Liquid Foot Jr. with Square 1 Expression Pedal

[raz]

Okay, no one on the Liquid-Foot forum seems to have an answer for this, and seems Jeff's too busy to respond to my PM, so I'll try here.

I have a Liquid-Foot Jr. and one of Stilwel's Square 1 expression pedals with a toe switch. I want to configure it as Jeff describes in a Tips and Tricks post on the Liquid-Foot forum. I want the pedal to be a volume pedal until I click the toe switch, then have it be a wah pedal. Jeff's article assumes a Liquid-Foot Pro, I was hoping the same process would apply to the Jr.

The Square 1 seems to meet Jeff's specifications for this - the toe switch jack is a TRS jack, but wired only TS. I can get it working as either volume or wah, so the pedal is working.

I've configured an IA on the Jr as a step-through, again according to Jeff's instructions. Here's the problem: I need to configure the toe switch on the Square 1 as an IALink and point it at the IA switch with my step through program. But the JR will not allow me to get to the data parameter to set the IA number. I can set the special IALink command (003), but any switch I click after that (select, next, or any other) takes me to the next menu. I can't get to the data parameter.

Any ideas? Does the Jr not really support IALink?

Thanks.

 

[javajunkie]

Okay, no one on the Liquid-Foot forum seems to have an answer for this, and seems Jeff's too busy to respond to my PM, so I'll try here.

I have a Liquid-Foot Jr. and one of Stilwel's Square 1 expression pedals with a toe switch. I want to configure it as Jeff describes in a Tips and Tricks post on the Liquid-Foot forum. I want the pedal to be a volume pedal until I click the toe switch, then have it be a wah pedal. Jeff's article assumes a Liquid-Foot Pro, I was hoping the same process would apply to the Jr.

The Square 1 seems to meet Jeff's specifications for this - the toe switch jack is a TRS jack, but wired only TS. I can get it working as either volume or wah, so the pedal is working.

I've configured an IA on the Jr as a step-through, again according to Jeff's instructions. Here's the problem: I need to configure the toe switch on the Square 1 as an IALink and point it at the IA switch with my step through program. But the JR will not allow me to get to the data parameter to set the IA number. I can set the special IALink command (003), but any switch I click after that (select, next, or any other) takes me to the next menu. I can't get to the data parameter.

Any ideas? Does the Jr not really support IALink?

Thanks.

I'll give it a whirl on my pro. Have tried using the editor and assigning the value in the CC parameter. Global-expression pedal setup-type = IA trigger. cc value - IA?

 

[raz]

I'll give it a whirl on my pro. Have tried using the editor and assigning the value in the CC parameter. Global-expression pedal setup-type = IA trigger. cc value - IA?

Hmm...no, didn't think of that. I'll give it a go tonight when I get home from work. Thank you muchly!

 

[raz]

Have tried using the editor and assigning the value in the CC parameter. Global-expression pedal setup-type = IA trigger. cc value - IA?

Sheesh...what an ordeal. Yeah, that did the trick, Java. First I had to get the Mission Kit-M; a momentary switch. Received that tonight, then spent until 5:00 AM trying to get it operational. Of course, the last thing I tried was your advice. Go figger.

So - yeah, DON'T try to program the toe switch on the expression pedal as an IALINK. Set set it to send the CC# of the IA switch you want it to toggle. It's counterintuitive, because it looks for all the world like you're programming it to send that CC# to the Axe-FX, but when the expression pedal type is set to IA Trig SW, apparently the JR hooks that controller and uses it internally. The software engineering equivalent of this, of course, is what we call "subclassing."

It begs the question of what happens if you want to use the same CC# for something else on the Axe. I haven't tested yet what the ramifications are in that case. If it was truly subclassed, it would send it on automatically. I'm assuming if you still want that CC# to go to the Axe, you'd have to add another command to the IA switch programming.

Anyway, good catch, Java. Thanks.

 

[FrankPrince]

Have tried using the editor and assigning the value in the CC parameter. Global-expression pedal setup-type = IA trigger. cc value - IA?

Sheesh...what an ordeal. Yeah, that did the trick, Java. First I had to get the Mission Kit-M; a momentary switch. Received that tonight, then spent until 5:00 AM trying to get it operational. Of course, the last thing I tried was your advice. Go figger.

So - yeah, DON'T try to program the toe switch on the expression pedal as an IALINK. Set set it to send the CC# of the IA switch you want it to toggle. It's counterintuitive, because it looks for all the world like you're programming it to send that CC# to the Axe-FX, but when the expression pedal type is set to IA Trig SW, apparently the JR hooks that controller and uses it internally. The software engineering equivalent of this, of course, is what we call "subclassing."

