2. Are there extablished best practices when setting up multiple 1x12" coaxial cabs?

Of course, it would be great if Jay Mitchell or Matt Button could weigh in on this, but perhaps if some of the experienced and knowledgeable members of this forum know the answers they could comment.

Thanks in advance for your time.
 
the benefits of a co-axial driver over a cone plus horn, is that the sound comes from one source, therefore limiting phase issues. with two Co-Axial speakers, you bring back the twin sources so re-introduce phase issues.

its a slilghtly different issue though - as with the co-axe design your bringing the source of two different frequency ranged together to give a coherent single source for the entire frequency spectrum. With twin speakers its two sources of a single freq spread.

i dont claim to have the answer - but I suspect that having twin co-axial speakers defeats the object of that design over a horn/driver design.
 
paulmapp8306 said:
the benefits of a co-axial driver over a cone plus horn, is that the sound comes from one source, therefore limiting phase issues. with two Co-Axial speakers, you bring back the twin sources so re-introduce phase issues.

its a slilghtly different issue though - as with the co-axe design your bringing the source of two different frequency ranged together to give a coherent single source for the entire frequency spectrum. With twin speakers its two sources of a single freq spread.

i dont claim to have the answer - but I suspect that having twin co-axial speakers defeats the object of that design over a horn/driver design.
Click to expand...

That makes sense. A bit disappointing though because I'm afraid that only having one driver would drown me out from the rest of the band during practice or a gig >_>
 
I would think that the issue of having one source period is smaller than the issue of having all frequencies coming from all sources...
 
It depends on what you're trying to accomplish. If you're just looking for more volume from personal monitors at one spot on the stage, the added directivity probably won't be an issue (or you could just go with a single speaker and feed it enough power to begin with). If both speakers are angled to face you, that reduces some of the multiple-driver problems.

If you want more stage coverage, you can angle the speakers so their patterns don't overlap so much, and actually get less directivity. If you're looking for stereo, you have no choice but to go with two speakers.

If you're running FOH, increased directivity can be your friend or your enemy, depending on what you're trying to accomplish.
 
Just like in a studio...if you are 5' away from the speaker, separate the speaker from each other about 5' making a triangle between you and the speakers...you should not have any problems using 2 this way...as good as is going to get...
 
Thanks for the comments, guys..... it seems that the general consensus is that side by side may not yield the best results, but separated and/or angled away from each other would be workable. Makes sense.

I guess it will come down to the individual performance characteristics of each specific 1x12" coaxial box. I will be very interested in Atomic's and Matrix's specific suggestions on how to best set up their respective 1x12" coaxial products in pairs (stereo or mono).
 
I use a couple of Verve 12ma coax a lot of times, placed vertically as a back line. I like to spread them a bit (even a foot or two), but sometimes they end up side by side do to space constraints. I haven't noticed any type of weirdness in that config (just less stereo, obviously), and they can get deafeningly loud. The key is probably that the speakers are not sharing the same baffle and enclosure (cab edges and even a bit of air between them)...

TT
 
Tommy Tequila said:
I use a couple of Verve 12ma coax a lot of times, placed vertically as a back line. I like to spread them a bit (even a foot or two), but sometimes they end up side by side do to space constraints. I haven't noticed any type of weirdness in that config (just less stereo, obviously), and they can get deafeningly loud. The key is probably that the speakers are not sharing the same baffle and enclosure (cab edges and even a bit of air between them)...

TT
Click to expand...

Thanks for this, TT. Good to know.
Cheers,
Mack
 
I have a custom 2/12 cab I put eminence beta12's w/eminence cross overs and they sound great. I run in stereo and thou I can tell there's some phase weirdness going on it seems it's to a less extent than the guitar speakers I had I the cab before
 
Mack said:
Thanks for the comments, guys..... it seems that the general consensus is that side by side may not yield the best results, but separated and/or angled away from each other would be workable. Makes sense.

I guess it will come down to the individual performance characteristics of each specific 1x12" coaxial box. I will be very interested in Atomic's and Matrix's specific suggestions on how to best set up their respective 1x12" coaxial products in pairs (stereo or mono).
Click to expand...

Hi Mack,
We will have two of the FRFR active 12" wedges ( and some other stuff ) in our demo room on May 20th and the Haydock Guitar show in England. I will take photos and videos in the room. If you happen to be in England then please pop your head in and we can try out a few things with you.

My best regards
Matt
 
NeoSound said:
I have a custom 2/12 cab I put eminence beta12's w/eminence cross overs and they sound great. I run in stereo and thou I can tell there's some phase weirdness going on it seems it's to a less extent than the guitar speakers I had I the cab before
Click to expand...



Interesting. I wonder if the Eminence coaxials inherently have less dispersion; I would have thought that a wider frequency spectrum would produce more phase issues, all other things being equal. Thanks for the post.
Mack
 
Mack said:
Interesting. I wonder if the Eminence coaxials inherently have less dispersion; I would have thought that a wider frequency spectrum would produce more phase issues, all other things being equal. Thanks for the post.
Mack
Click to expand...

I have a custom baffle that angles the speakers slightly left and right for a little more stereo seperation.... I recently got the Matrix gt1000 and this setup really does sound great..... very versatile ...great cleans and medium and high gain sounds. I mainly have to tune the bass eq so it doesn't get boomy, not on all patches but a few. I think its my cab because i ported it, I'm thinking about closing the ports back up?
 
MatrixAmp said:
Hi Mack,
We will have two of the FRFR active 12" wedges ( and some other stuff ) in our demo room on May 20th and the Haydock Guitar show in England. I will take photos and videos in the room. If you happen to be in England then please pop your head in and we can try out a few things with you.

My best regards
Matt
Click to expand...


Thanks for the invite, Matt. Unfortunately, I'm going to have to settle for the pics and vids....but I'm looking forward to it!
Cheers,
Mack
 
NeoSound said:
I have a custom baffle that angles the speakers slightly left and right for a little more stereo seperation.... I recently got the Matrix gt1000 and this setup really does sound great..... very versatile ...great cleans and medium and high gain sounds. I mainly have to tune the bass eq so it doesn't get boomy, not on all patches but a few. I think its my cab because i ported it, I'm thinking about closing the ports back up?
Click to expand...


It's a tough call when not all the presets are requiring the same EQ tweak.......
BTW, cool rig you've got: AFX thru GT1000 into coax 2x12 with angled baffle! Sweet.
Mack
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom