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Loud crash sound when changing scenes

karmar

Member
When I use the navigate arrows to go up and down through scenes, I hear a loud crash (very short duration - like a gun shot going off much much MUCH louder than any of my scenes) between some scenes. It does not happen every time - but sometimes it is so loud I worry about blowing a speaker!

Everything is fine once I start playing, but it would be nice if I didnt get that jarring gunshot sound when going between scenes. Has anyone else had this problem?
 
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karmar

Member
Thanks for your reply... There is another issue that may be related now that I consider your comment... In my SCENE 3 I have a Blues Jr - and sometimes when I go to that scene, the input drive and level knobs are all the way up! I know I would never have left it like that especially since I use that scene to play jazz with the drive all the way down - so I suspect that AxeEditIII may be intermittently changing my settings somehow. Could that be the issue?
 

karmar

Member
Here is my preset. (I just got the gun shot going from scene 3 to scene 2 - then when I tried to reproduce it, I only get a tiny shot - as if a gate has choked the loud sound - most of the time I get that choked off gun shot sound - is that normal???
 

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karmar

Member
As you can see in my preset, I had two amps in series - I always bypass one so I am only using one amp at a time. I just tried putting them in parallel and I dont get the crack any more. So this would seem to correct the problem - but when amps are in parallel with one of them bypassed, do you get bleed through from the bypassed amp summing with your non-bypassed amp???
 

karmar

Member
Ok - Thanks for your help! Is there a reference guide somewhere that has these kinds of do's and dont's? How did you know that this was a disallowed configuration?
 

karmar

Member
??? The "FractalAudio" moderator is "Cliff"???

Regarding the bypass mode: I tried to rewire my preset using MUTE/THRU with my two amps in parallel, but I cant get the bypass mode state to save with each scene - as I go through and save successive scenes, the previous ones change their bypass mode settings. Is the state of the bypass mode parameter supposed to be saved with each preset? (I am wondering if I might have a corrupted preset...) The parallel amp idea works if I use a mixer instead of using MUTE/THRU - but then I have to add an additional block, I would rather use the MUTE/THRU idea...
 

MrGuitarabuse

Fractal Fanatic
Ok - Thanks for your help! Is there a reference guide somewhere that has these kinds of do's and dont's? How did you know that this was a disallowed configuration?
I dont think there is a reference guide for this, but when it comes to Amps, as rarely as you would put them in series with REAL amps, dont do it with AXE-FX either.
Effects on the other hand are basically "anything goes" depending on your preferences, pre/post Amp, in parallel or series etc
 

parlopower

Inspired
I was actually wondering about the Amp block, why the bypass mode is not set to mute by default. Maybe a worthy implementation for the next firmware?
 

chris

Legend!
I was actually wondering about the Amp block, why the bypass mode is not set to mute by default. Maybe a worthy implementation for the next firmware?
People who use real amps might Bypass the Amp block and then wonder why they get zero sound.

Thru is a default that makes sense in most situations.
 

Zedhed

Inspired
??? The "FractalAudio" moderator is "Cliff"???
Yup.......He da man. If he says don't do it...don't do it.

As someone else said, you wouldn't use two real amps in series so let common sense prevail.

BTW, saving the preset saves all scenes within that preset. No need to save every scene.
 

karmar

Member
Yes, there is: the wiki.

The "not in series" thing is covered here.
Thanks Yek! I will read through that whole Wiki as it has a lot of stuff I have been wondering about!

I will mention that I was not able to get the bypass mode suggestion to work for me so I ended up using a mixer block. I think the reason it did not work is because in every scene, I had two amp blocks with one needing to be muted- for example I would set AMP 1 (now in parallel) to be muted. So, I think that, when I went in and set that particular "channel" to mute - that action muted this channel for all instances this channel was used in other scenes. And when I went to use that channel in another scene, I would unmute it there - only to find that I screwed up the previous scene where I wanted it muted! So, to switch between the parallel blocks, the mixer works fine for me - I just need two channels for my mixer to toggle between the two parallel amps. I am now explosion free when changing between scenes!

