Musicians Ears vs. Audience Ears

Tone chasing can be very rewarding, but don't have any expectations.

At a bar gig many years ago the bar owner told us to turn down during soundcheck, even though we were definitely NOT playing loud. The next song was "perfect " according to him. I was using a clean tone throughout the song he approved of. The next song was a dirty guitar tone and he raced up and said "I told you to turn down". I turned my amp down to a barely audible tone and stomped on my dirt pedal and asked him if it was loud. He said "YES". I then cranked the amp up and played a (much louder) clean tone and again asked him again if he thought it was loud. He said "That's perfect".
I pointed out the "as-is" clause in our contract that allows us to control our sound and that we could leave, but he had to pay us anyways. He cursed my ancestors and never bothered us again. Funny thing is, it was a biker bar and the patrons freakin' LOVED us. He hired us back (profitable for him) even though he HATED us.
Point is; Some people have no stinkin' idea. Play for yourself and your audience, but don't have any expectations. I chase tone mainly for myself, my band mates and some friends that regularly come to hear us play. Some people like anything that's distorted..."YOU GUYS ROCK". Some folks will only respond to movement and visuals. Do your thing and if they don't like it...
 
aziz said:
I think people do hear thw difference, they just might be unable to describe what it is, or analyze it.
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+1
An audience member might not use terms like "chime", "haunting mids" or "brown sound" but good tone (in the context of the mix) is noticed and appreciated by most music fans. Great tone is not necessarily as important as great rhythm but there's a reason why so many great bands have great tone.
 
Most music fans, audience people etc. don't even use the term "tone".

"Tone? Like, tone deaf? Yeah the singer is probably tone deaf. Is that what you mean? I have to pee."
 
strat714 said:
Tone chasing can be very rewarding, but don't have any expectations.

The next song was a dirty guitar tone and he raced up and said "I told you to turn down". I turned my amp down to a barely audible tone and stomped on my dirt pedal and asked him if it was loud. He said "YES". I then cranked the amp up and played a (much louder) clean tone and again asked him again if he thought it was loud. He said "That's perfect".
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Lots of people still don't like a 'distorted' tone. Especially, and still by and large, females. They don't like that 'dirty' sound. It's harsh. And lead guitar wails, like a child wailing. It's [hurts]. Notice how the chicks love Beck, though. An exception to the gain rule are Stel's tones, which are smooth and kind. Lessons.
 
I have been gigging in my first full fledged COVER band (after almost 18 years of original bands) for about 2 and 1/2 years, I dont get obsessive over my tone as far as authenticity but I do try to make my tones make sense. We cover from classic rock to modern (as most do) and I have 5 banks that I use (4 presets each).
Bank 1 is Classic Rock, my main tone is Plexi based & the rest in that bank follow suit.
Bank 2 is my Hair Metal & my rhythm tone is currently the HBE
Bank 3 is my "General" bank I use it the most. the tones are good for about anything.
Bank 4 the rhythm is a Mark IV I call it my "smooth 80's session bank"
Bank 5 is my Modern bank most tones are Mesa based.

There are some more specific presets like we do Love Song by Tesla so I have a preset that does the Leslie sounds one setting is fast & cleaner and the other is slower and dirtier for the intro. We also do songs like Separate Way and Working for the Weekend but dont have a keyboardist so I have a preset in my 80's session bank that mimics keys. I use the same lead patch for all my banks just because.

After all this time this is what I have found. The average Joe isn't going to know that I am using a Marshall amp when it should be a Mesa or Fender etc. But their ears do recognize when something is drastically different. You cant convincingly sell Hot Blooded by Foreigner with the Metallic Black Album tone. I think the biggest impact is on my playing and enjoyment. When I play The Boys Are Back in Town (& I LOVE Thin Lizzy) with my 1960 tribute LP Standard though one of the A2's Plexi's it just feels cool as shit and I think I sell the performance better. Or playing Girls Girls Girls with my Adrian Smith Jackson and the HBE or a 3 Days Grace song with my LP Classic and a Mesa etc just make me have more fun, helps me catch the vibe and just play better.

I guess in thd end it's all about what truly makes you happy. When I started this cover band I promised myself 2 things 1- this will be a for profit gig and 2 I WILL enjoy it. The reason we stay booked in an area with a sluggish club music scene is because the venues and more importantly the customers dig the performance we bring and I have no doubt that the A2's plays a big role in thAt ( I get asked all the time how did I do this or that or sound "just like....." most of the time the answer is the A2)& thanks to the tones I get from the A2 I am having damn good time playing these tunes (except for the Kid Rock & You Shook Me All Night Long) So for me its win/win.
 
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Two somewhat relative thoughts

1- I don't understand why a guitarist will spend so much time and effort on gear and tone and the little things no one else would notice- meanwhile they go on stage with an awful singer who can't sing one note in tune the entire night.
(This applies to guitarists than axe fx users- because all the vocal stuff i've seen of forum members post have been very good)

2- Guitarist take things to a level where it's detrimental to the public and they don't realize it. For example- implementing a full stereo rig live- it probably does more bad than good in many ways.
(but we CAN do it- so we still do it- I'm guilty)
 
It's been shown in cognitive neuroscience that brains of musicians process sound differently than the brains of non-musicians. In the musician's brain, the more analytical parts of the brain are activated in addition to emotional and language centers of the brain which are activated in the audience.
 
Getting a perfect tone is what keeps us guitarists alive and never satisfied. I think it's an essential part of being a guitarist. That being said it's maybe a bit naive to think that the crowd cares as much as we do. Of course they care but if a guitar sound is "okay" instead of "amazing" it probably still won't have an effect on how they think the show went. :)
 
Some of us can obsess, absolutely. I tend not to. I remember playing a gig a few years back with a Zoom 8080 through an AC50. We played a few U2 covers and had people say they thought it was the CD. I was playing a Jackson Soloist at the time and it made me realise that the law of diminishing returns kicks in on everything we do musically. We can spend huge amounts of money on gear to get us that little bit closer, we can spend a lot of time to get us 1% tonally closer, but for most people (including musicians) that 1% will not be noticed. As an aside, The Loudness Wars, iTunes mp3 download bitrate vs. lossless, vinyl vs. CD vs. mp3..... all of these are ongoing debates because most people do not notice or even care about the differences.

The real payoff is in how we feel about our tone and how we play as a result. If we are happier with our tone (even if it is a placebo effect) we will play better and that's what really counts.
 
I stopped chasing my tail over tone when I realized the sound guy can make or break the final product.

Audience hears = source times mix (and PA)

If either the source or the mix is bad... the result is bad. So if I have a world class sound guy... then I can sweat about the finer details of "tone". Otherwise I'll incrementally improve my tone over the years to what I like to hear. Unfortunately I regularly get "I wish I could hear you... you looked like you were right into it." from people in the crowd... because of course we don't need anything but the kick drum and lead vocal in FOH. Dammit!
 
Clark Kent said:
Getting a perfect tone is what keeps us guitarists alive and never satisfied.
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I haven't heard of any Art Music performer experiencing this once they find a great, or at least very good, instrument. They are alive, and then soar through the greatness of the instrument. And they can do more with one than with ten amplifiers and cabinets.
 
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