Preset Building: Tone Crafting

clarky

Axe-Master
due to popular demand...

erm... does 1 [Rex] count as popular demand??

here's a thread about crafting tones

a place for ideas, techniques and tutorials regarding the crafting of various tones and fx usage

to start.. how about we start building a preset together..
starting nice and simple
and little by little we grow it into a multi-functional, multi-dimmensional feature rich monster..
 
ok... so before we start... just a little thinking ahead...

our preset, being multi-functional should eventually contain at least:
- a clean tone
- a riffing tone [the amount of gain right now is not important]
- a soloing tone

given that the MFC is 5 switches wide we may as well add

- misc 1
- misc 2

although we've no idea what these will do yet..
for all our features we'll use scenes and modifiers in various combinations
plus will run 2 XP's [as that seems to be a common number]
 
I am interested in this thread as well..... since I know Clarky also relates to guitar cab tone building ;)

I have yet to convert to FRFR and still use guitar cabs. heh.... I frequently build my presets with the FXL block then a CAB block (to Output1 FOH) (Output2 to guitar cabs).

Would love to tag along for this ride :)
 
our own presets do not all have to be the same..
so we can make our own amp / cab / fx choices..

in here we talk about our choices / decisions
and drop our presets in here from time to time with audio clips etc..
so we can all work on our own and each others presets [debugging / enhancing / fine tuning]

the killer thing is that we talk about what we did and why we did it..
it's the thought processes, systematic approach and problem solving that really counts..

some of you guys out there create some killer presets..
this is a great place for you to chip in, share some knowhow and help the less experienced Axe-Bro's along..
 
I have yet to convert to FRFR and still use guitar cabs. heh.... I frequently build my presets with the FXL block then a CAB block (to Output1 FOH) (Output2 to guitar cabs).

there is an up side and a down side to this approach...

upside:
you will have real cabs on stage which look and sound awesome
you do not have to match amp block to cab so you just dial everything in to what you have
your 'on-stage' tone pool will have a kind of 'commonality' due to the voicing of your cab

downside:
you may not choose a consistent cab block type for each preset because some IR choices are the difference between your tone singing, or getting chewed up..
the blend of the FRFR and 'big box' solutions must work together, especially with respect to levels and overall EQ
splitting the tone like this means more CPU [don't sound like much right now, but in a big multi-function preset you may need to save just a few % cos it's the difference between working and not working]
this solution will impose some limitations on your grid layout and therefore some available grid real-estate

this FRFR / Cab blended solution has strengths and weaknesses..
the principle thing is being aware of them..
build on the strengths..
and around the weaknesses
 
Most cool. Thanks, Clarky!


due to popular demand...

erm... does 1 [Rex] count as popular demand??
Yes. One Rex constitutes a majority. I tell myself that all the time. :)


now we need a starting point idea
Let's see..a starting point...how about...


...a rich, chimey, chorusy clean. Thoughtful and pensive, but bold. Chorusy, maybe, but not ambient. Maybe a hint of hair. Something you might use to start a ballad; said ballad might develop an attitude later in the song.
 
a rich, chimey

with clean tones, too much bass will make them real boomy..
and even playing softly won't stop the boomy notes standing out..
with your low end there is always a contest between bass and low mid's
you have have plenty of one or the other, but rarely can both be strong simultaneously..

a rich clean sounds to me like it'll benefit from reasonably strong lo mids rather than strong bass...
but of course we'll goof with both combinations..

chmiey tells me you want sparkly highs..
this is beyond treble, up in the 5k+ area..
sometimes eq cannot provide the whole solution here..
so you can excite the highs with other fx

chorusy clean..

ok.. so first think what the chorus is there for..
we can use it to create that typical chorusing effect..
but surely that is the sort of thing we'd want control over..
either switch it in / out via an XS or scene
or fade it in / out via an XP

but to create that general sparkle and stereo spread, I like to head for the pitch shifter because it's less intrussive..

solution... have both...
the shifter is always on.. gently in the backgroud adding it's thing..

the chorus will be under control to punch in and out as our performance needs demand

Thoughtful and pensive, but bold. .

ok.. I guess this means that we'll be trying to find that fine line between strength and ambience
a strong thick tone, not overly glassy / polished
but just enough ambience to make it moody...

this tells me that the chorus and reverb should be under the control of the XP
then during performance you can choose to drift away from strength and towards ambience at will..
now you can have your cake and get to eat it

Chorusy, maybe, but not ambient. .

as above..
but maybe this defines our default / starting point tone
so let the shifter handle the 'chorusy' for the default tone
and let the XP suck out some power and push in the 'exotics'

Maybe a hint of hair. .