Also - some people have noted that it is of course common sense to never put two amplifiers in series in real life, so why would anyone ever think it might be OK to do so in the AxeFx virtual world??? But I would argue that it is equally against common sense in real life to put two amplifiers in parallel since you would have the voltage from one output transformer interacting with the output of the other parallel output transformer. Even if one amp was muted, its output transformer would still be engaged in parallel with the other amp and receiving power surges from its sister amp in parallel. There are all kinds of things that are OK in the Axe virtual world that would be catastrophic in the real world - for example placing a reverb processor after the power amp stage of an amplifier. Or even putting a switch behind the power stage of an amplifier without proper loading that would not cause an inductance spike upon breaking a current in the output transformer. Or even using a signal switch to happily switch high voltage power from tube amps as I have done with my mixer solution! We just have to learn what is permitted in the wonderful and mysterious virtual world of the AxeFx. The Wiki Yek pointed to is a great resource along with this forum which is even more valuable! Thanks to whoever contributed to the Wiki and thanks to everyone here who has helped me in my learning curve!!!
 
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Tahoebrian5

Fractal Fanatic
im not sure if you are confused or if it's just a terminology breakdown, but just to be clear, you cannot mute (or turn off) a channel, only the entire block. You can choose which channel is active per scene though, and you can turn the block on or off per scene.
 

yek

Moderator
Moderator
I will mention that I was not able to get the bypass mode suggestion to work for me so I ended up using a mixer block. I think the reason it did not work is because in every scene, I had two amp blocks with one needing to be muted- for example I would set AMP 1 (now in parallel) to be muted. So, I think that, when I went in and set that particular "channel" to mute - that action muted this channel for all instances this channel was used in other scenes. And when I went to use that channel in another scene, I would unmute it there - only to find that I screwed up the previous scene where I wanted it muted! So, to switch between the parallel blocks, the mixer works fine for me - I just need two channels for my mixer to toggle between the two parallel amps. I am now explosion free when changing between scenes!
There's no need to use a Mixer.

The Bypass Mode parameter is set per channel of the block. Its setting applies to every scene where the block is set to that channel.
Whether the effect block is actually bypassed or not, is not determined by that parameter. That's specified per scene.

The stored state of the block (engaged or bypassed) doesn't effect other scenes, when switching scenes on the front panel.

When switching remotely, the state of a block can be different from the stored state, depending on the Scene Revert parameter.
 

karmar

Member
There's no need to use a Mixer.

The Bypass Mode parameter is set per channel of the block.
There's no need to use a Mixer.

The Bypass Mode parameter is set per channel of the block. Its setting applies to every scene where the block is set to that channel.
Whether the effect block is actually bypassed or not, is not determined by that parameter. That's specified per scene.

The stored state of the block (engaged or bypassed) doesn't effect other scenes, when switching scenes on the front panel.

When switching remotely, the state of a block can be different from the stored state, depending on the Scene Revert parameter.
Its setting applies to every scene where the block is set to that channel.
Whether the effect block is actually bypassed or not, is not determined by that parameter. That's specified per scene.

The stored state of the block (engaged or bypassed) doesn't effect other scenes, when switching scenes on the front panel.

When switching remotely, the state of a block can be different from the stored state, depending on the Scene Revert parameter.

Thanks for your detailed response! OK... So to be clear, in AxeEditIII there is a BYPASS MODE which can be set to THRU or MUTE. This is the parameter I was trying to set which I believe ended up stored in my AMP CHANNEL and remained in this state whenever I would call up that channel. Does that sound right? Then, there is a BYPASS BUTTON that can be "engaged or bypassed" which is the same as double clicking on the amp block icon to bypass the block. This is what I think you and TahoeBrian were referring to. You cant use the BYPASS BUTTON to bypass an amp in parallel because when you bypass a block it passes the unprocessed clean signal. So do you agree I need a mixer? Or am I still misunderstanding the situation?

My problem with use the BYPASS MODE parameter in AxeEdit is that it definitely changes in a previous scene when I edit it later in a different scene. I attempted this many times trying to figure out what was going on - starting by setting the BYPASS MODE to THRU or MUTE for the 1 amp block I wanted muted in each of my scenes. I would work my way through each scene, then go back to check things and they were always screwed up when I returned and checked previous scenes - thus my conclusion that my subsequent settings of CHANNELS in SCENES were changing my previous settings of CHANNELS.

OK - here is the simplest formulation of my understanding of scenes and channels. Let's say I only want to use 1 channel of an amp block for each of 8 scenes. If I set up scene 1 channel A with high gain, then try to use the channel A in scene 2 with low gain - when I change the gain of channel A in scene 2, it also changes the gain of channel A in scene 1. (I just verified this by empirical testing...) So when I changed the BYPASS MODE in my channel A in a subsequent scene, it also changed the BYPASS MODE in previous occurrences.
 
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