Please explain how to run 4 cable method with a stereo XLR to FoH

T

Trey

Member
My main amp is a Fuchs ODS50. I want to run AxeFX wah, vol and distortion into the Fuchs preamp input and use the effects loop of the Fuchs for AxeFX delays, reverbs, Leslie cab, ect. Thing is, I would like those effects to be summed mono in my rig(no cab mod) but stereo out of the xlrs (with cab mod) to the house. How do I accomplish this?
 
Trey said:
My main amp is a Fuchs ODS50. I want to run AxeFX wah, vol and distortion into the Fuchs preamp input and use the effects loop of the Fuchs for AxeFX delays, reverbs, Leslie cab, ect. Thing is, I would like those effects to be summed mono in my rig(no cab mod) but stereo out of the xlrs (with cab mod) to the house. How do I accomplish this?
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Why not just put an FX loop block in your preset that sends same signal to output 2 and run that into your non-cab rig. Some minor preset rearranging may be necessary.
 
It's a bit tricky but, you'll have to use the feedback send and return blocks to re-route the post effects output before the stereo cab block back to the right channel of the FX Loop block input. You'd then use Output 2 right to feed the power amp of your Fuchs.

Like this:
Capture.JPG

Notice the panning of the rows in the FX Loop block. The wah, drive, etc, use Out 2 L, while the post effects like delay and reverb use Out 2 R. The Vol/Pan block after the Return block is to allow for panning the stereo post effects down to mono. In this case, pan both sides full right. Without it, you'd only get one side of the post effects going to your amp.
 
mr_fender said:
It's a bit tricky but, you'll have to use the feedback send and return blocks to re-route the post effects output before the stereo cab block back to the right channel of the FX Loop block input. You'd then use Output 2 right to feed the power amp of your Fuchs.

Like this:
View attachment 40710

Notice the panning of the rows in the FX Loop block. The wah, drive, etc, use Out 2 L, while the post effects like delay and reverb use Out 2 R. The Vol/Pan block after the Return block is to allow for panning the stereo post effects down to mono. In this case, pan both sides full right. Without it, you'd only get one side of the post effects going to your amp.
Click to expand...


I see it. That's good!
 
mr_fender said:
It's a bit tricky but, you'll have to use the feedback send and return blocks to re-route the post effects output before the stereo cab block back to the right channel of the FX Loop block input. You'd then use Output 2 right to feed the power amp of your Fuchs.

Like this:
View attachment 40710

Notice the panning of the rows in the FX Loop block. The wah, drive, etc, use Out 2 L, while the post effects like delay and reverb use Out 2 R. The Vol/Pan block after the Return block is to allow for panning the stereo post effects down to mono. In this case, pan both sides full right. Without it, you'd only get one side of the post effects going to your amp.
Click to expand...
I love this but I'm confused on one thing, doesn't doing this mean that he is only sending the preamp section of his amp to the cab block and then out to front of house?
 
Nope. Output 1 goes to FOH. It's the full chain. The feedback blocks send the non-cab signal back to the FX loop block. Panning separates the two parts of the chain between Out 2 L and R.
 
mr_fender said:
Nope. Output 1 goes to FOH. It's the full chain. The feedback blocks send the non-cab signal back to the FX loop block. Panning separates the two parts of the chain between Out 2 L and R.
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Sorry I'm still confused, I get that the guitar plugs into the axe, goes thru the wah, driv, etc. then it hits the amps preamp and from the fx loop send back into the axe for the post effects. Then the send and return feed the post effects back into the power amp thru the fx loop return on the amp. What I'm not seeing is how after all of that happens how that amps power amp is routed back into the signal chain so that it hits the cab block and out to foh. I'm really interested in doing this I'm just not getting it, if you can really break it down super basic I'd appreciate it. Thanks
 
Oh I see what you are saying. Yes, you would need to add an amp block set clean between the feedback send and cab blocks to simulate the power section of the Fuchs for the FOH tone. I missed that in my example above. Good catch.
 
mr_fender said:
Oh I see what you are saying. Yes, you would need to add an amp block set clean between the feedback send and cab blocks to simulate the power section of the Fuchs for the FOH tone. I missed that in my example above. Good catch.
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My issue with that is that if your going to model the poweramp section of the amp (that's the tube section that we are all trying to achieve) then there is literally no point to using a real amp and should just use the model in the Axe.
 
I've been messing with this setup but the cab sound is going into effects loop of the amp. How can I separate it so the cab is for the xlr outs to the house? I don't want to mic my cabs just because I'm using 4 cable.
 
Check the manual section about connections. It shows exactly what you're trying to do.
 
Rex said:
Check the manual section about connections. It shows exactly what you're trying to do.
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The manual doesn't have an example that would do what he asked. Post #3 in this thread does though.

Trey said:
I've been messing with this setup but the cab sound is going into effects loop of the amp. How can I separate it so the cab is for the xlr outs to the house? I don't want to mic my cabs just because I'm using 4 cable.
Click to expand...

That would mean you did something differently from the example in post #3 or have the wrong connections. Could you post your current preset or a screenshot of the routing, and describe all connections to/from the Axe-FX?
 
No. I must have something fundamentally off. Lets get rid of everything except the needed components. I need 4 cable setup which is of course mono and no cab emulation, and stereo xlr out WITH cab emulation. Cabling is:

gtr in front
output 2 L to amp IN
output 1 L to amp RETURN
amp SEND to INPUT 2 L

In the audio menu:

input 1- Left
input 2- Left
output 1- stereo
output 2- L+R sum

The layout must have FXLoop and a Cab obviously. What else?
 
Output 2R (not 1L) should connect to amp return. Output 1 L & R will be the stereo output processed by cab block.

Output 2 mode needs to be "stereo".

Feedback send & return blocks are required as shown in post #3. Turn up the send & output level parameters in the send block. (Alternatively you can branch to it in a separate row, and only turn up the send level. This could be useful when short on space, placing in same column as cab.) Set RTN mix to 100%.

The vol/pan block between RTN and FXL may be useful for summing stereo effects to mono. Set Pan L & Pan R values to 100 (fully right).

Note the FXL block's pan settings for the two rows feeding it. This is important to keep signals separate and avoid a feedback loop. (The vol/pan actually takes care of this for row 3 if used, but I would suggest panning both rows at FXL anyway. That also gives an easy way to compare L+R summed vs. right-only effects by bypassing the vol/pan block.)
 
Yes and Yes. Thank you. Feedback send is super hot in my setup. Running at only 4%. Working though.
 
I am trying to do exactly this.
how to run 4 cable method with a stereo XLR to FoH.
Can anyone show a preset layout to make this work?

Thank you
Jamie
 
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