It begs the question of what happens if you want to use the same CC# for something else on the Axe. I haven't tested yet what the ramifications are in that case. If it was truly subclassed, it would send it on automatically. I'm assuming if you still want that CC# to go to the Axe, you'd have to add another command to the IA switch programming.

Anyway, good catch, Java. Thanks.

This may be a really stupid question, but I have thought of doing what you are doing with that type pedal and vol/wah. My only fear is that in the middle of gigging if I want to switch from volume to wah with the toe switch I would have to push the pedal all the way down, resulting in the full volume setting every time.

Any way around that?

 

[raz]

This may be a really stupid question, but I have thought of doing what you are doing with that type pedal and vol/wah. My only fear is that in the middle of gigging if I want to switch from volume to wah with the toe switch I would have to push the pedal all the way down, resulting in the full volume setting every time.
Any way around that?

No way of which I can conceive. There's no way to click that toe switch without maximizing the travel of the expression pedal. You'd have to use a different footswitch.

Reading between the lines here, seems you're probably using your volume pedal to give you a solo boost, so that normal volume is slightly less than wide open. I don't use the volume pedal that way. Instead, full volume is "normal" volume, and for boost I use a Mixer block at the end of my signal chain that limits normal volume to 90 or 95% and is triggered by another footswitch to flip to 100%. It's a trick I learned from the Wiki. I trigger the same "boost" when the WAH engages, so that the WAH lines come through louuder.

 

[Snagglefinger]

Have tried using the editor and assigning the value in the CC parameter. Global-expression pedal setup-type = IA trigger. cc value - IA?

Sheesh...what an ordeal. Yeah, that did the trick, Java. First I had to get the Mission Kit-M; a momentary switch. Received that tonight, then spent until 5:00 AM trying to get it operational. Of course, the last thing I tried was your advice. Go figger.

So - yeah, DON'T try to program the toe switch on the expression pedal as an IALINK. Set set it to send the CC# of the IA switch you want it to toggle. It's counterintuitive, because it looks for all the world like you're programming it to send that CC# to the Axe-FX, but when the expression pedal type is set to IA Trig SW, apparently the JR hooks that controller and uses it internally. The software engineering equivalent of this, of course, is what we call "subclassing."

It begs the question of what happens if you want to use the same CC# for something else on the Axe. I haven't tested yet what the ramifications are in that case. If it was truly subclassed, it would send it on automatically. I'm assuming if you still want that CC# to go to the Axe, you'd have to add another command to the IA switch programming.

Anyway, good catch, Java. Thanks.

This may be a really stupid question, but I have thought of doing what you are doing with that type pedal and vol/wah. My only fear is that in the middle of gigging if I want to switch from volume to wah with the toe switch I would have to push the pedal all the way down, resulting in the full volume setting every time.

Any way around that?

Sure. What I've done is set up my expression pedals so that toe down is off and heal down is fully on. It takes a little getting used to, but once you get it it's not a big deal. To set up your modifier that the pedal is operating, you need to put start and 100% and end at 0%. That way, you can click and click as much as you want without adding effect. I've found that most of the time it's easier to shut down the amount of effect for a moment to click the pedal than it is to bring in an effect you're not using for a moment to turn it on. This seems to work for all effects I've tried. The exception to this rule of course is using the pedal as a volume control which you will likely want full on when you are toe down.

 

[raz]

Sure. What I've done is set up my expression pedals so that toe down is off and heal down is fully on. It takes a little getting used to, but once you get it it's not a big deal. To set up your modifier that the pedal is operating, you need to put start and 100% and end at 0%. That way, you can click and click as much as you want without adding effect.

Well, yes, but he was talking about volume, and regardless of that, in your scenario where you run things backwards to how I do it - clever, btw - you're still dealing with an extreme of effect. In that heel down scenario, no, you aren't adding effect, but yes, you are removing all of it. Ultimately the same challenge, just a different sonic signature.

There is no conceivable way to utilize a toe switch on an expression pedal without maximizing (or in your case minimizing) the effect controlled by the sweep of the pedal. Now, if you use a second switch, you could conceivably decouple the sweep pedal from the effect it is controlling, such that you could then maximize the pedal travel to click on the toe switch without altering the effect. With my LF Jr I could do something like that, then have the toe switch recouple the effect and the sweep. Or one could just use the toeswitch to do something other than couple the sweep pedal to the effect it's controlling, such that a separate switch controlled the coupling and the toe switch did something else.

But with the expression pedal and the toe switch on the expression pedal alone, there is no conceivable way to click the toe switch without maximizing the sweep.

Best,

Raz