as we have what is deemed a clean tone..
let's keep it on the clean side for our regular playing strengths
but we allow it to start getting a touch of hair when we dig in
this is another expressive feature added to our performance arsenal

and how about if when the XP draws the tone toward the ambient, it drains just enough power to tame the hair..

we can get quite subtle with this

Something you might use to start a ballad; said ballad might develop an attitude later in the song.

there's a few ways to develop the attitude...
an nice easy one would be to assign the amp: boost to a modifier
you hit the switch and your tone throws down..

ok.. first job is to find a good amp / cab combination..
needs to be an amp that's good on the clean side of things cos that's the main job..
but check also how it sounds with higher gain settings and with the boost on..
we need to find that amp that can cut it with all of our wants and needs..

we want the cleans to be thick / full-bodied
we want the dirtier side of things to work too..
some clean amps don't play nice when you heat them up..
maybe we could explore the drive block for this..

personally..
my first port of call will be:
5153 Green
Herbert ch2
 
a rich clean sounds to me like it'll benefit from reasonably strong lo mids rather than strong bass...
I think on some level my ears knew this, but my conscious brain didn't. Good stuff.


chmiey tells me you want sparkly highs..
this is beyond treble, up in the 5k+ area..
sometimes eq cannot provide the whole solution here..
so you can excite the highs with other fx
Didn't know that...


ok.. so first think what the chorus is there for..
but surely that is the sort of thing we'd want control over..
either switch it in / out via an XS or scene
or fade it in / out via an XP
Gotta conserve my controls here. I can only conveniently get to one XP and one IA.


ok.. I guess this means that we'll be trying to find that fine line between strength and ambience
a strong thick tone, not overly glassy / polished
but just enough ambience to make it moody...
This. ^^^



Random thought here: to keep things tidy and OCD-compliant, how about we use this thread for crafting individual tones—building a dish of a certain flavor—then import those tones into the other thread to morph them into a full meal? Does that make sense, or am I creating an artificial division?
 
don't know about you lot but I've found my amp for this one...

the Trip-Tik
I fired up this amp to see what the fuss was all about. It really is a sweet one. I'm having a bit of a challenge, though, in coming up with a clean tone. Drive on 0.02 is too hairy. Drive on 0.01 is closer. Drive on 0.00 mutes the whole thing. All are soundign a bit lifeless, even with level compensation.
 
you can drop the drive and the in-put trim together..

I could always save the Trip-Tik for the riffing tone and find an alternative amp that's a little cleaner [but still has a little rock'n'roll in it]

I'll have a lil' snoop around
 
Random thought here: to keep things tidy and OCD-compliant, how about we use this thread for crafting individual tones—building a dish of a certain flavor—then import those tones into the other thread to morph them into a full meal? Does that make sense, or am I creating an artificial division?

hmmm dunno... could end up with threads all over...

there is merit in keeping everyone's input and great ideas in a single place..

maybe just see what happens.. I've got no idea how this will turn out...
in the mean time.. I'm gonna find me some clean hair.. lol..
 
I gave the Trip-Tik my best shot. Its clean just isn't working for me. I'll have to wait until the clean channel comes out with the next firmware.

Next up: 5153. I've heard your raves about its clean tone. Time to see what makes it fly.
 
a rich, chimey, chorusy clean. Thoughtful and pensive, but bold. Chorusy, maybe, but not ambient. Maybe a hint of hair. Something you might use to start a ballad; said ballad might develop an attitude later in the song.

I don't smell wine, I just drink it a lot and when I do it's Shiver Clean. ;)
 
Cleannig the TripTik is like cleaning the other hi-gain amps [5153Red and Herbert ch3 etc]
it takes some drastic reduction in drive in input level..
and then you have to fix the tone up after cos all the thinning out that occurs..
all that stuff is fine in a morphing situation..
but no what we're after here..
so my first choice [the TripTik] was not a good one - I'll save that for later..

clean is one thing.. [makes me think of the HiWatt / JC120 / Fender Twin types]
but clean with nice hair that is not quite a crunch is something else..
my intuition says, rather can add drive to a naturally clean amp, tame the gain in a naturally dirty amp..

and this is why I'll be heading for the JCM, 5153Green, Herbert ch2

I've still not tried these yet..
spent the last couple of days building a drum kit in BFD2 for another project I'm working on..
the time consuming part is always the MIDI map for the many articulations for each kit piece..
a slow and dull job... but needed to be done..
 
I'll have to follow this thread and other similar ones for ideas. I have not built any presets, just play a few different amps a day. Not in any band, so don't specific songs/lists to do. Pretty much treating it like an unorgainized store with not amp type sections.
 
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